Highly redundant self-identifying DNA fragments are probably the way to
go, but
electron lithography on silicon wafers is a well-supported technology
that, even
without a protective layer would outlast paper or clay, and with
transparent protective
encapsulation, would last longer than we are likely to need to have it
last. The
information densities are very high, and reading is likely to be
feasible in a wide
range of potential futures than reading DNA soup.
On 12/14/12 10:41 AM, Artem Evdokimov wrote:
In terms of information density clay, paper and suchlike are not
likely to be competitive with any modern storage device. However, if
there really is a serious need to store relatively large amounts of
information for a really long time I see no issues with laser (or afm)
engraving on thin gold layers,deposited on top of e.g. fused sio2 and
then counter-deposited or sandwiched between layers of some equally
tough subtance e.g. the same fused silica or sapphire, etc. The
assembly is mechanically stable, oxidation is not an issue and
provided that gold feature size is kept reasonably large (say 50
microns per pixel) I estimate the practical read limit (noncontact
optical readout) to be in the hundreds of thousands of years as long
as the assembly is protected from air convection and weather by a
suitable enclosure e.g. a modest size mountain. Best of all,
information can be stored as words and imagess readout is simple and
requires nothing more than the language to be still there at read time.
As we evolve towards becoming telepathic quasicorporeal space
mushrooms this may become an issue.
Alternatively, given that there is no apparent issue with transmitting
information across time (not a time machine but a backwards looking
time telescope) all of this is unnecessary since we will be able to
simply look back in time and see what we need to see. This technology
naturally is immediately and profitably abused for
nepharious/amusing/creepy purposes. Luckily, as a space mushroom I
will have no interest in private momets of Queen Elizabeth's life, no
matter how amusing they might be.
-artem
On Dec 14, 2012 9:20 AM, "Richard Gillilan" <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
This is too funny. My wife's new job is scanning Sumerian clay
tablets into computer. I kid you not.
On Dec 12, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Laura Spagnolo wrote:
> I would definitely go for babylonian clay...
>
>
>
> On Dec 12, 2012, at 10:31 PM, Adrian Goldman wrote:
>
>> I say write them out onto acid-free paper: should be good for
at least 300 years without active management, if there is no fire.
If that doesn't work, I believe babylonian clay tablets have an
even longer expected life time….
>>
>> Dale, I must say I am impressed… I gave up after the exabyte to
DAT transition, and decided that if I really wanted to get data
sets from (my) old projects, it would be easier to regrow the
crystals…
>>
>>
Adrian
>>
>>
>> On 13 Dec 2012, at 00:22, Dale Tronrud wrote:
>>
>>> I don't believe there is a solution that does not involve active
>>> management. You can't write your data and pick up those media 25
>>> years later and expect to get your data back -- not without some
>>> heroic effort involving the construction of your own hardware.
>>>
>>> I have data from Brian Matthews' lab going back to the mid-1970's
>>> and those data started life on 7-track mag tapes. I've moved them
>>> from there to 9-track 1600 bpi tapes, to 9-track 6250 bpi
tapes, to
>>> just about every density of Exabyte tape, to DVD, and most
recently
>>> to external magnetic hard drives (each with USB, Firewire, and
eSATA
>>> interfaces). The hard drives are about five years old and so far
>>> are holding up. Last time I checked I could still read the 10
year
>>> old DVD's. I'm having real trouble reading Exabyte tapes.
>>>
>>> Write your data to some medium that you expect to last for at
least
>>> five years but anticipate that you will then have to move them to
>>> something else.
>>>
>>> Instead of spending time working on the 100 year solution you
should
>>> spend your time annotating your data so that someone other
than you
>>> can figure out what it is. Lack of annotation and editing is the
>>> biggest problem with old data.
>>>
>>> Dale Tronrud
>>>
>>> P.S. If someone needs the intensities for heavy atom
derivatives of
>>> Thermolysin written in VENUS format, I'm your man.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 12/12/2012 1:57 PM, Richard Gillilan wrote:
>>>> Better option? Certainly not TAPE or electromechanical disk
drive. CD's and DVD's don't last nearly that long and James Holton
has pointed out.
>>>>
>>>> I suppose there might be a "cloud" solution where you rely
upon data just floating around out there in cyberspace with a life
of its own.
>>>>
>>>> Richard
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 12, 2012, at 4:41 PM, Dale Tronrud wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck on your search in 100 years for a computer with a
>>>>> USB port. You will also need software that can read a FAT32
>>>>> file system.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dale "Glad I didn't buy a lot of disk drives with Firewire"
Tronrud
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/12/2012 1:02 PM, Richard Gillilan wrote:
>>>>>> SanDisk advertises a "Memory Vault" disk for archival
storage of photos that they claim will last 100 years.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (note: they do have a scheme for estimating lifetime of the
memory, Arrhenius Equation ... interesting. Check it out:
www.sandisk.com/products/usb/memory-vault/
<http://www.sandisk.com/products/usb/memory-vault/> and click the
Chronolock tab.).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Has anyone here looked into this or seen similar products?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Richard Gillilan
>>>>>> MacCHESS
>>>>>>
>>
>
> Dr Laura Spagnolo
> Institute of Structural Molecular Biology
> University of Edinburgh
> Room 506, Darwin Building
> King's Buildings Campus
> Edinburgh EH9 3JR
> United Kingdom
> T: +44 (0)131 650 7066 <tel:%2B44%20%280%29131%20650%207066>
> F: +44 (0)131 650 8650 <tel:%2B44%20%280%29131%20650%208650>
http://www.biology.ed.ac.uk/research/institutes/structure/homepage.php?id=lspagnolo
> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
> Scotland, with registration number SC005336.
