[uucdigest] Thursday, July 31 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6619
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Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |__________________________________________________________________ In this BMW UUC Digest: Re: [uuc] Re: M2 Re: [uuc] M2 Re: [uuc] M2 Re: [uuc] M2 [uuc] M2 (value retention) Re: [uuc] M2 [uuc] Re: M2 RE: [uuc] M2 (value retention) RE: [uuc] M2 RE: [uuc] Re: M2 Re: [uuc] M2 Re: [uuc] M2 Re: [uuc] M2 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 14:57:45 -0400 From: "Bill Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: M2 "Robert Phelan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> manages to insult both Swedes and Norwegians in one sentence: > Speaking of Nordic drivers, whatever happened to UUC's most colorful Norwegian? > He pops in and out of a number of lists including occasionally this one. He can consistently be found expounding and philosophizing on the 1st list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Bill Matthews Hockessin DE 00 M Geeze some Volvos other cars ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 12:00:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Jason Knight <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 Was this question rhetorical? Either way, my data only goes back to '89, but the e30 m3 was 34950 that year. In random order, rounded to nearest thousand: E30 M3 34950 Audi 200 Wgn Quattro 37000 MB 190E (Baby Benz) 32000 Land Rover Country 37000 Peugeot 505 Turbo (loved those!) 26000 Saab 900 Conv Turbo 32000 Acura Legend Cpe LS 30000 And for kicks, let's look at 95: E36 M3 35800 A6 Sdn Quattro 32100 MB C280 36300 Land Rover Country 45000 Peugeot NLA Saab 900 Conv SE Turbo 37990 Acura Legend Cpe LS 43200 Numbers from NADA. Jason - --- Gary Derian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > What other cars could one buy in 1988 for $35,000? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:13:24 -0400 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 Rex wrote: >The inflation calculator says: > What cost $35000 in 1988 would cost $45646.79 in 1995. > What cost $35000 in 1988 would cost $53204.71 in 2002. >http://www.westegg.com/inflation/index.html Also note that the 325iX also cost $33-34K way back when, and BMW seems to keep that trend up, the E36 M3 LTW stickered for $49,000, I know I saw some sitting around as late as '97. Friend picked one up for a steal at $32K brand new. >The 1995 M3 definitely was a great value. I will be on the hunt for >another '95 M3, hopefully, next year. Yup, especially now that you can get one for as low as $12,000 or $13,000 if you get a high mileage one. That dang E30 M3 still fetches that same $12,000 or 13,000 for excellent condition ones. >1996 BMW M3, SCCA SFR Solo II Street-Mod Light (as in lightly modified) #173 Lightly modified? Where's the turbo or the supercharger, gotta keep up with the Tunnells. :-) - -Carlos 91 M3 88 iS <--she's about to blow, saw copper in the oil today ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:23:25 -0400 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 Thanks. I think the MB 190E-2.3 16 was quite a bit more than the E30 M3. The sticker on both my E34's was sky high. $58K for the M5 and $47K for the 525iT. It is a real treat to drive such expensive cars for way less money than they were new. Gary Derian > Was this question rhetorical? Either way, my data > only goes back to '89, but the e30 m3 was 34950 that > year. > > In random order, rounded to nearest thousand: > > E30 M3 34950 > Audi 200 Wgn Quattro 37000 > MB 190E (Baby Benz) 32000 > Land Rover Country 37000 > Peugeot 505 Turbo (loved those!) 26000 > Saab 900 Conv Turbo 32000 > Acura Legend Cpe LS 30000 > > And for kicks, let's look at 95: > > E36 M3 35800 > A6 Sdn Quattro 32100 > MB C280 36300 > Land Rover Country 45000 > Peugeot NLA > Saab 900 Conv SE Turbo 37990 > Acura Legend Cpe LS 43200 > > Numbers from NADA. > > Jason > > --- Gary Derian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > What other cars could one buy in 1988 for $35,000? > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:39:44 -0400 From: "Michael Wendell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] M2 (value retention) Peter Zidlicky wrote: > that said, name a car of a similar > vintage that has maintained 33% of > its original sticker ??? 1984 Renault 5 Turbo2 original sticker: just under $22000 (grey market) current selling price: around $15000 m. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 12:47:07 -0700 From: Rex Tener <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 At 03:13 PM 7/31/2003 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >Rex wrote: > >The 1995 M3 definitely was a great value. I will be on the hunt for > >another '95 M3, hopefully, next year. > >Yup, especially now that you can get one for as low as $12,000 or $13,000 >if you >get a high mileage one. That dang E30 M3 still fetches that same $12,000 >or 13,000 >for excellent condition ones. I have found some pristine under 30K mile 1995 M3's in the $24K to $27K range, which is about $5K to $7K over my budget for such a car. > >1996 BMW M3, SCCA SFR Solo II Street-Mod Light (as in lightly modified) >#173 > >Lightly modified? Where's the turbo or the supercharger, gotta keep up >with the Tunnells. :-) Yeah, that is why my 1996 M3 will be replaced with a 1995 M3. The Street Mod displacement limit for supercharged cars is 3.0L. Damn it, I knew I should never sold my '95 M3 to a list member!!! Just kidding Jason, I know it went to an excellent home. - -- Rex Tener [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1996 BMW M3, SCCA SFR Solo II Street-Mod Light (as in lightly modified) #173 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 13:02:51 -0700 (PDT) From: david kroth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: M2 Gary wrote: > What other cars could one buy in 1988 for $35,000? 3 Ford Escorts? 4 Dodge Omnis? 2 Chevy Camaros? ===== David Kroth [EMAIL PROTECTED] __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:31:14 -0400 From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] M2 (value retention) What do you think the 2-3 grey market E30 sport evos will fetch on the open market??? > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Wendell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 3:40 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [uuc] M2 (value retention) > > > Peter Zidlicky wrote: > > that said, name a car of a similar > > vintage that has maintained 33% of > > its original sticker ??? > > 1984 Renault 5 Turbo2 > original sticker: just under $22000 (grey market) > current selling price: around $15000 > > m. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:37:37 -0400 From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] M2 You should amend this by asking what cars could you buy that offered this level of performance? The problem is that most people will fixate on the 0-60 times (about 7 seconds) which is an almost pointless test in performance--unless you're drag racing. Thing is for $35k you could get a car that won a lot of Firehawk (i.e. with nearly stock cars) races against high-hp Z28's & $50k 944S2s. For orignal purchase price against the comparable (performance-wise) 944S2, the M3 was a bargain. Even 15 years later, the car offers performance better than many (maybe most) new cars. Lee > -----Original Message----- > From: Gary Derian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 2:16 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 > > > But car prices have not kept up with inflation recently. Car > inflation was > very high during the 1980's, especially European brands. > Once the Japanese > went upmarket, the Euro guys got serious about competing. Since then, > prices have been pretty flat. > > What other cars could one buy in 1988 for $35,000? > > Gary Derian > > > > > > >The reason the E30 M3 never sold well is that is cost THIRTY-FIVE > THOUSAND > > >DOLLARS IN 1988. That's a TON of money for a car like > that. Compare > that > > >to the E36 M3, which cost the same amount seven years later. > > > > The inflation calculator says: > > > > What cost $35000 in 1988 would cost $45646.79 in 1995. > > > > What cost $35000 in 1988 would cost $53204.71 in 2002. > > > > http://www.westegg.com/inflation/index.html > > > > The 1995 M3 definitely was a great value. I will be on the hunt for > > another '95 M3, hopefully, next year. > > > > > > -- > > Rex Tener > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > 1996 BMW M3, SCCA SFR Solo II Street-Mod Light (as in > lightly modified) > #173 > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:39:31 -0500 From: "Malcolm Reitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] Re: M2 And a Porsche 924 in a pear tree... Malcolm '88 M5 - more than $35,000 in 1988 '98 328i - -----Original Message----- From: david kroth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 3:03 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] Re: M2 Gary wrote: > What other cars could one buy in 1988 for $35,000? 3 Ford Escorts? 4 Dodge Omnis? 2 Chevy Camaros? ===== David Kroth [EMAIL PROTECTED] __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:39:01 -0400 From: "Eurowerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 Matt, Other than the six speed gearbox, you are describing my 69' 1602. Not quite 8000 rpm's, but I have seen 7500 regularly. I do have the euro close ratio 5 speed though! :) Kirk A. Gilchrist EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair 8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 888-522-0271 toll free > > The "take good motor, chop off 2 cyls" worked great in the original M3. > There's no reason to think it wont work now. > > Give me something the size of a miata that handles like a bmw, makes > north of 200hp and 160ft/lbs, weighs under 2500lbs. Add a redline of at least > 8000 rpm, 4.10 or better gears, and a 6 speed gearbox... > > Matt > 88 M5 > '07 M2 ? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:40:34 -0400 From: "Eurowerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 How about the Chatterham Super Seven? Kirk A. Gilchrist EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair 8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 888-522-0271 toll free > > I used to want a 2000 lb 2 liter car, but I am happier with my 3800 lb 3.6 > liter car when I'm playing SUV tag in traffic. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:43:50 -0400 From: "Eurowerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] M2 I have run against the S2000's several times at several different locations and can tell you without a doubt that they don't stand a chance against the trusty 1602 up until 125 mph. Not handling, braking, or acceleration. The sound they make though is hard to duplicate. That 9000 rpm sound is almost music. And I only have about $5000.00 invested in the 02' :) Kirk A. Gilchrist EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair 8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 888-522-0271 toll free > > > > Give me something the size of a miata that handles like a bmw, makes > > north of 200hp and 160ft/lbs, weighs under 2500lbs. Add a redline of at > least > > 8000 rpm, 4.10 or better gears, and a 6 speed gearbox... > > The M2 exists. It's called the Honda S2000. :-) > > It's the size of a Miata, handles very well, 240 hp (40 more than you > requested), 153 lb/ft of torque (pretty close to the 160 lbft you spec'ed), > redline of 9000 rpm, and a six speed gearbox. The only spec that's out of > line is the weight of 2800 lbs. Given all the safety equipment required > today, it's tough to imagine a US-legal car getting much closer to 2500 lbs. > If you were dedicated enough, it wouldn't be that tough to get it down to > 2700 lbs, maybe 2600 if you worked at it. > > > ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6619 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . BMW technical information, special tool sales/rental | http://www.koalamotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | |==================================================== | Turner Motorsport Inc . The Ultra-High Performance BMW Specialist | 207 Elm Street, Amesbury, MA 01950 | 978-388-7769 / fax 978-388-4202 | http://www.turnermotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning | and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! | 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com |__________________________________________________________
