<<<Assam will have to do it for itself. Take charge of its own future! >>>
That's what some people call Sovereignty
can we recall something I posted before;
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Welcome Aurobindo Beta , Why cant we settle our misunderstandings peacefully?What do you really want. What will make you Happy?
Sovereignty for
Why do you need?____ To feel like masters again of our lands raped by British Merchants. To sell our products to world direct. To control our lifestyle the way we like. To welcome whom we want , go where we like to .To live within our means and not be a burden on anybody. To retrieve our lands from the depredation caused by the British usurpers and by
Why Cant the Assamese be patient a bit longer---after all they are doing better than others? __India had ample time to do good . It is hopeless now and
What relation do you plan to keep with
Who will save you in need?_ _
What will happen to Indians working in Assam Cadres?__Interchange is possible. Those who would like to stay on why not? Similar examples are replete in ex-USSR.
What will be the status of others living there?__As per world norms existing.If not_as humans.
What about Loans, Dues, Assets, Pensions?___ These are simple accounting problems. We have done our homework on what
And our Capital Investments in
Can you be /survive as a Viable Sovereign Nation and economy?___ Churchill asked this of Gandhi and Nehru and Jinnah in 1941-2. Help us wholeheartedly to be just thatsincerely!
If Sovereignty is allowed how will
But present
But
From: Ram Sarangapani <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: ASSAMNET <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [Assam] Reforms - The CONCLUSION
Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 11:13:49 -0600
C'da,>One last time on these issues:I guess, we will to to agree to disagree on most of these issues.>Therefore it follows that Assam cannot depend on its intelligentsia establishmentWhich I can agree. But what I meant by an 'informed public' are really the people who are affected. The poor farmers etc are NOT to blame - but what about the educated in towns and cities who may not be the big-wigs, but can take control of what is being dished out by the 'intelligensia'?They are lawyers, home-makers, govt. employees, the businesses etc. who can actually make a difference.Their efforts and successes will have to flow thru to the poor, the farmers, the rickshaw pullers etc.>Assam will have to do it for itself. Take charge of its own future!Couldn't agree with you more.>You make the argument of other states prospering in spite of the dysfunctional Indian governance. >And thus you demand the same from Assam.>It is a preposterous argument. Imagine demanding an ill-fed, poor child of illiterate parents from the >slums same performance as children of IAS Babus or Engineers or Doctors because they go ,to >the same school. That is exactly what you are doing.That is overreaching, C'da. I am really trying to compare apples with apples. Even in the 'advanced' states, there are numerous examples where poorer sections and towns are getting ahead. The example of Vellore's Engg. success is but one example.What IAS babus?How is that 100% of Kerela is electrified or that they have a 100% education acheivement. Or that of similar other states where rural electrification is nearly 100%.What benefits do the IAS babus of Tamil Nadu, Kerela get from 100% rural electrification? Why is that inspite of acute water scarcity, many of the southern states have higher yields in agriculture, as opposed to Assam, which is endowed with so many natural resources.Why do the deserts of Rajasthan produce more than the fertile, arable valleys of Assam?You may know the answers to these - I certainly am intrigued.It is NOT just comparing for the sake of comparing or putting Assam DOWN in some way. But it is important to find out the causes.>The sickest needs the treatments most urgently.>Question is who will take charge of such reforms, NOW? The answer is that>there are plenty of people, right in Assam--and outside too, to take it on. Ready, willing and able.C'da - this is NOT something that people with Assam's interest at heart JUST discovered. So, where have these take-charge people been all these years. And, if you care, can you list these brave souls? All Assamese should give full support to these ready, and willing people.I may be stupid, but even I find it difficult to identify ONE SINGLE entity that have taken up this task of reformation to fruition. Their personal affiliations, personal wealth, politics have always won those efforts - reforms be damned.Whether it the ULFA, the AASU, the GOA, other groups, or other intelligensia, the results have always been the same. In the end, the common people have been duped too many times.We need more groups like the RVC that IS DOING something, and as you said, inspite of great challenges.>But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. That is the difference.Ah! yes, the big clincher!. The ULFA, for instance doesn't follow the Indian script of mis-governance.What have they done in 25 + years to make the lot of the common, poor Assamese better.And, again, that same prevailing Indian rule is equally appilicable to tiny, non-descript, powerless places like Nellore, Vellore, places in Rajasthan. No, we ARE NOT comparing Mumbai city with Nalbari or Narikol Baasti.But, thanks, it is good excercise at least to discuss these problems, even if we want to go about it in differently.--Ram
On 1/3/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram:
One last time on these issues:
>But you must agree that ANY reform in India or Assam MUST come from an informed >public.
*** Yes I do. And that is exactly why I asked for YOUR recommendations, Rajen's recommendations. But what did you show?
Therefore it follows that Assam cannot depend on its intelligentsia establishment, the supposedly informed lot, the one that controls the media, the economy and the political machinery -- and even its purported cream of the crop of NRA's in the west.
Certainly not on its uninformed, uneducated masses, struggling merely to survive against the incredible odds, while their assets, resources are being plundered and looted by India and partially being redistributed to a tiny minority of Assam's privileged.
But that does not mean Assam ought to wait for India to effect the reforms that it had decades to start with and demonstrate a trend. It did did not, because it cannot. Assam will have to do it for itself. Take charge of its own future!
You make the argument of other states prospering in spite of the dysfunctional Indian governance. And thus you demand the same from Assam.
It is a preposterous argument. Imagine demanding an ill-fed, poor child of illiterate parents from the slums same performance as children of IAS Babus or Engineers or Doctors because they go ,to the same school. That is exactly what you are doing.
Assam's circumstances are not the same as Karnataka's, or Tamil Nadu's or Bihar's. Assam must do what it needs to under its own circumstances, and not what Karnataka does or West Bengal does.
Assam must REFORM and RE-order its governance for its own sake, because it is essential for its survival and progress, regardless of what India does or does not.
And even if I were to accept your argument -- which I don't--that some Indian states are prospering in-spite of their broken governance, it still makes no sense for Assam to labor under it--because its circumstances does not give it that luxury. If Rajen or your assertions are accurate that Assam is the most corrupt of the various colonies of India, then it behooves it needs those reforms, NOW!The sickest needs the treatments most urgently.
Question is who will take charge of such reforms, NOW? The answer is thatthere are plenty of people, right in Assam--and outside too, to take it on. Ready, willing and able.
But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. That is the difference.
c-da
At 1:54 PM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:C'da>That Ram is called accountability. It is DETERRENCEI fully agree its a major component. The laws do exist for such punishment, and they would be implemented at a much faster speed if the 'public', the media and others are on top it it and expose corrupt individuals and till punishments are rendered. Jail time for those stealing public funds always existed. Politicians & the powerful have been able to thwart legal proceedings by employing corrupt practices and circumventing and undermining the system.With the resent cash for questions, the media having exposed these powerful politicians, they have been expelled. The CBI and the Auditor General's office are now contemplating civil actions against the culprits. At least the national media is keeping on top of it. And things are NOT that easy for the errant Delhi politician.> Remember when ULFA executed a few of those officials how Assam was all agog?. And I was >told -- it is second hand info, I was not there -- that there was a visible reduction of demands for >bribes and suchProbably so, and goo too - but it didn't last long, did it? As soon as people found out that all the ULFA was trying to do was corner the market on thieving. All that did was replace the regular thieves with the 'patroitic' thieves for a while, till people found out the extent of their patriotism.But more importantly - even murdering a few corrupt did nothing to DETER corruption on a permanent basis, did it?>Undertake a major reform of the laws of the land. Throw most of them out.Good suggestion. Agreed. But do you also think such demands must come from a population who is uder the yoke? Why would you assume the corrupt to take it upon themselves to undertake such reforms and in the process kill the golden goose?Why can't the AASU, and the other various student bodies and the opposition and even ULFA make sure the corrupt get the message and in strong terms - or else. Where are these patriots when we need them? Why can't Assam's intellectuals and writers fill up the media with stories of corrupt and paste the photos of corrupt politicians and bureaucrats?Could you guess why nobody is interested?>Reform the court systems. Decentralize them. Give powers to resolve disputes to local bodies. >Let simple issues be decided according to traditional ways. Dispose of pending cases>and make sure cases get heard and resolved in a reasonable time frame.Again, a very good suggestion, I am all for it. Who will do the reforming? And why should there be any reform without suggestions coming from a silent population?>And make sure politicians cannot order them around-- by making the EXECUTIVE branch >INDEPENDENT of the legislative - the elected cadres.I have got to hand it to C'da - you are at your best, and that too all this without demands for independence.It is indeed a great idea. But you must agree that ANY reform in India or Assam MUST come from an informed public. A public that makes sure it is not a part of the problem, a public that has a long-term memory, a public that will not take it lying down, and a public that is willing to take to task by employing the media, public interest lawsuits, the voting machines and other forms of protests.The biggest fear of a politician is keeping the 'gadhi' and reelection. If the gadhi is at stake for small crimes, they sure as heck will become squeaky clean, real fast.>I am sorry to say this Ram: Your advice on this matter has no use for Assam, or India.Heh! heh! heh! C'da - what can I say, that is the best I can give - even on good days :)--Ram
On 1/2/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram,
You repeated a whole bunch of vague generalities, hoping for some miracle to change attitudes. You did not have a single practical, achievable means to suggest, like a functioning governmental system MUST have.
Let me give you another clue: What is happening to Tom DeLay? And what happened to that very powerful Rep. Dan Rostenskowski of Chicago? Or the Governor of Connecticut last year? If you don't know, the latter two are in prison. Why? Corruption in office.
That Ram is called accountability. It is DETERRENCE. Accountability brings deterrence. Indian governance has no means for holding anyone accountable. There is no deterrence. Even if an official is prosecuted, he would live happily ever after knowing that he can keep delaying any action, even if it gets heard in his lifetime, until he is long gone.
The other alternative is INSURGENTs' justice. Remember when ULFA executed a few of those officials how Assam was all agog?. And I was told -- it is second hand info, I was not there -- that there was a visible reduction of demands for bribes and such. People were all very supportive of ULFA's justice. But it is NOT a dependable system is it? And then came the Indian military, and now the military officers run drugs from Myanmar under official cover. Heard of that Ram?
Or would you prefer partisan dictatorial rule a-la Indira Gandhi's Emergency, when corrupt officials without political cover all of a sudden turned law abiding, and trains were running on time?
What you should have known and recommended were things like:
Undertake a major reform of the laws of the land.Throw most of them out. There are too many now that empower corruptofficials and deter law abiding citizens.Reform the court systems. Decentralize them. Give powersto resolve disputes to local bodies. Let simple issues bedecided according to traditional ways. Dispose of pending casesand make sure cases get heard and resolved in a reasonable time frame.Completely revamp police -- re-train them as SERVANTS of the people,not their bosses, empowered to dispense summary justice. Give themequipment, a salary to make a living without stealing, hire educatedcadres who are able to investigate and aid prosecution. And make surepoliticians cannot order them around-- by making the EXECUTIVE branchINDEPENDENT of the legislative - the elected cadres.
That would bring the issue of making enlightened and effectiveenforceable laws. Indian election system does not allow that. Reform itto allow able people to get nominated, funded and elected.
You catch my drift Ram?
And if you could have shown how all these could be effected under Indian rule, your protestations would have carried some water. But you could not. I don't know whether you are really unaware of how it is done or you resorted to the pithy platitudes to justify your pre-determined answer. Neither is good.
I am sorry to say this Ram: Your advice on this matter has no use for Assam, or India.
c-da
At 11:35 AM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
C'da,
>That the govt. is inefficient, the people are corrupt. Only thing you did not repeat is that the >Assamese are lazy too
I am surprised. I have never said people are LAZY. You may have drawn some implications or confused me with someone else. But thats OK - I have had words put in my mouth before :)
>About Govt. corruption.
C'da - it is NOT just Govt. corruption. Corruption is all too pervasive, at least in the major cities and towns of Assam. It is come to such a pass, that nothing works till palms are greased. People take it in their stride and for granted. Cost of doing business?As for insurgents - who initially came out like Robin Hoods, turned out to be mostly hoods.Lastly, and the sad part is that Assam is often cited as a great example of inefficiency and corruption. While there is also corruption in other states, the levels are much, much lower, the govts. far more responsive to citizenry needs, and law & order is maintained pretty well in a number of states.
>How do you see the citizenry deal with it?
I have written before - my guess would be a drastic change in attitudes, viewing responsibilities, froming citizen groups (there are some already in Guwahati to deal with some problems, and they are having success), making sure politicains and the corrupt, and the inept are given full coverage in the media (like a Tehelka) and expose corrupt ministers and bureaucrats, and even elections - they work sometimes and a fresh set of ministers will be more careful in corrupt practices.
But saying that its all the GOI's fault and the only salvation is some sort of severance is really not a solution .Once our house is in order, I am with you all the way to hold the GOI/Center to keep their end of the bargain and also teach them a thing or two about able governance.
--Ram
And how will the good citizens deal with such a menace
On 1/2/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ram:
I am perfectly willing to go right along with you, and hold GoA's feet to the fire. But I don't know how. Just like all the other people in Assam that would like to do just that. That is why I asked you, I asked Rajen to show all these people complaining and rebelling and seeking to re-orient Assam governance and other such unpatriotic stuff.
And so I was hoping for a no-nonsense action plan from you about how to go hold GoA's feet to the fire.
All you gave us the same old same old. That the govt. is inefficient, the people are corrupt. Only thing you did not repeat is that the Assamese are lazy too and so deserve what they get. But that must have been a slip :-).
Let me give you a little help here. Take the one subject no-one disgrees with here: About Govt. corruption.
How do you see the citizenry deal with it?
Surely they go to the polls, vote in great numbers, eliciting desi-demokrasy-devotees' cries of --see how democracy is working -- accolades.They even vote some them out, leading the political class ( not to mention NRA political observers) to declare -- SEE there is accountability, they get voted out. Was Indira Gandhi not voted out too?
But what good has that done about abating corruption?
So tell us how an intelligent, well informed person like yourself, who has seen one of the best managed democracies in the world at work for decades, will go about holding GoA's feet to the fire, and take corruption on, USING the tools that desi-demokrasy gives you.We shall be all ears! And if you cannot tell us, then face the fact that your protestations do not hold any water .
c-da
At 10:15 AM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
C'da,
>So, your gripe is with pointing fingers at GoI.
Not at all. But when we do so, it might be fair to point some of those fingers inward - toward Assam as well. We do need to have some sense of introspection.
>But GoA derives its existence and its powers from Goi's doings and in its image
That is one fine way of avoiding responsibilties and giving Assam a pass. Yes, in the present system, Assam, like every other state, depends on Central funds or laws for continuing its governance. You may not like the system, and that is OK, but given that all states go thru the same thing, why is it that states like Assam & Bihar are clubbed togther and often cited as inefficient states?
But we have seen - time and again, funds to Assam are grossly mis-appropriated, and the left over funds that could not be, are returned to the Central pool. There is probably little accounting for the Centrally allocated funds, but probably no accounting for state collected funds like sales tax or duties.
Politicians and the powerful in Assam (for all the drumbeatings) have little or no integrity left. The state is one of the most corrupt. One person, I talked to said proudly, defending the 'State of the State' this way " nohoi, aaji kali kisu kaam hoi - aagote, 80% poisa khai diya, kintu, aaji kali, 60% man khai".
As I said earlier, it is pretty common to hear people say that NO ONE that is anyone is Assam is really interested in solving her problems. If problems are solved, the revenue sources dry up. Thats not good!
The Center too is NOT interested, because - heck the state representatives don't really care, so why should they. They can go pay attention to some whining state like Bihar. Whatever is said in public is usually for the birds.There are very, very few powerful people left who are actually thinking about the state and her people (and not themselves). And even if some of them may see independence as a solution, at least one can attest to their integrity and selflessness.
So, it really doesn't matter WHAT type of Govt. there is at the Center. The %age of poisa khua may reduce a little, but khobo kintu thik! Just a matter of degrees!
That is the express reason, why the GOA's feet must be held to the fire. Going around Guwahati, one finds dilapidated roads, buildings and amenities. Most of the places resemble big slums. Even institutions like the Gauhati University, which we were so proud of, show signs of continual neglect and decay.The GU professors don't get paid on time (they get paid around the 10th or 15th). On pay days -there is huge rush at the bank - its like first come first serve (if you come last, you may not get paid).
School teachers are not paid sometimes for months or even years. College teachers and government employees get paid every so often. So, why would we expect govt. employees tecahers etc to work, when the chances of them getting paid are slim. Their only pickings are 'bhaira poisa' - and why NOT? And for teachers, it is 'tuition'. Bhaira tuition is big business these days. Talking to some teachers, one told me, that the big thing is to somehow get a teacher sakori, (preferably 'subject teacher' even if it pays low (RS. 1500 or so) at the begining. But once in, the teacher can make big money by tuition only. Once entrenched, all they have to do is show up for a couple of hours.
Bottomline is we can paint a GENERAL picture that the system of govenance needs to be changed (more power to states etc). That may actually be very good for some states, who are performing wonderfully even though they have the same handicap - the central governance.But for a state like Assam, such a change may actaully push it into some deep chasm.
IMHO, Assam first needs to show that IT CAN manage its own affairs efficiently. She should be able to show that corruption and inefficiency is eradicated. Our people should be able to demand more from their representatives, and not sit by taking whatever is dished out. Yes, everyone can play a positive role and make the state a much better place.
And then, we can all hold our heads high and tell the GOI and the Center to take a hike and ask them to follow the example we have set. Until then, I don't we have much of a leg to stand on.
--Ram
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