[uucdigest] Wednesday, August 6 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6629
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Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |__________________________________________________________________ In this BMW UUC Digest: Re: [uuc] <E30> differential repair questions RE: [uuc] <E30> differential repair questions RE: [uuc] Please recycle your BMW [uuc] Re: E36 seat mount measurement specs RE: [uuc] Please recycle your BMW [uuc] <FS> Three miscellaneous catalogs [uuc] Tire Poll [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears RE: [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears Re: [uuc] Tire Poll Re: [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2003 21:48:44 -0400 From: "Stan Jackson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] <E30> differential repair questions Maybe so, but it certainly wouldn't be the first time you were correct! Stan > From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > The E46 M3 has a gerotor limited slip. It is not a viscous coupling but a > hydraulically applied clutch. Hydraulic pressure being generated by tire > slippage. I though the first application of a gerotor limited slip was the > front axle on Jeeps ca. 1995. > > If not, this isn't the first time I've been wrong. > > Gary Derian ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2003 22:17:22 -0400 From: "Stan Jackson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] <E30> differential repair questions Owning several 325iX's, I *should* have a better answer for you. What I can tell you is that both the transfer case (center diff) and the rear diff are viscous. Replacing the viscous coupling (which provides the limited slip ability) in either is NOT feasible. Can be done, but will cost a fortune. IF the viscous coupling can be found, figure $500-$1200 for the coupling and then add labor. As best as my memory recalls: On Diff #2, if you cannot turn the output flange at all (when holding the input), there is a problem. The VC should make it difficult, but not impossible. Try again, realizing a slow turn is the goal. On the other hand, I don't recall being able to turn the input shaft as easily as Diff #1. Stan > Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2003 18:28:08 -0400 > From: "Pharr, Jeff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: RE: [uuc] <E30> differential repair questions > > Brett, thanks for the info. > > I just had another go at the diffs and here is what I found. > > Diff 1: > 250K miles on a diff from a manual iX. Turning the input shaft takes > about as much effort as spinning a wheel hub. And if I try to spin it > it will coast for about a half a revolution. If I grip one of the > output shafts I can still rotate the input shaft but it takes a bit of > effort. > > Diff 2: > 150K miles on a diff from an automatic iX. Turning the input shaft > takes about as much effort as spinning a wheel hub that is really > dragging against a brake pad. It will not 'coast' at all if you try to > give it a good spin. If I grip one of the output shafts, I cannot > rotate the input shaft at all. > > I am beginning to think that Diff 1 has a worn out LS (is this a > replaceable part?) and that Diff 2 has some sort of a problem with the > input shaft that is causing the dragging that I feal. I guess I will > just go ahead and use Diff 2 and see what happens but I hate to miss > something that is easy to fix while I've got it sitting on my garage > floor. > > Thanks again to all who have replied. > > - --Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2003 21:23:57 -0500 From: Neil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] Please recycle your BMW My amateurish observations... It looks like a British/Euro Ford Escort. Look at the bark on the tree, which is fairly small, yet largely undamaged (there is one small visible area of damage). Maybe it's a tough tree. The lack of debris could be because the bits were ejected a distance away, down hill and/or picked up already. The lack of skid marks could be explained by the slope leading down to the tree. If the car were airborne for the last few feet (which seems to be the case), there'd be no marks on the ground in the photos given the narrow field of vision, and that's even ASSuming the driver tried to stop. The tree is no more than a few feet from the roadway. However it got there, it's interesting to note that the hinge (A) pillar was ripped in half - the hinges are still attached to the right side door. BTW, where's the other (front) half of the car? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2003 22:43:07 -0500 From: Neil Maller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: E36 seat mount measurement specs on 8/5/03 6:50 PM, "Neil N." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does anyone have any exact specifications on the > dimensions of the E36 coupe seat mounting bolts, i.e., > front bolt to rear bolt, left bolt to right bolt? on 8/5/03 6:50 PM, "tony colicchio" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Front-to-rear 14" > Left-to-right 18" > > - -Tony > TC Design > www.tcdesignfab.com Earlier today I happened to have measured the latter dimension on my 96 M3 as 17 3/4". I just rechecked, and it's still 17 3/4", accurate to within about 1/16". YMMV, blahblah. Neil 96 M3 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 09:36:19 +0200 From: "Pavel Tcholakov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] Please recycle your BMW I don't think that's for real -- that looks like just a pile of sheet metal, where's the chassis, engine? That tree is way too thin, if something going that quickly hit it, it wouldn't have stayed straight like it is. If this is not a fake, then the car must have hit something else, got cut into half or something, and then one bit hit the tree. As for public exhibits of wrecks, yes, we have one here. A Fiat Uno spun and hit a traffic light pole with its rear, the pole cut halfway through the couple. Now the wreck is sitting on a high platform, together with the remains of the pole, at the crossing where it happened. Scary sight. Pavel. - -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of KMS - Brett Anderson Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 3:05 PM To: UUC Digest Cc: Jason Lile Subject: [uuc] Please recycle your BMW Before dropping your car off for recycling, please treat it as you would an aluminum can.... http://www.koalamotorsport.com/misc/recycle.htm No, I don't know the story, but it is an E36 Compact. Brett Anderson KMS ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 09:23:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Steve.Goldstein" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] <FS> Three miscellaneous catalogs I'm cleaning out the piles from my recent move. All are in mint condition, $5 each postpaid in the US. Please reply by direct email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1. Miller & Norburn, Inc. - these were Alpina dealers in the US. The catalog contains the usual parts and stuff, plus 12 pages of Alpina conversions, parts, and accessories. Includes price list from January 1991. Mint condition. 2. BMW Miniatures catalog 1997. Outstanding pictures of the full line of model vehicles. Printed on glossy card stock. 3. BMW Mobile Tradition - Lifestyle Articles and Collector's Items. 66 pages of things you just can't live without - posters, books, clothing, watches, cufflinks, models, and other essentials. Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 10:36:09 -0400 From: "Gaudio, Stefano" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Tire Poll Pilots seem to last longer than S03s S03s are probably the best rain tire $$$ can buy Kumho MX had great reviews and will be my next set. >Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2003 10:46:04 -0700 (PDT) >From: kjk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [uuc] Tire Poll >I would go for the Pilots out of the list posted. Why >no S03 or Kuhmo MX? >Kevin Kelly Stefano ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2003 10:59:52 -0400 From: "David A. Leonard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears - --=====================_69769934==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >Gary Wrote: >Preload is measured through bearing drag. Seal friction clouds the issue. >Backlash is measured with a dial indicator. Without that you should feel a >tiny bit of play between the gears. On this note, I was recently trying to set up a Mercruiser (boat sterndrive)Drive, and was struggling with the backlash/pinion gear issue. It is hard to set up the dial indicator and fixture it right to get an accurate determination..My Airplane mechanic, a man of many talents, told me this rule of thumb: Once it is set up, feed a piece of copier paper through the gear teeth while turning them. If the paper gets cut, the backlash is too small, if it runs through snugly, without being loose, you are about right. The thickness of copy paper will give you about the right amount of space between the gear teeth..008" is the thickness IIRC. They need to drive on the lower middle of the tooth faces, not be in constant contact. If the contact is too tight the gears will blow up. My drive has ben sucking up 250+ Small block hp. all summer and hasn't grenaded yet! Of course, YMMV! Like Gary said, you should be able to just feel and hear a slight amount of clicking if the setting is just right. The other issue is even tooth contact, this can be determined by cleaning the gears and spraying a coat of transfer blueing (Dykem is one brand) on the Ring gear, and turning the Pinion in the drive direction a bunch of times while creating a bit of drag on the output shafts. The wear pattern should be in the middle of the gear teeth faces. Colored grease will also give you a pretty good idea of the contact wear pattern as well. Haynes manuals have a good section on ring gear setup FYI. I am sure the good guys who set them up often can do it by feel..it ain't an exact science. David A. Leonard - --=====================_69769934==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" <html> <body> <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite>Gary Wrote:<br> Preload is measured through bearing drag. Seal friction clouds the issue.<br> Backlash is measured with a dial indicator. <b> Without that you should feel a<br> tiny bit of play between the gears.</b></blockquote><br><br> On this note, I was recently trying to set up a Mercruiser (boat sterndrive)Drive, and was struggling with the backlash/pinion gear issue. It is hard to set up the dial indicator and fixture it right to get an accurate determination..My Airplane mechanic, a man of many talents, told me this rule of thumb:<br><br> Once it is set up, feed a piece of copier paper through the gear teeth while turning them. If the paper gets cut, the backlash is too small, if it runs through snugly, without being loose, you are about right. The thickness of copy paper will give you about the right amount of space between the gear teeth..008" is the thickness IIRC. They need to drive on the lower middle of the tooth faces, not be in constant contact. If the contact is too tight the gears will blow up.<br><br> My drive has ben sucking up 250+ Small block hp. all summer and hasn't grenaded <br> yet! Of course, YMMV!<br><br> Like Gary said, you should be able to just feel and hear a slight amount of clicking if the setting is just right.<br><br> The other issue is even tooth contact, this can be determined by cleaning the gears and spraying a coat of transfer blueing (Dykem is one brand) on the Ring gear, and turning the Pinion in the drive direction a bunch of times while creating a bit of drag on the output shafts. The wear pattern should be in the middle of the gear teeth faces. Colored grease will also give you a pretty good idea of the contact wear pattern as well. Haynes manuals have a good section on ring gear setup FYI.<br><br> I am sure the good guys who set them up often can do it by feel..it ain't an exact science.<br><br> <x-sigsep><p></x-sigsep> David A. Leonard<br> </body> </html> - --=====================_69769934==.ALT-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 11:14:27 -0400 From: "KMS - Brett Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears >I am sure the good guys who set them up often can do it by feel..it ain't an exact science. >David A. Leonard Not this little black duck! You can't feel the difference between .05mm and .15mm backlash just by hand, yet one is too tight and one is too loose, for a BMW diff. Must use a dial indicator on a strong base. I use the factory base setup, which is not magnetic, it screws into the case bolt holes for stability. Brett Anderson KMS ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 11:16:57 -0400 From: "Eurowerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Tire Poll I second the Kuhmo Mx motion. IMHO they are even better than the S03's. Kirk A. Gilchrist EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair 8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 888-522-0271 toll free ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 11:10:26 -0400 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Backlash in Diff gears That is a good way to check spur and bevel gears. Paper is nominally about 0.004 inch thick. Feeding it into the gears is a good test for 0.008 backlash. Rear end gears are hypoid and will probably tear up any paper fed between them. Gary Derian > > >Gary Wrote: > >Preload is measured through bearing drag. Seal friction clouds the issue. > >Backlash is measured with a dial indicator. Without that you should feel a > >tiny bit of play between the gears. > > > On this note, I was recently trying to set up a Mercruiser (boat > sterndrive)Drive, and was struggling with the backlash/pinion gear > issue. It is hard to set up the dial indicator and fixture it right to get > an accurate determination..My Airplane mechanic, a man of many talents, > told me this rule of thumb: > > Once it is set up, feed a piece of copier paper through the gear teeth > while turning them. If the paper gets cut, the backlash is too small, if > it runs through snugly, without being loose, you are about right. The > thickness of copy paper will give you about the right amount of space > between the gear teeth..008" is the thickness IIRC. They need to drive on > the lower middle of the tooth faces, not be in constant contact. If the > contact is too tight the gears will blow up. > > My drive has ben sucking up 250+ Small block hp. all summer and hasn't > grenaded > yet! Of course, YMMV! > > Like Gary said, you should be able to just feel and hear a slight amount of > clicking if the setting is just right. > > The other issue is even tooth contact, this can be determined by cleaning > the gears and spraying a coat of transfer blueing (Dykem is one brand) on > the Ring gear, and turning the Pinion in the drive direction a bunch of > times while creating a bit of drag on the output shafts. The wear pattern > should be in the middle of the gear teeth faces. Colored grease will also > give you a pretty good idea of the contact wear pattern as well. Haynes > manuals have a good section on ring gear setup FYI. > > I am sure the good guys who set them up often can do it by feel..it ain't > an exact science. > > > David A. Leonard > ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6629 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . BMW technical information, special tool sales/rental | http://www.koalamotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | |==================================================== | Turner Motorsport Inc . 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