[uucdigest] Wednesday, October 15 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6816
_________________________________________________________________ | | Search the ARCHIVES: | http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | Visit Richard Nott's Ultimate BMW Database: | http://www.bmwdatabase.com | | For all available Digest commands including unsubscribe/subscribe, | visit the BMW UUC Digest page: http://www.uucdigest.com | | Send SUBMISSIONS to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Complaints? Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you must. | Technical Problems? Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |__________________________________________________________________ In this BMW UUC Digest: Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? Re: [uuc] Z4 tranny questions Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? [uuc] WTB: E36 M3 brake pads/rotors Re: [uuc] Article on Seinfeld and Porsches Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? [uuc] 745Li problems? [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:48:58 -0400 From: "Bill Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > The mechanic told me there are 71 computers in this car, all > > interconnected, > > and of course all interdependent. > > > > This car looked to me like a buyback lemon in the making... > > "CLEAR!" bzzzzt. "CLEAR!" bzzzzt. > > 71 computers in the car? I know first hand of German electronics > over-engineering, but 71 computers? For what? > > I doubt all are computers. I assume he may be referring to electronic bits, > boards, packs, etc in general. Although, I've been wrong before. Well according to this site there are as many as 50 micro procecessors in some cars so BMW would have to have at least 71........ http://auto.howstuffworks.com/car-computer.htm 4-5 years ago when I went to a factory rep tech session for the Volvo S60 when it was first introduced the rep talked about the high speed (engine and safety) network and the low speed (all the other stuff) network and how they were all connected with routers etc and how much money they saved in wiring the car by doing it that way. But you couldn't add a radio without hooking it up to the mothership via the satellite uplink to reprogram the car to see it. Bill Matthews Hockessin DE 00 M Geeze some Volvos other cars ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:12:27 -0500 From: "Ben White" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Z4 tranny questions Thanks Ben. The 2.5 L Z4 manual is looking better to me given my bias against ZF. <g> - ----- Original Message ----- From: "ben keyes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 8:29 AM Subject: Re: [uuc] Z4 tranny questions > Ben White wrote: > > > 1. Who manufactures these two transmissions? ZF or GM? Are the same > > transmissions used in the 2.5 and 3.0 liter cars? > > for the Z4 & the E46 (and I suspect the new 5 as well) ZF makes the > gearsets and Magneti Marelli does the hydraulic/electronic controls. > > for the M3 (and the new M5 when it comes out one would assume) the > gearbox is from Getrag & the SMG-specific controls are from Siemans. > > a quick google search indicates that the 5 speed auto used in the Z4 is > also a ZF manufactured 'box. > > when you shift for yourself, the 6 speed manual is a ZF Type H on the 3.0l > and with SMG on either model. the 2.5l manual is a Getrag Type B+. > > > Ben > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 10:43:23 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? Ditto for the current Mercedes. All of the gadgets in the car are interconnected via a fiber optic network. You have to introduce the CD changer to the head unit to get it to recognize via the computer. Bora >-- Original Message -- >From: "Bill Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? >Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:48:58 -0400 >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> > The mechanic told me there are 71 computers in this car, all >> > interconnected, >> > and of course all interdependent. >> > >> > This car looked to me like a buyback lemon in the making... >> >> "CLEAR!" bzzzzt. "CLEAR!" bzzzzt. >> >> 71 computers in the car? I know first hand of German electronics >> over-engineering, but 71 computers? For what? >> >> I doubt all are computers. I assume he may be referring to electronic >bits, >> boards, packs, etc in general. Although, I've been wrong before. > >Well according to this site there are as many as 50 micro procecessors in >some cars so BMW would have to have at least 71........ > >http://auto.howstuffworks.com/car-computer.htm > >4-5 years ago when I went to a factory rep tech session for the Volvo S60 >when it was first introduced the rep talked about the high speed (engine >and >safety) network and the low speed (all the other stuff) network and how >they were all connected with routers etc and how much money they saved in >wiring the car by doing it that way. But you couldn't add a radio without >hooking it up to the mothership via the satellite uplink to reprogram the >car to see it. > >Bill Matthews >Hockessin DE >00 M Geeze >some Volvos >other cars > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 13:50:10 -0400 From: "Luis Rueda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] WTB: E36 M3 brake pads/rotors Does anybody here have a set of new pads/rotors for an E36 M3 laying around that wants to sell? (if so, please contact me privately). TIA, Luis ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 12:51:45 -0500 From: Dennis Wynne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Article on Seinfeld and Porsches Neil, I have to agree with you. Even IF I was not a huge Seinfeld fan, he is not doing anything any of us gear heads would not do if we had his money: Buy lots of neat cars and build a nice place to keep them. I am not a Porsche fan, but truthfully have never owned one. I am not a Leno fan either, but I admire his car and motorcycle collection :-) I am afraid "Mr. Rosenbaum" didn't persuade many with is editorial, except to persuade us that Mr. Rosenbaum is a doofus. He is probably a close talker too - maybe even a re-gifter :-) Dennis "I wish I had Jerry's money" Wynne M5 silver/black 330i silver/black/manual/sp/pp/xenon/cd - now for sale! At 10:22 PM 10/14/2003 -0700, Neil N. wrote: >Please see that this is forwarded to Ron Rosenbaum. > >Mr. Rosenbaum, > >You, sir, are a helmet - as you so kindly demonstrated in your recent >second-rate "newspaper" article about Jerry Seinfeld and his collection of >Porsches. I take exception to this article on its only two premises - >first, that Seinfeld is not funny, and second, that his ongoing garage >construction is something other than reasonable. For the record, I am a >huge Seinfeld fan, and an avid car lover. In fact, as I write this, I am >enjoying one of the very reruns you mentioned. > >Arguably, no television program in history has had so much of an impact on >its society as Seinfeld. That show created and/or popularized a whole new >language that is still present today, more than 5 years after it ended >(think "yada yada yada", etc.). Besides that part of its impact, it was >simply one of the funniest shows ever. Over nearly 10 seasons, the show >delivered consistently original stories that were intertwined in ever more >bizarre ways. It always makes people laugh and it is a common thread >among people all over the country. I mourn for your obvious lack of a >sense of humor. > >Further, on the point of his new garage: Good for him. First of all, >allow me to remind you that the United States remains a free nation, in >which people have the liberty to do what makes them happy providing it >does not harm others. Fact is, a NY housing shortage is not a reason why >Jerry should not be allowed to build his garage. If he has the finances >to buy the building and make the renovations, that's all that >matters. Besides, would his one garage provide housing for the "tens of >thousands" of people desperate for it, as you claim? I'll remind you of a >person's right to the pursuit of their happiness. If you don't share a >love of cars - Porsches in particular - I feel badly for you. However, I >recognize many people do not. Still, you shouldn't berate his passions >because you resent his financial success and the manner in which he >chooses to spend it. > > From what I know of his collection, by the way, much of it is comprised > of cars that actually are quite rare - much more so than the Boxster you > repeatedly mention. ("Gunther," I believe it was?) Why shouldn't they > be protected and displayed? > >On the literary quality of your article: If I were you, I would hold on to >that job at the Observer with everything I had. I'm no author, but boy, >enough with the "Little Lost Porsches" and "Little Kittens who Lost Their >Mittens" and talk of Jerry being obsessed with saying goodnight to his car >collection. It's a little "hacky". (I'll let you can figure out which >episode that comes from, but here's a hint - Kenny Banya and the rainbow >suspenders.) > >Lastly, a word of advice. Do your homework next time you write an article >like this. If Seinfeld were sitting in a kitchenette reviewing his >collection of Porsches, he would not be eating cookies and milk. He would >be eating cereal. With just the right amount of milk. > >Kind regards, > >Neil > > >Do you Yahoo!? ><http://shopping.yahoo.com/?__yltc=s%3A150000443%2Cd%3A22708228%2Cslk%3Atext%2Csec%3Amail>The > >New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 10:55:42 -0700 From: Mark Dadgar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? On Wednesday, October 15, 2003, at 09:48 AM, Bill Matthews wrote: > 4-5 years ago when I went to a factory rep tech session for the Volvo > S60 > when it was first introduced the rep talked about the high speed > (engine and > safety) network and the low speed (all the other stuff) network and how > they were all connected with routers etc and how much money they saved > in > wiring the car by doing it that way. But you couldn't add a radio > without > hooking it up to the mothership via the satellite uplink to reprogram > the > car to see it. That's a multi-plexed electrical system. Instead of running a discrete set of wires to everything that needs them (ie power, control, etc), you run the wires to a local controller that talks on a communications bus and routes signals along. It really simplifies the car's wiring harness and can allow for some cool things (ie tail light bulb burns out so the computer lights up the turn signal on that side under braking instead). The first mass-production (and I use the term loosely) usage on a passenger car was the Cadillac Allante. It's becoming increasingly common now, to the point that the 2003+ GMC trucks have such a system. - - Mark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 11:10:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Neil Deshpande <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] 745Li problems? Lee: As you probably know, many things can be done right the first time, it is just a matter of what the market will bear vis-a-vis fault rate. This fault rate is going down all the time, of courses, as people get used to better quality, but ceteris parabus. If you increase features, you expect and tolerate more faults. I don't expect my shovel to malfunction (and Sears had better have a full replacement warranty on it), but I'm happy to send a(n expensive) watch in for repair instead of demanding an instant replacement. Microsoft knows its defects and simply releases the product and provides free patches later. That is one way. I bet a study of how many people actually use the patches will show that MS marketing is right on the money and that most people don't really care about the defects the software is released with. Neil Deshpande *** "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Alright, the Microsoft "Service Pack" fix--just free. I would think it wouldn't be real easy to get something that complicated exactly right the first time. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 11:22:25 -0700 (PDT) From: John Bolhuis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: 745Li problems? On Wed, 15 Oct 2003, Robinson, Lee wrote: > And you guys thought the earlier 750's were an electrical > nightmare. Just wait until these new 745's get 10 or 15 years on > them. Poor guys like Brett & Kirk are going to have to spend > bazoodles of cash on diagnostic stuff for these things, if they're > even willing to take them on. I am quite interested in watching this all shake out as the years go by. We know what has happened with the 750s and the 850s too for that matter. They're cheap, and any owner lives in abject fear of those fancy conveniences breaking and costing a bunch to fix. But what is it that usually goes wrong? Mundane things like door locks don't work right? Wipers, seat motors? Seems to me like the increasing levels of integration & interdependence of on-board systems are going to lead to a higher frequency of problems that stop a car from moving at all. Until the systems get smart enough to diagnose themselves correctly (and cheap enough to sell), I'd guess that we'll have a lot of good looking parts cars somewhere down the road. Either that, or a booming business of hackers converting broken 7 series cars with aftermarket engine controls, roll-down windows, and bicycle speedometers. :) - -- "It is an honor to be Cookie Monster." -Sesame Street spokeswoman Audrey Shapiro ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6816 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . BMW technical information, special tool sales/rental | http://www.koalamotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | |==================================================== | Turner Motorsport Inc . 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