the checklists aren't intended for use in a clinical situation. They are written for the spouse who wonders if ducking flying objects constitutes abuse. As I mentioned before, there are plenty of studies and I have already posted half a dozen from several disciplines.
Dana On 4/15/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > what is the reliability and validity of those checklists. How about > the predictive validity? From what I understand its pretty low. Too > low to be used in a clinical situation. > > larry > > On 4/15/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > this is the explanation I was looking for of the rationale for the > > denial of DCF intervention. Apparently the law governing the agency > > does not require intervention if there is a guardian. What is > > overlooked to my mind is the case where it's the guardian who is > > accused of abuse and the judge who is accused of allowing it. So > > essentially the ruling is that the law says she cannot be removed from > > the custody of her guardian, who is alleged to be abusing her, because > > she has a guardian. Doh. Imho there is a need here for improved > > legislation. > > > > As for your comments, this is NOT the DCF spokesperson's testimony, > > which the judge does not appear to have taken very seriously. But > > these are not paperwork violations. Failing to repair the wheelchair, > > which you conveniently did not mention, meant that she had to stay in > > bed all of the time, increasing a risk of bedsores and other > > unnecessary complications. > > > > A bit slow in filing bureaucratic paperwork! he was years and years > > behind in filing the reports summarizing how what he was doing what is > > her best interests. Years. The judge was allowing this because she was > > scheduled to die anyway. > > > > The failure to provide legal representation was not a matter of paying > > legal bills. It's the decision that directly led, in my opinion, to > > this decision that she'd be better off dead. > > > > The failure to provide therapy directly affected the quality of every > > day of her life. If she had recovered the ability to open her hands, > > she would not have needed pads in her hands to be changed etc, just > > for an example. But hey they had already decided that she wasn't going > > to get better and she'd be dying soon anyway. > > > > Thus it was ok in their view to put her in a hospice facility designed > > for the dying even though she was not in any way shape or form > > terminal and the hospice was not equipped to provide medical care. > > > > There are other allegations I have seen mentioned, such as refusing to > > allow the blinds in her room to be opened ever, which are not > > addressed here. I am not sure if that is because they were found to be > > trivial or found to be unfounded. > > > > Whether she was abused in the hospice is a separate issue from whether > > the marriage was originally abusive. > > > > As for your dismissive comments on the checklist... Gruss asked for > > the bullets and I gave him the bullets. It's written for a general > > audience of possibly abused spouses. There's plenty of studies out > > there, and I have posted some of them. > > > > Frankly this conversation reminds me of the adage about none being so > > blind as those who will not see. > > > > Dana > > > > On 4/14/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Those instances of abuse are according to the court decision include > > > (this is from page 3 of > > > http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/trialctorder031005.pdf) > > > > > > failure to provide independent legal counsel, > > > failur to provide timely guardian plans, > > > failure to provide therapy in the hospice setting. > > > paying for legal fees. > > > The nastiest thing they could come up with is failure to move her arms > > > once in a while. > > > > > > The DCF petition also discusses other allegations that have been made > > > but were unfounded and the case involving these allegations was > > > closed. > > > > > > Some abuse. Failure to move her arms. Paying legal bills. Being a bit > > > slow in filing bureaucratic paperwork. You got it Terri Shiavo was > > > really abused here. Another big case of the Burning Bed. The horrors > > > of paying a legal bill. That just resonates throughout history along > > > side the torture and massacre of thousands. We'll be though of as > > > complete barbarians because Michael Shiavo didn't move her wrists 3 > > > times a day. Hey I bet you could also accuse him of not killing > > > himself in remorse as other evidence of abuse. After all he fits the > > > profile. What the heck those magazine quizzes are certainly accurate, > > > almost as good as a Crackerjack secret decoder ring. > > > > > > It seems to me that the DFA and the Schindlers were really > > > stretching it with this set of accusations. If this is the rock solid > > > evidence of abuse you keep talking about, then you've lost all > > > credibility in this matter. > > > > > > On 4/14/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Matthew > > > > > > > > http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/DCFpetition.pdf for the document > > > > filed in court > > > > > > > > The main page, http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/infopage.html is an > > > > excellent summary of the legal proceedings. The author mostly confines > > > > himself to the legal issues in the case, though I seem to recall > > > > reading comments from him that said he was mildly of the opinion that > > > > dying was in her best interest. But there is a lot of consensus out > > > > there that this si an authoritative site as to testimony and > > > > timelines. > > > > > > > > The document refers to 30 specific and detailed allegations that they > > > > wanted to investigate, as well as to a number of others that were > > > > closed as unfounded. The 89 number may well have come from testimony > > > > and referred to number of calls or... who knows. > > > > > > > > Hope that helps > > > > Dana > > > > > > > > On 4/14/05, Matthew Small <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Hey Sam - That article was written by the editor of LifeNews.com - > > > > > and I'm > > > > > just not sure that it's an unbiased, reputable news organization. Are > > > > > there > > > > > any other sources? > > > > > > > > > > - Matt Small > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Sam [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 2:47 PM > > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > > Subject: Re: Gruss - Schiavo question > > > > > > > > > > Let me remind you what I said: > > > > > "The Department of Children and Families had received 89 allegations > > > > > of > > > > > abuse and neglect in the years leading up to Terri's starvation > > > > > death." > > > > > > > > > > I would list the abuses but Judge Greer has ordered them kept secret. > > > > > I don't know where the original press release is but here's a copy I > > > > > found from google. :) > > > > > http://fuckfrance.com/read.html?postid=1169832&replies=31&page=1 > > > > > > > > > > A local judge refused to open the records of a Florida agency that is > > > > > looking into allegations of abuse and neglect against Terri Schiavo by > > > > > her estranged husband Michael. Florida media outlets had wanted copies > > > > > of previous investigations in the case. > > > > > ...... > > > > > > > > > > On 4/14/05, Larry C. Lyons wrote: > > > > > > You claimed 78 instances of abuse. Well where are they from? > > > > > > Provide a > > > > > > citation or do we just assume that you're pulling them out of your > > > > > > imagination. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=49 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:5:154240 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:5 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
