[uucdigest] Wednesday, March 26 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6249
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Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |__________________________________________________________________ In this BMW UUC Digest: RE: [uuc] JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH [uuc] Re: Now Motronic adaptability [uuc] Re: JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH [uuc] Re: [E36] street/track pads [uuc] [E36] street/track pads Re: [uuc] [E36] street/track pads Re: [uuc] 4.10 diff needed [uuc] FS: E30 tan door panels 84-91 325 318 Re: [uuc] Re: Now Motronic adaptability ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 15:52:13 -0500 From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH What's this washing cars thing everybody's talking about? I seem to barely have enough time to keep the damn things running, none the less wash them. Lee 88M3->comes back from Tim Ng shiny.... 01 Saab 9-3SE->one of them, unwaxed, cars..... > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 3:36 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [uuc] JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH > > > > > > That's OK. The majority of the people I work with have > _never_ waxed their cars - and these are definitely not 300k > mile beaters. > > People just don't know any better. I had to teach my 32 year > old friend how to wash his car a few weeks ago. > > - John S. > > > --- On Wed 03/26, Chris Marino < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: > From: Chris Marino [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:50:07 -0800 > Subject: [uuc] JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH > > I'm sure we've all heard of these stories. To that end, my > disclaimer<br>is that I wash my cars by hand and am well > aware of car wash debauchery.<br><br>Today, I took my friends > (beater) 77 320i to the car wash. He doesn't<br>care. The > car has 319,000 miles and is (literally) a beater. > That<br>being said, I watched, in amazed horror as one car > after another<br>received their version of an 'all cars > washed by hand' wash.<br><br>There sits this grimy > hard-bristled brush that he keeps, idle, in a<br>bucket > filled with filthy brown (somewhat soapy) water. I watch as > the<br>"hand washers" continually use this filthy brush on > everyone's car. The<br>brush is used to wash the car by > hand. While there, I watched as a<br>Mercedes 600, a Land > Rover Discovery and a Porsche 993 all got the 'hand<br>wash > treatment'. <br><br>I inquired, to the manager, if he > thought that using that brush on the<br>car might cause some > paint damage to the paint. His response?<br><br>Ready for this? > <br><br>"No sir. We change that water (that the brush was > in) every two to<br>three > days."<br><br>!!!!!!!!!!!!<br><br>Nnnnnnnnooooooooo!<br><br>If > anyone is interested in avoiding this establishment, it is > in North<br>Hollywood, CA. one block east of Magnolia and > Cahuenga.<br><br>Chris<br>89 M3<br>01 X5<br><br> > > _______________________________________________ > Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com > The most personalized portal on the Web! > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 12:58:12 -0800 (PST) From: John Bolhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: Now Motronic adaptability I've been puzzling over this for some time. I think it was Alex F who successfully argued me into believing that there is no full throttle adaptation (e30 motronic era) and that the safest setting possible for open-loop operation was the motronic's stored fuel map known to produce adequate results. Yet this means that engine breathing improvements (everything from cone filter on up the scale), if successful, result in nothing but a leaner full throttle fuel mixture, which is only good if it was too rich to begin with, and quite possibly worse as it leans out toward stoichiometric. But then, many of my opinions are formed with incomplete information, so set me straight. On Wed, 26 Mar 2003, Brian Daley wrote: > I don't know whether Motronic uses this strategy or not, but the > Ford EEC IV and V ECU's adapt in closed loop. The learned > correction factor is applied in both closed and open loop. > > Brian Daley > I think there is no adaptation that affects full throttle > operation as that is open loop. Idle air, part throttle fuel map, > evap purge and cold enrichment are the adapted settings. > > If anyone has data to disprove this, I will happily change my > opinion. > > Gary Derian - -- "It is an honor to be Cookie Monster." -Sesame Street spokeswoman Audrey Shapiro ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 17:23:19 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] Re: JACKASSES AT THE CAR WASH Chris Marino writes: << inquired, to the manager, if he thought that using that brush on the car might cause some paint damage to the paint. His response? Ready for this? "No sir. We change that water (that the brush was in) every two to three days." !!!!!!!!!!!! Nnnnnnnnooooooooo! >> Now THAT made me laugh......simply amazing isn't it...some people just don't get it. Especially astounding for a car wash employee. Wash it in your driveway ONLY! <g> John Weese BMW CC #76646 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 14:24:35 -0800 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] Re: [E36] street/track pads Mark, unless you brake extremely hard on the street or haven't made it out of the C group at driving schools, I would suggest that you need 2 sets of pads. There is no pad that is good for both environments. The R4s for the track are a great choice. But to work at all well, they need to be more than just warm. The pad temperatures you're likely to see in street driving won't even come close. Just my 02 cents, Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA >Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 14:6:22 -0600 >From: "M Kittock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [uuc] [E36] street/track pads > >I currently have the 'red' performance Pagid pads the Bav. Auto used to >carry. A local club member uses them on his E36 M3 and recommended them. >I only ran one DE on them and while they worked OK, they had a bit more >fade than the Porterfield R4 pads I used on my 944 turbo (when I had it). >I've thought of putting the R4's on but while they worked just fine for >street driving on the 944 turbo they did squeak a bit... I've thought >about the Pagid Sport blue pad also, but like the R4 is spendy. > >So, what about some of the other pad choices I've seen thrown around? Like >the EBC Red, Hawk HP Plus, Carbotech P or P+; these all seem to rated for >street and track duty and priced reasonably for track capable pads. Do >these wear well? I know Hawk warns of greater rotor wear - what about the >others? I know Pagid Race pads can leave deposits on the rotor - what about >these? Any other choices I'm missing? > >I hope to run 4 DEs this year (only did one last year). So I'm not looking >for a pure race pad, but one I can drive on year round. But I'm not >opposed to swapping pads before and after events, just a but lazy about >it... > >I appreciate whatever experience with these you can share. I know this >topic has been discussed at length, I probably even save some of those >discussions - but that would be on my pc that got hit by lightning :( >Please reply directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >TIA > >Mark Kittock >'96 328i Sport Pkg; 17"OZ,H&R Sport, X-brace,Turner Motorsport bars ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 17:30:51 -0500 From: "Gaudio, Stefano" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] [E36] street/track pads I have used the stock Jurids and Hawks HPS on my '98 M3 in the intermediate group @ the Glen & New Hampshire IS with no issue. Both Jurids and Hawks performed quite well. No brake fade. The rotor did not wear much at all w either. The hawks are so thick that they will certainly last quite a while. They were both under $65. Everything was great until I rode passenger in a euro m3 with floating rotors and race pads. Now I crave them but they are $150+ , wear faster, eat the rotors, and are noisy so I'll stick w less aggressive pads for a bit longer... Stefano - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 14:6:22 -0600 From: "M Kittock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] [E36] street/track pads I currently have the 'red' performance Pagid pads the Bav. Auto used to carry. A local club member uses them on his E36 M3 and recommended them. I only ran one DE on them and while they worked OK, they had a bit more fade than the Porterfield R4 pads I used on my 944 turbo (when I had it). I've thought of putting the R4's on but while they worked just fine for street driving on the 944 turbo they did squeak a bit... I've thought about the Pagid Sport blue pad also, but like the R4 is spendy. So, what about some of the other pad choices I've seen thrown around? Like the EBC Red, Hawk HP Plus, Carbotech P or P+; these all seem to rated for street and track duty and priced reasonably for track capable pads. Do these wear well? I know Hawk warns of greater rotor wear - what about the others? I know Pagid Race pads can leave deposits on the rotor - what about these? Any other choices I'm missing? I hope to run 4 DEs this year (only did one last year). So I'm not looking for a pure race pad, but one I can drive on year round. But I'm not opposed to swapping pads before and after events, just a but lazy about it... I appreciate whatever experience with these you can share. I know this topic has been discussed at length, I probably even save some of those discussions - but that would be on my pc that got hit by lightning :( Please reply directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] TIA Mark Kittock '96 328i Sport Pkg; 17"OZ,H&R Sport, X-brace,Turner Motorsport bars ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 15:14:37 -0800 (PST) From: Jason Knight <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] [E36] street/track pads I was searching for the same thing, and decided on the Hawk HP+s. I was warned that they squeal, and this was absolutely true. They seemed to squeal less after a couple of hours on the track, but that was just my impression, so I wouldn't bank on that. Braking on these things is definitely superior to the pagids that were on there before, these two pads being the limit of my experience (at least on cars that matter). That said, I'm taking these pads off this weekend, and putting the pagids back on. The pagids had been on the car for 16 months, including 8-10 track hours, and still have quite a bit of pad left. Changing pads doesn't take long, and I don't care for the squealing. As another lister mentioned, two sets is a good idea. I can't address what the HP+s do to rotors. Jason - --- M Kittock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hawk HP Plus, Carbotech P or P+; these > all seem to rated for > street and track duty and priced reasonably for > track capable pads ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 19:47:20 -0500 From: "RAGS 535" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] 4.10 diff needed Mario; We have a 4.10 unit here in fla.I THINK it's an LSD.Can check that tomorrow if you're in a hurry. RA/Bob Gilbert/REDLINE BMW >From: "Langsten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: "A BMWUUC Digest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [uuc] 4.10 diff needed >Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 21:47:51 -0500 > >I am looking for a 4.10 diff that fits an E30 E28 E24 chassis, It does not >need to be a LSD, but does need to be a functioning unit . . . > >please reply directly > >or call > >Mario L. >www.VSR1.com >603-228-2888 > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 16:55:16 -0800 (PST) From: Kyle Sanchez <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] FS: E30 tan door panels 84-91 325 318 I have some tan door panels that I need to get rid of. The door panels are in good shape $65 /w free shpping anywhere in the USA. Boxed ready to ship! To see pictures of the door panels: <http://home.attbi.com/%7Erj.dk.sanchez/LEFT.FRONT.DOOR.PANEL.jpg> <http://home.attbi.com/%7Erj.dk.sanchez/RIGHT.FRONT.DOOR.PANEL.jpg> <http://home.attbi.com/%7Erj.dk.sanchez/REAR.LEFT.PANEL.jpg> <http://home.attbi.com/%7Erj.dk.sanchez/RIGHT.REAR.PANEL.jpg> Thanks Kyle Sanchez Pleasanton, CA 94588 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 20:01:31 -0500 From: Brian Daley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: Now Motronic adaptability That depends on how airflow is measured. My knowledge of E30's is extremely limited, but if the E30 has a mass airflow meter it won't go lean. The increased airflow will be measured and simply result in selecting a higher cell on the fuel map. If the E30 infers (rather than measures) air mass entering the engine based on RPM, Load, Air temp, Barometric pressure, etc. then mods that improve the volumetric efficiency will cause the engine to go lean because it can't tell that more air is flowing. For a MAF system the basic process is this: 1) The MAF reports the actual mass air flow. 2) The DME looks at the fuel map and determines the appropriate amount of fuel to deliver for that airflow under the current conditions. 3) If applicable, a correction factor is applied to the commanded fuel. The correction factor has no effect on what value is selected from the fuel map, so it can only fine tune, not compensate for gross errors. Brian John Bolhuis wrote: > I've been puzzling over this for some time. I think it was Alex F >who successfully argued me into believing that there is no full >throttle adaptation (e30 motronic era) and that the safest setting >possible for open-loop operation was the motronic's stored fuel map >known to produce adequate results. > Yet this means that engine breathing improvements (everything from >cone filter on up the scale), if successful, result in nothing but a >leaner full throttle fuel mixture, which is only good if it was too >rich to begin with, and quite possibly worse as it leans out toward >stoichiometric. > But then, many of my opinions are formed with incomplete information, >so set me straight. > > ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6249 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . 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