[uucdigest] Monday, June 23 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6499
_________________________________________________________________ | | Search the ARCHIVES: | http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | Visit Richard Nott's Ultimate BMW Database: | http://www.bmwdatabase.com | | For all available Digest commands including unsubscribe/subscribe, | visit the BMW UUC Digest page: http://www.uucdigest.com | | Send SUBMISSIONS to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Complaints? Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you must. | Technical Problems? Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |__________________________________________________________________ In this BMW UUC Digest: re: [uuc] E36 Control arms, bushings, + another black art. Re: [uuc] knock sensor location on E36? RE: [uuc] E36 Control arms, bushings, + another black art. [uuc] Thoughts on the 944 RE: [uuc] <e36><m3> Track Pads Re: [uuc] Thoughts on the 944 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 10:53:10 -0700 From: jkerouac <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: re: [uuc] E36 Control arms, bushings, + another black art. re: E36 Control arm and bushing install: To get the bushings to pop onto the end of the control arm more easily, _Freeze them solid, the colder the better. When as cold and solid as a hockey puck they pop right on. Also _freeze the control arms too. Heavily coat the contact surfaces with silicone spray. Wrt the use of //M3 control arms rather than standard E36 or E30 units, there is no difference in geometry. The //M arm has a harder longer lasting ball joint. Currently I have one 95 //M arm and one regular E36 arm on my car. When aligning I found no difference from when I had both arms the same type. As long as you're taking a go at the front end geometry, here's another black art that gives a free tenth of a degree additional negative camber. Especially in a Stock class, every little bit makes a difference: Loosen the three nuts at the top of the strut. Pop the upper mount studs free in the mounting holes. Push inward on the upper mount so the studs now are all the way to the inside of the holes in the strut tower. Retighten nuts. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 13:03:11 -0500 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [uuc] knock sensor location on E36? "Mike Gambini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Anybody replace their knock sensor(s) on E36's? Yes. Major PITA because you have to take off the intake manifold to get to the sensors. With access slave child labor, you might be able to get to the front sensor with the manifold in place. I emphasize _might_. > I have a 93--325i with a JC chip, and it exhibits ping when the weather > warms up. About 117K miles. Been through all the troubleshooting, > including several emails with Jim C. No vacuum leaks, new plugs, several > carbon cleaning treatments, etc. I'm wondering whether to replace my > knock sensors. Unless you are getting a knock sensor CE, they are probably OK. Given the magnitude of the job (aka 4-16 hours of contortion), I would not touch them unless absolutely necessary. alex f ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 14:08:00 -0400 From: "Chris Baker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] E36 Control arms, bushings, + another black art. Correct, no difference in geometry, only in the solid mounted ball joint. The geometry difference comes with the '95 bushing, which is not only solid but offset. My toe after the install was -.95 degrees on the drivers side and -.8 degrees on the passenger side. Now much happier with a little toe-in. Chris B. Also discovered that I buggered the rear toe last summer doing trailing arm bushings, despite my best efforts. - -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of jkerouac Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 1:53 PM To: [uucdigest] Subject: re: [uuc] E36 Control arms, bushings, + another black art. re: E36 Control arm and bushing install: To get the bushings to pop onto the end of the control arm more easily, _Freeze them solid, the colder the better. When as cold and solid as a hockey puck they pop right on. Also _freeze the control arms too. Heavily coat the contact surfaces with silicone spray. Wrt the use of //M3 control arms rather than standard E36 or E30 units, there is no difference in geometry. The //M arm has a harder longer lasting ball joint. Currently I have one 95 //M arm and one regular E36 arm on my car. When aligning I found no difference from when I had both arms the same type. As long as you're taking a go at the front end geometry, here's another black art that gives a free tenth of a degree additional negative camber. Especially in a Stock class, every little bit makes a difference: Loosen the three nuts at the top of the strut. Pop the upper mount studs free in the mounting holes. Push inward on the upper mount so the studs now are all the way to the inside of the holes in the strut tower. Retighten nuts. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 14:13:25 -0400 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] Thoughts on the 944 Bless his soul, but my brother-in-law, lets call him Stu, wants to buy a car for better gas mileage and wants something "sporty" to boot - he is looking at a 1985 Porsche 944 (no turbo). His primary vehicle is a Disco and he has an old BMW motorcycle. Now the blue book is $6K, but this car was pampered and only has 15K miles (on a 1985 model). Garage kept, seat covers since new, etc. etc. The owners want $15K, the bank will only lend $6. First thought - $15K is ridiculous for a 1985 I'm not a big fan of the 944 family and I've heard some horror stories. They are a mess to fix if broken. The engine is in the front. Horsepower is similar to my fiance's 318 Ti. Granted a car with 15K miles should fair well over the years - I don't know about the 944. Any thoughts, suggestions, comments, etc.?? Phil ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 11:23:34 -0700 From: "Kelvin Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] <e36><m3> Track Pads My racecar is an awd Eclipse, and I've had good luck with the Porterfield R4E's. I'm far from being the fastest driver in the world but my R4E's usually last about 4-5 open track days with 1-2k street driving to and from the track. Many people have had similar experience with the R4's wearing down too quickly and have had good luck with the R4E's. - - Kelvin > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Donn Vickrey > Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 7:41 AM > To: Money, Jack (J.J.); '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: RE: [uuc] <e36><m3> Track Pads > > > Hi Jack > > Thanks for your feedback. Perhaps it would help if I could > provide a little > more context. I've never had a problem being outbraked - not > in my previous > series any how (Spec RX7). And unfortunately, I can't tell > you a thing > about the new T2 car as its maiden voyage is this coming weekend. > > I've just never liked the blues. Call it personal > preference. But, pad > feel was IMO poor (compared to some other pads I've tried) > and they used to > eat Spec RX7 rotors at a ferocious pace. Still, they were > the only pad that > lasted the entire race in the Spec 7. So, I used them anyway > for about five > years. > > My philosophy on brake pads is that you want just the right amount of > harshness (my term for how hard it is on rotors) to best suit > your driving > style, car, setup, and track. Based on these variables, the > "best pad" will > vary somewhat. > > Unfortunately, I didn't have much luck with the Porterfields > on the Spec 7 > either. Twice, on two different tracks (both the hardest on > brakes in our > division), new pads wore completely down before the end of > the day. So, I > gave up on those... At least for the 7. > > Strangely enough, in my only track sessions in an M3 (a few > years ago in my > street car at the time), I ran a completely stock car (even > stock pads) on > the harshest track (for pads/rotors) and had no trouble at > all. The brakes > held up well. Unfortunately the rotors warped... But that's > another story. > > Any how, I am always looking for an alternative to the blues. > If that's all > that will work on the car, then so be it. But, if others > have had success > with another pad, then I may try it just to see if I can get > the combination > of attributes that I'm looking for. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Money, Jack (J.J.) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 6:54 AM > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'; '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: RE: [uuc] <e36><m3> Track Pads > > > Donn, > > I find it surprising that you want to move DOWN in pad compounds but I > suppose I don't know your situation so I can't say for sure. > > But, to answer your question, if you think the Blues are too > much pad I > would highly recommend trying the Porterfield R4. It's a > great intermediate > to advanced level pad. However, depending on application, I > would not race > on it, I just don't think it's strong enough personally. And > frankly, a > T2/IS M3 is a heavy car as far as race cars go. > > The HT-10's that many have recommended are the cat's ass I > think (haven't > tried the HT14 or HT15, I think my car is too light for them > and I don't > have much downforce to speak of) but they're a step above the > Blues, both in > torque and temp range. If you feel the Blues are too much pad now you > certainly don't want the HT10's or higher, you'll wear them > out faster and > they'll kill your rotors. > > My suggestion is to reevaluate your braking technique. Are > other racers in > your class consistently outbraking you? What are others > running for pads? I > would check with your competition, assuming they're friendly on info > sharing, and figure out where you're at compared to them. > Are you running a > biased pad set up...meaning a lighter compound in the rear > vs. the front? > What happens when you go into a corner too hot...do you push > or does the > rear end want to come around? What about high speed > transition corners > where you require just a tap of the brakes....does it cause > the car to be > very unsettled? Perhaps brake pad bias can help you. > > How about some more info about your tracks, your car set up, > etc. Good > discussion, I'd love to continue it! > > Jack Money > '89 325iX > #86 JP M3 ----> brakes just fine for a stock class car > Elephant Motorsports > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donn Vickrey [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2003 12:40 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [uuc] <e36><m3> Track Pads > > > Acck. I always forget at least one question. I'd also like > to get some > opinions on track pads. I'm currently running Hawk Blues. > I've run them > for years on other racecars but am not completely crazy about > them as they > are pretty hard on rotors. Unfortunately, they were the only > thing that > worked consistently on Spec RX7s. > > What other pads have M3 racers had good luck with. The > tracks around here > are pretty easy on brakes. So, I probably can go with a > slightly milder > compound than the Blues. > > Thanks in advance. > > Donn Vickrey > Scottsdale, AZ > 98 IS/T2 M3 race car > 02 996TT daily driver > 03 Navigator tow vehicle and tot hauler ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 14:37:14 -0400 From: Michael Lawrence <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Thoughts on the 944 Unless your brother was born in a 85 944, married in one and then had his first child in a 85 944, there is no reason to ever spend that much on a plain 944. Plus, they changed the dash in 85 1/2, you want the latter for sure. Look around for a 86-87 944, plenty out there, same price range, sub 7k etc. My roommate has a 87 944 and it is kinda fun to drive. plus it does get about 30mpg on the highway. It is NOT a 16valve S model. But the 944S (16 valve) lacked low end torque and didn't feel any faster due to that. They are relatively easy to keep running and not that expensive. But there are some parts that can be, like door latches, locks, they are not identical VW parts. With a set of good shocks, it is still one of the best handling cars out there, and makes for a fun daily driver. I was also shocked with the ride quality, not bad at all like I was expecting. If I were looking for a decent daily driver that was fun, it would either be a 86-88 944, 94-95 325i/is or E30 325i in great shape. All return decent gas mileage, with a few mods can be relatively quick and agile, plus easy to work on. Also, the Gen II RX-7 was a great car, almost a twin to the 944. Don't know what the used market looks like and I hardly ever see a clean RX7 anymore, so I don't know how they hold up. But I bet they do exist and were a blast to drive, great handling car. Mike - ----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 2:13 PM Subject: [uuc] Thoughts on the 944 > Bless his soul, but my brother-in-law, lets call him Stu, wants to buy a > car for better gas mileage and wants something "sporty" to boot - he is > looking at a 1985 Porsche 944 (no turbo). His primary vehicle is a Disco > and he has an old BMW motorcycle. > > Now the blue book is $6K, but this car was pampered and only has 15K miles > (on a 1985 model). Garage kept, seat covers since new, etc. etc. The > owners want $15K, the bank will only lend $6. First thought - $15K is > ridiculous for a 1985 > > I'm not a big fan of the 944 family and I've heard some horror stories. > They are a mess to fix if broken. The engine is in the front. Horsepower > is similar to my fiance's 318 Ti. Granted a car with 15K miles should > fair well over the years - I don't know about the 944. > > Any thoughts, suggestions, comments, etc.?? > > > Phil > > ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6499 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . BMW technical information, special tool sales/rental | http://www.koalamotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | |==================================================== | Turner Motorsport Inc . The Ultra-High Performance BMW Specialist | 207 Elm Street, Amesbury, MA 01950 | 978-388-7769 / fax 978-388-4202 | http://www.turnermotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning | and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! | 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com |__________________________________________________________
