[uucdigest]         Wednesday, March 15 2000         Volume 03 : Number 450



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In this BMW UUC Digest:

       [uuc] Pros and Cons on Coilovers
       [uuc] <E28> Lighting
       [uuc] RE: PSEUDo M5 for sale
       [uuc] M motors, east and west
       Re: [uuc] M motors, east and west
       Re: [uuc] radar detectors
       [uuc] Big Jim
       [uuc] re:carbotech panthers
       Re: [uuc] RE: PSEUDo M5 for sale
       [uuc] Compact Axed As BMW Readies New Z2 
       [uuc] Re: duPont Registry WOB
       Re: [uuc] Status of S52 Engine in M Coupe
       [uuc] Re: <E30> Shocking Suspension Questions
       [uuc] Re: [uucdigest] V3 #446
       [uuc] Thanks to all for info on V1 and other detectors!!

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 15:34:10 PST
From: "Manuel Paredes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Pros and Cons on Coilovers

I was in a perfomance shop yesterday and saw an HR coilover set.  From what 
I understood this system is soft enough to absorb road distortions and yet 
strong enough to support spirited or agressive driving.  I would love to 
hear some comments from people who have these on their cars.  Are they worth 
all the $$$??  They are more expensive than the Bilstien/HR set up but if 
they are better performance wise I might think of buying them.  Thanks!!

Manuel Paredes
95 325i sharked, x-ed, M3mflrd
L.A. BMWCCA
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Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 15:33:01 -0800
From: Shiv Sikand <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] <E28> Lighting

Hi,

Anybody using the Hella 71156 and 71456 headlamps in their E28's ?

Do the Hella Xenon 78117 and 78150 bulbs work well with these lamps ?

Thanks,
Shiv
'88 M5

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 18:41:43 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [uuc] RE: PSEUDo M5 for sale

Not to be rude (but I will) If you find someone to pay you a $100,000.00 or 
that car let me know, I have a big red bridge in San Francisco to sell them!

Brian Jacobs
98 318ti
99 Z3 coupe
Everglades CCA
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

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Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 11:01:39 +1100
From: "Thomas, Andrew j" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] M motors, east and west

Aleksandr ([EMAIL PROTECTED]>) writes:

> Look, the Euro car is factory rated at 5.4s, the 
> US car is rated at 5.1s. Gearing helps.

Certainly. Broadly the test results are about even - still, not a bad result
at all by the drivetrain department. Bear in mind that European times quote
0-62.1 mph (100 km/h), which apparently does make quite a difference.

> From what I can figure, the Euro car (and it's 
> 316hp, at least according to my figuring 
> (236kW = 316hp) 

316 hp (SAE) but 321 bhp (DIN) is the quoted figure, relevant to the markets
in which is it sold. Perhaps kW should be used across the board? (My word,
never thought I'd find myself saying that).

> Does anyone with a Euro car know what redline is?

The redline is 7,400 rpm, where maximum power is produced; the rev-limiter
is set at about 7,700 rpm. I've seen the former, but not experienced the
latter.

> I really want the Euro motor and the US gears...
> but I'll be patient.

Perhaps the final drive will be different, but the gearbox the same this
time. Also note that the new M3 will have ASC, whereas the 236 kW M3 did not
have ASC+T, even as an option. Whether this was limited by technology or the
marketing department, I don't know.

Andy T

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 16:18:55 -0800
From: Aleksandr Milewski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [uuc] M motors, east and west

At 11:01 +1100 on 000316, you commanded the electrons to create a 
missive titled "[uuc] M motors, east and west":
|Aleksandr ([EMAIL PROTECTED]>) writes:
|
|> Look, the Euro car is factory rated at 5.4s, the
|> US car is rated at 5.1s. Gearing helps.
|
|Certainly. Broadly the test results are about even - still, not a bad result
|at all by the drivetrain department. Bear in mind that European times quote
|0-62.1 mph (100 km/h), which apparently does make quite a difference.

If you assume acceleration is linear, it's a 5.22 0-60. Acceleration 
isn't linear, though, so the Euro car might well be faster to 60. I 
just had this conversation on another list, and I caught it there, 
but not here. Oops.

|316 hp (SAE) but 321 bhp (DIN) is the quoted figure, relevant to the markets
|in which is it sold. Perhaps kW should be used across the board? (My word,
|never thought I'd find myself saying that).

So the related question is, are the kW ratings net (like US specs are 
required to be) or gross?

|The redline is 7,400 rpm, where maximum power is produced; the rev-limiter
|is set at about 7,700 rpm. I've seen the former, but not experienced the
|latter.

Hmmmm... And the new motor turns to 7900? Hmmm....

|> I really want the Euro motor and the US gears...
|> but I'll be patient.
|
|Perhaps the final drive will be different, but the gearbox the same this
|time. Also note that the new M3 will have ASC, whereas the 236 kW M3 did not
|have ASC+T, even as an option. Whether this was limited by technology or the
|marketing department, I don't know.

And final drive I can change. BTW, my M Coupe has ASC. (And the US 
spec 2000 2.8 Coupes have DSC)

- -Zandr
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Aleksandr Milewski                                     BMWCCA #166568
SysAdmin, 530i.org                                      '95 540i/6spd
[EMAIL PROTECTED]                                     '00 740i Sport
Ben Lomond, CA                                            '00 M Coupe

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:19:40 -0400
From: Steven Schlossman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [uuc] radar detectors

At 9:46 AM -0500 3/15/2000, Cagann, Alexander wrote:
>I am fully aware of the greatness of the V1.  However, I would be very
>pleased if Mike would make a V1 that you could integrate into the car like
>the old K40 unit I have.....with the box in the front grill and little
>display above the steering wheel.  I know the V1 has the remote display, but
>you still have to have the unit hanging inside the car.  I'm anal with
>respect to having the interior organized neatly.

I asked them the same thing. I'd love to have a stealth detector.
I was told it wouldn't be as effective as what the V-1 is now and Mike
won't compromise the effectiveness. But I wish it came with some carrying
case.

...steven

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 16:20:44 -0800
From: "KKiely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Big Jim

Hey You Guyz,

Notice that now that Jim C is married? we don't get his curmudgion comments any
more? Man I miss the Big Guy.
Ain't it just like marriage to screw up the "Club".

- -Kevin

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:29:27 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [uuc] re:carbotech panthers

I would have to respectfully disagree regarding these pads for Sebring. I 
went through a new pair of panthers at Sebring winterfest friday to sunday. 
Inboard pads were metal on metal at the last run on Sunday - I stupidly had 
disabled the wear sensors because I was to lazy to make them fit. Outboard 
pad had about 1/4" - inboard pad 0.0" and they bent in a U-shape. Had to use 
the runoff before the hairpin on the last lap of the last session in a 318ti. 
If you talk to the guy who makes and sells the pads, a very nice fellow by 
the way, he will tell you he does not recommend them for endurance use at 
Sebring. He has some other pads he feels are better for  Sebring - don't 
remember the name. Put some Jurids in till the next school. Just some food 
for thought, but then I was really "using" the pads. They do stop well, but 
at $125 bucks or so you should bring an extra pair and I would dig out enough 
of the pad material so that you can make the stock wear sensor fit for a 
safety margin. Won't do that again - didn't expect the inboard pad to have so 
much more wear than outboard.

Bart H.
318 Club Sport for track
325iC
325iA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 16:35:30 -0800
From: Jim Ochi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [uuc] RE: PSEUDo M5 for sale

At 06:41 PM 3/15/00 EST, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Not to be rude (but I will) If you find someone to pay you a $100,000.00 or 
>that car let me know, I have a big red bridge in San Francisco to sell them!
>
>Brian Jacobs
>Everglades CCA

Hey, hey, hey - leave our bridge alone!! Since you're in the Everglades
chapter, maybe you should try selling a theme park designed around a mutant
rodent and his flash-frozen creator... :-)

Jim Ochi
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:43:44 +1100
From: "Thomas, Andrew j" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Compact Axed As BMW Readies New Z2 

>From Auto Express in the UK (see www.autoexpress.co.uk for the whole story):

15/3/2000 - BMW has been thrown into turmoil after company bosses ordered
that the next generation 3-Series Compact must be ditched and replaced by a
small sports car, labelled the Z2. According to insiders at the German firm,
managers at the highest level are unhappy about the costs and performance of
the new Compact. The car was due to be launched early next year, but the top
brass have called for feasibility studies on making a smaller, sportier car
to rival the forthcoming Mercedes SLA. The death knell sounded for the next
Compact after BMW's management board drove the new model during winter
testing shortly before Christmas. With the car only months away from launch,
no problems had been anticipated, but insiders claim the board was far from
impressed, and immediately ordered a rethink.

The main problem was with the manner in which the car drives. Based on the
chassis of the current 3-Series, it was certainly refined, but not
considered sufficiently sporty to attract younger buyers. Larger bodywork
also meant the new Compact was 150kg heavier than the current car, blunting
the entry-level 1.8-litre engine's already weak performance.

...

The project - dubbed E46/5-S within BMW - is set to become the Z2 and will
be ready to launch in the autumn of 2002. To reduce costs, it uses the
platform and engines of the axed Compact, which fixes the wheelbase, engine
mounting points and windscreen position. In spite of this, a team led by the
Z9 concept's designer, Chris Bangle, has succeeded in making the Z2 look
stunning, either as a practical 2+2 coup� or a two-seat roadster.

The chassis will be tuned to give sporty responses, in an attempt to counter
criticism that BMW has become too staid, and attract younger buyers back to
the fold. In another cost-conscious move, engines were taken off the shelf,
but still promise lots of performance potential. The cheaper models will be
powered by the new generation of four-cylinder motors built in the UK and
shared with Rover. A 2.3-litre unit from the facelifted 3-Series will also
be offered, and a 2.0-litre turbodiesel will be sold in some markets, but
not the UK. Later in the car's life, BMW's M-Sport division will get its
hands on it, and the result is sure to worry even Porsche - a 2.2
four-cylinder engine is planned, giving 240bhp.


"This email is intended only for the use of the individual or entity 
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notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this 
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immediately by return email or telephone +61 2 9335 7000 and destroy 
the original message.  Thank you."

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 21:12:41 -0500
From: "Tim Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Re: duPont Registry WOB

>>A Supersprint exhaust improves sound, but also added over 50 hp
>>and 60 ft./lbs. of torque, giving it a total output of over 350 hp and 385
>>ft./lbs.!

Uh, yeah, right. "Over 50 HP" from an exhaust. Gee where can I get one.

Tim T

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 18:53:33 -0500
From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [uuc] Status of S52 Engine in M Coupe

I don't have actual numbers for BMW's.  I've done a pretty complete analysis
on other cars, including rotational inertia, so I was making some
generalizations to illustrate a point.  A P-car for instance with high rear
weight bias, or a 4wd will be able to use a lot more power.

Gary Derian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


>
> |Gary - nice summary, saying about what we were saying - 0-60 times
> |(realistic US use) will be very simular or the same..
> |
> |BTW - have any numbers for the original subject vehicles? M-Coupes??

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:14:24 -0800
From: Randy Walters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Re: <E30> Shocking Suspension Questions

Scott D Miller  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>> I am contemplating upgrading the springs and shocks on my 1990
>> 325i. A fellow club member (only 3 miles from my house, no less!)
>> offered to sell me his used E30 M3 stock springs at a price I
>> cannot refuse.  Of course, I need shocks/struts to match.  I've
>> been happy with Bilstein Sports in the past (E24, E28), so I
>> thought that is the way I'd go.  The car currently has 325is 
>> springs (stiffer, not shorter than 325i springs) and Bilstein 
>> HDs from my previous car, a 1987 325is (R.I.P.).
>> 
>> Conventional wisdom (often being neither conventional nor wise)
>> says that the HDs are for cars that are at or very near stock 
>> ride height, while the Sports are for cars that have been lowered
>> oh, say more than 3/4 of an inch.  Thus my assumption was that
>> the Sports would be the way to go.
>Scott,

alex f wrote:
>FWIW, a local very fast autocrosser has been running his E30 M3 with
>Bilstein HDs for years. So HDs definitely work with stock E30 M3 springs. 
>If they are better or worse then Sprots, I can't say.
>alex f

Scott again:
>Hi Mike, thanks for the report.  Opinion is running about 50/50 right now  to
>either go with Sports or stay with HDs.  I know I would not be unhappy with
>Sports.  I'm having mixed feelings here.
>
>Point:                  Get the Sports.  Just do the whole job one time.
>Counterpoint:   Jane, you ignorant slut.  Oh wait, wrong counterpoint.
>Counterpoint:   Save money.
>
>The jury is still out.  Plus, there is still the question as to whether the
>shocks/struts for the M3 are different, or the same, as the rest of the E30
>line.  Some vendors list them as the same part number, others list different
>part numbers.
>Scott Miller
>GGC BMW CCA #44977
>1990 325i/isH

 Scott,  i've run the E30 M3 springs temporarily on my 89 325is with 
Bilstein Sports,  and i can say with confidence to use the longer 
Heavy Duty's instead if you intend to run the M3 springs forever
and have no intention of eventually upgrading to aftermarket
Lowering Springs later on down the road.   The only reason i
used the Sports with the M3 springs is because i knew the M3
springs would be temporary while i sought more info on E30
Lowering Springs (i was new to E30's then).  I later went to
H&R Lowering Springs then finally to Ground Control adjustables,
and i've had the same Bilstein Sports throughout the spring changes.

 The M3 springs will only lower your 325i about a half inch all around,
(maybe slightly more in front) and that's not enough of a drop to justify the 
Sports.  They should really be used when you go beyond, say, a one-inch 
drop and i don't suggest them for use with M3 springs.   During some 
autocross runs,  it was reported by my VW friends and a few course 
workers that my Bimmer was pulling the inside rear tire off the ground
entering some of the corners on course.  The car also had a 22mm RD
front swaybar and Kumho race tires on the stock 14" Cross-Spoke wheels.

 Other than this pulling-the-inside-rear-tire-up situation on the autocross
course,  the Sports caused no other problems in street or fast canyon
driving other than feeling a little too firm for the relatively soft M3
springs.  I won't say you absolutely should not use the Sports with
the M3 springs,  but i'd say the HD's are way more suitable.  The
valving between the two is supposedly the same,  with the Sports
being a little shorter at full extension.  When i placed them alongside
my stock Boges,  i seem to remember they were almost two inches
shorter at full extension.   The part number on my rear Sports is
F4-B36-2027-HO (2-pack box).  Front:  F4-P36-0335-HO (1-pack).

 The Sports don't extend as far as the stock shocks do so what happened
was the soft M3 springs allowed the outside front corner to dip deeply
which lifted the opposite corner higher than the Sport would extend,
thereby pulling the tire off the tarmac briefly when the shock reached
full extension.   Everybody was razzing me saying that i just can't break
my trademark Volkswagen habit of lifting my inside rear tire in every 
corner :-) 
 
 If you're curious about ride height changes,  my PhotoPoint BMW Album
has captioned pics of the car on various springs (Stock, M3, H&R, & GC :-)

Randy Walters
89 325is DSP
85 GTi FSP
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=153582&a=1200064

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:35:35 EST
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [uuc] Re: [uucdigest] V3 #446

<< Ultimate fast? Nope - but dare you to drive the current M-Coupe for
 long at it's top speed of 135 mph anywhere in the US on public
 roads.. you'll be slapped in jail real-fast-now.. >>

that's why i only do it in short blasts!!!  and if i get pulled over,, when 
asked why were you going 150+ miles per HOUR, i will just explain that i 
wasnt planning to be out that long.  miles per hour.  get it???  anyway,, be 
safe and have fun
tommy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:45:46 -0500
From: "Benjamin R. MacRAE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [uuc] Thanks to all for info on V1 and other detectors!!

Wow!  It took me an hour to read all the responses to that post!!!  Thanks
greatly to all who replied, all advice was well taken and the consensus
seems to be that one is better off to save up the pennies for a V1 than
waste cash on a lesser "detector".  

Well, since I dont speed anyway, I'll just save up until I can afford a V1
someday, only, of course, for the "cool" aspect, adding to dash clutter,
etc....not to actually use it <g>.  Heck, I probably wont even plug it in
(ha ha).....maybe just buy an empty casing from Mike Valentine for $75 and
everyone would think it was the real thing.......ah, the possibilities are
endless...


Thanks again to all, and Happy Motoring!


Ben

------------------------------

End of [uucdigest] V3 #450
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