Tim, Thanks for writing back. Those are good points. On the SASYNA listserve (to which I was also responding), this issue has gone from being a debate, to being a 1-sided crusade (imho), and I just wanted to make sure that bikies got a fair shake at all of the facets of the argument.
I would be happy to be part of a group that asks the Co-op to hold off on a Jenifer St. egress until just before the construction begins and then only uses the egress temporarily, on an as-needed basis. BTW, I would like to begin a new thread some time to brainstorm on convenience-driving, and how we as bikies can help others see that biking can be convenient too (no traffic jams, less road rage, better route options, etc.). There is a lot wrapped up in that word "convenience" that keeps folks who usually drive to the store from biking there (many unfounded and a few founded fears, the right bike and gear, physical endurance, patience, planning, etc.). In cycling solidarity, India On 09/05/10, tim wong <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi India, > > Thanks for writing. It seems almost instinctual to assume that since the > Coop lies between two streets that if access to cars is lessened on one > street that they should automatically be allowed to use the second street, > even if that is the route used by bicyclists, pedestrians, and bus riders. > > > > > I don't agree. Just because some people "need" to use cars, gigantic boxes > (compared to the room taken up by the driver--I'll attach the graphic for the > few people in Madison who haven't yet seen it: > http://www.unep.org/geo/geo4/media/graphics/Zoom/2.06.jpg) that take up a > bunch of room--and I say "need" because for every one who has a legitimate > reason to drive to the coop, there is at least one who does it out of habit > or "convenience," doesn't mean that we automatically maximize their > opportunity to continue driving during the reconstruction chaos, and turn > Jenifer St. into a busy commercial street. > > > In addition to the reasons why we shouldn't turn a popular bicycle street > into a car-clogged street are what I see as the logistical nightmare of what > happens if the coop actually does build this two-way driveway. I'm pasting > this in from another e-mail I sent earlier, in case the flow seems somewhat > inconsistent: > > > 1) there is no strong evidence that access to the Wmson St. parking lot > will be any worse for cars during the reconstruction than now; in fact, > it might be easier in that traffic will only be coming from one > direction, so pulling in and out WILL be easier. (I picketed in front > of the Coop for an hour and a half during rush hour, and I have to say that > even though > traffic might have been > lighter on this particular Friday, cars had NO problems getting in or out of > the parking lot. There are lulls due to the stop lights; stopping the > left turns out took away most of the delays and congestion.) > > 2) If the Coop > is allowed to build its driveway, especially now, nine months before the > reconstruction even begins in 2011, if it even starts then, it will be a > disaster for the Marquette neighborhood in general and Jenifer St. > specifically. For instance, once the driveway is built, do you think > ANYONE in a car will even try to enter from Williamson? No, they'll be on > Jenifer because (they think) it's easier. The bike/ped entrance from > Jenifer will functionally cease to exist, between the congestion, the > fumes, and all the other negatives cars bring to a narrow space. The > Coop will probably have to abandon all those parking spots on the west > side of the store, as you can't have two-way traffic and cars pulling in > and out > constantly. It is a nightmare waiting to happen. > > At a minimum, the Coop should be talked out of any driveway construction > until the spring of 2011. > > I am working with other people to minimize the disruption to the neighborhood > and businesses, in part by channeling through traffic over to East Washington > where they probably belong (and which will definitely be faster, especially > during reconstruction). If car traffic on Williamson is less, there will be > less incentive to use back streets as an alternate route. > > > > > tim > > > > > On Sun, Sep 5, 2010 at 10:42 AM, India Rose Viola > <[email protected](javascript:main.compose()> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tim & all, > > > > > > > > Just wanted to chime in to say that there are multiple view points on this > > issue, even among bikies. > > > > > > > > Some years back, the neighborhood was against the Co-op putting a bicycle > > egress onto Jenifer Street as well. > > > > > > > > Because of the impending construction that will tear up Williamson Street > > next year, the Co-op will need to have an alternate entry/exit for cars > > into their lot. It is debatable, but I am under the impression that the > > driveway in and out of the Co-op lot onto Jenifer Street could be a > > practival temporary solution. In order to comply with city code, it cannot > > be a temporary-seeming driveway (i.e. gravel, dirt, etc). It has to be > > paved and finished in order to be used by cars. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I bike to the Co-op to do my shopping, but I don't think that everyone can > > or should bike. I would love to see more people walking, biking, and > > taking the bus more of the time. I also understand that different people > > have different transportation needs. The Co-op does not have a very large > > parking lot considering it's customer base. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what the alternatives are for the Co-op as far as access to > > their lot during construction. I haven't heard of any creative ideas that > > make it so that an egress onto Jenifer Street can be avoided. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I understand the plight of neighbors on the 1200 block of Jenifer Street, > > and as a commuter that bikes down Jenny St. every weekday in both > > directions, I am not excited about the increase in traffic that a driveway > > to the Co-op will incur, but I also understand why this temporary driveway > > is necessary. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The co-op is a major reason why Willy St. is as vibrant and successful as > > it is. Yes, people drive to the Co-op. But if the Co-op weren't within > > walking distance to the entire Willy St. neighborhood, a lot of folks who > > are disgruntled about folks driving to the Co-op would find themselves > > driving to a grocery store in a different neighborhood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Food for thought. > > > > > > > > -India Viola > > > > > > > > On 09/04/10, tim wong <[email protected](javascript:main.compose()> wrote: > > > > > > > > > As some of you bicyclists, especially those on the east side, might have > > > heard, the Coop, against the strong opposition of neighbors and those > > > attending a meeting on August 16th, are forging ahead with their plans to > > > build a 20-foot road from the west side of the coop parking lot onto > > > Jenifer St. This, of course, will dramatically increase traffic on the > > > already busy Jenifer St. and endanger all of us. See below the various > > > actions you can take. In addition, I have attached a copy of the > > > petition that is being circulated, starting today at 4:30, where we will > > > be distributing brochures against the driveway, having petitions. Yard > > > signs and eventually T-shirts will be available. Hope to see you there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Contact me off list or write to > > > [email protected](javascript:main.compose()(java_script:main.compose(). > > > See you there. > > > > > > > > > > tim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Bikies mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.danenet.org/listinfo.cgi/bikies-danenet.org -- India Viola Stretton Lab 115 Zoology Research 1117 W. Johnson St. Madison, WI 53706 608.262.3336 "How can we learn from our mistakes if we don't first acknowledge them?" -Anonymous _______________________________________________ Bikies mailing list [email protected] http://lists.danenet.org/listinfo.cgi/bikies-danenet.org
