it makes sense... thanks for the clarification John. Data maintenance is a real pain point, and it is becoming worse with every release of the ITSM apps...not really BMC's fault, but because there is more data to deal with. A good example is CI based approvals. Creating all these approval mappings records is a bit of a punishment :-)
Driving functionality with data (the Remedy way) means the data needs to be there in the first place. Anything that can alleviate that is welcome. Now if you can come up with Kinetic Data Maintenance, that will be an instant winner !! -----Original Message----- From: Action Request System discussion list(ARSList) on behalf of John Sundberg Sent: Fri 10/02/09 2:50 PM To: arslist@ARSLIST.ORG Subject: Re: End of Life for BMC(R) Remedy(R) User (Windows-based client) Guillaume, I hear you -- and this is how I am thinking about the solution. Instead of going to a form(data) -- to do a function -- you go to a process -- to modify data. Example: BMC should come out with an application called "BMC Data Maintenance" -- to which you select your form -- and then it gives you raw data access to the fields -- to which filters fire etc..... So -- all the stuff like clear, copy to new, recent, blah blah blah -- could be added to the "BMC Data Maintenance" app It sort of is like building the common WUT stuff into a specific app -- and then gets rid of the common stuff in the rest of the app (clear/ copy to new/etc..) A nice side affect to my approach -- is as you think of new slick ways of modding data -- you can apply it to your app -- and then all forms would benefit. (sheeesh -- now I am letting my good ideas out --- ok - I am leaving the conversation) or maybe I should write it Kinetic Data Maintenance.... -- nice ring :) Make sense? -John On Oct 2, 2009, at 12:57 PM, Guillaume Rheault wrote: ** Hi John, All your points are valid as far using applications. However, for people that need to do data entry or data maintenance, for instance in the ITSM foundational forms (categorizations, locations, assignment, etc) , CMDB (attributes that are not discovered, as well as equipment tracked that is also not discovered), contract records, etc, it is very nice to have these features that are "closer to the database" (save searches, recent records, etc, etc). You just need to spend some time with the people that do this kind of work to see how they work.... -Guillaume -----Original Message----- From: Action Request System discussion list(ARSList) on behalf of John Sundberg Sent: Fri 10/02/09 1:44 PM To: arslist@ARSLIST.ORG Subject: Re: End of Life for BMC(R) Remedy(R) User (Windows-based client) I feel it is a great move. BMC (or others) will produce tools to fill gaps (alerts/reporting/ macros/printing) blah blah blah. In fact all those tools already exist -- they just may not yet be incorporated/integrated. (I would venture to say that there are already 1000x as many tools for our new user tool (the web) as exist for our current WUT) (I will guess approx 50 tools exist for the current WUT -- easily 50,000 tools exist for web stuff) Alerts -- growl/rss Reporting -- 100+ flash strategies + HTML5 SVG is getting better all the time Macros -- greasemonkey Printing -- ??? -- I forget what I use - but it works just fine. OLE/DDE -- client back to server -- back to client stuff -- would be doable -- if not you can solve the problem some other way altogether. I personally don't think the MT is a good web strategy -- but it too will have to change -- and again -- that is a good thing. (precache and very dynamic screens have issues and always will) -- more rigid screens will greatly improve things (FYI -- what Kinetic Request does) The MT is currently tasked with doing the same thing as the WUT but via the web. I think the whole paradigm is ripe for change. The WUT is a very "raw" experience and you can get quite close to the "database" (developers think that is good/power users think that is good/avg person is confused). I think the tools and applications need to raise up a bit and be more process oriented and more application oriented -- which by nature avoids the needs for things like: "saved searches" "copy to new" "clear" .... all those above functions should be done by the application and not the "user tool" -- because a saved search or a copy to new is really application specific. Example: copy to new -- do you want to copy all 100 fields (hidden ones) -- or only 5 fields -- the current will do all. saved search -- searches are just criteria -- the app should be able to provide that clear -- this has always sucked!!! I like that BMC is attempting to move the product in a direction -- good for them. You can't make everybody happy -- you can only do what you feel is the right way -- and sometimes it causes pain -- the goal is long term betterness. (made that last word up) Lets discuss at WWRUG... sign up here: http://kineticsr.kineticdata.com/kinetic/DisplayPage?name=WWRUG2009REGISTRATION -John On Oct 2, 2009, at 11:22 AM, Jarl Grøneng wrote: BMC Remedy AR System 8.0.00 is expected to be the last major release of AR System to include the Remedy User client. http://documents.bmc.com/products/documents/61/94/106194/106194.pdf -- Jarl _______________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE or access ARSlist Archives at www.arslist.org Platinum Sponsor:rmisoluti...@verizon.net ARSlist: "Where the Answers Are" -- John David Sundberg 235 East 6th Street, Suite 400B St. Paul, MN 55101 (651) 556-0930-work (651) 247-6766-cell (651) 695-8577-fax john.sundb...@kineticdata.com _______________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE or access ARSlist Archives at www.arslist.org Platinum Sponsor:rmisoluti...@verizon.net ARSlist: "Where the Answers Are" _Platinum Sponsor: rmisoluti...@verizon.net ARSlist: "Where the Answers Are"_ -- John David Sundberg 235 East 6th Street, Suite 400B St. Paul, MN 55101 (651) 556-0930-work (651) 247-6766-cell (651) 695-8577-fax john.sundb...@kineticdata.com _______________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE or access ARSlist Archives at www.arslist.org Platinum Sponsor:rmisoluti...@verizon.net ARSlist: "Where the Answers Are" _______________________________________________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE or access ARSlist Archives at www.arslist.org Platinum Sponsor:rmisoluti...@verizon.net ARSlist: "Where the Answers Are"
