Adam, Valid points. A big part of the problem is that Sun has done a terrible (or great, depending on your point of view) job in defining and articulating exactly what Java is.
Having said that ... Java the language is not that exciting in the grand scheme of things. It's just another language. Sure, it has some nice features, but so does C, and C++, and C# looks cool (but hey, I was one a major Turbo Pascal fan, and the brains behind C# are the same brains who once were behind TP). Love it or hate it, it is just another language. Java on the client has proven to be a bit of a dud thus far. The applets of the late 90's did nothing to help the perception (often justified) that Java was slow and annoying and over hyped. Java the platform, on the other hand, is compelling. Lots of nice building blocks for everything from database integration to legacy systems to transactions and messaging to security to mobile devices to .. you name it. It is that last paragraph that makes Neo - CF built on top of the Java platform - compelling. The simplicity of CF with the platform of Java, and no new language to learn. So, no, while hype and corporate standards and RFP requirements are indeed part of the equation, in and of itself that would never have justified the massive effort that is resulting in Neo. There actually is real value here, regardless of (and sometimes a result of) underlying Java stuff. --- Ben -----Original Message----- From: Cantrell, Adam [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 3:11 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: Jeremy Allaire interview on DevX Does anyone else see the sick irony of this? Macromedia is moving to replace Java with Flash as the client-side GUI because java is too slow, handles differently in various VM's, and is basically a big POS, but on the serverside, their whole next release will be built on this same technology. It seems backwards, but it technically DOES makes sense (if you're part of the 99% of people that seem to think the server is a good home for Java, I'm personally in the 1% group that thinks Java should be homeless, but I digress). You have to laugh at the situation and how Java has been juggled around in general. What a kludge fest. Adam. ps. please don't take this as a flame to macromedia, more of a social commentary. I too am hyped about NEO, hopefully it will finally shut some of the PHB's up that cry when something's not Java because they read it was the best in a magazine. I just wish Macromedia could be impoliticly-correct and say "yes, while java might be a big fat kludge-fest, it's still what corporate-types demand. And since we'd like to stay in business and possibly make some big bucks, we're just going to give in and try to make the best use of it. The product will work great, but we admit that it probably could have been done better if we didn't whore out to the hype." hmm... maybe I should quit doing web-development and give Public Relations a shot, think anyone would hire me? > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 1:30 PM > To: CF-Talk > Subject: Re: Jeremy Allaire interview on DevX > > > >> > http://www.devx.com/free/hotlinks/2002/ednote020502/ednote020502.asp > > At 6:15 PM 2/7/2, Jon Hall wrote: > > Does rich media mean video? > > ...Is their an approximate release date for Flash 6 yet? > > I'm glad the interview sparked your interest, but am sorry to > say that I > can't speak about specific features in the next generation of > Macromedia > Flash yet. > > However, there *is* a Developer Release of the next-generation Player > publicly available for compatibility testing... just click the "beta" > link at the top of the FAQ: > http://www.macromedia.com/software/flashplayer/public_beta/faq/ > > If you currently use SWF in your work then I'd urge you to > doublecheck that > this plays your existing work without adverse changes... if > you notice any > problems at all then alerting the engineering team > immediately would be > greatly appreciated: > http://www.macromedia.com/bin/fp6betafeedback.cgi > > There has been public discussion about specific items in the > context menu > of this new Player, but those of us under NDA haven't yet > been able to join > in those discussions. Still, this may give some idea of where > things are > headed in this area...? > > > > For client-side Java, it can be useful, agreed. One of the > problems though > is that there are different Java Virtual Machines in use, so > it's a chore > to find a common feature set for a particular target audience. > > Even so, the total consumer viewership for Java applets in > browsers today > -- whatever flavor of Java -- is less than that for SWF files: > <http://www.macromedia.com/software/player_census/flashplayer/ > tech_breakdown > html> > > The rate of evolution for Flash seems to be much faster than > for Java as > well, both on the development end and the distribution end... Flash's > abilities have grown more rapidly than Java's abilities recently, and > growth is *particularly* occurring in ColdFusion's direction. > Consumers > also adapt new Macromedia Flash Players far more rapidly than they'll > update their Java installations. > > Total viewership, predictability and compatibility, growth towards > ColdFusion Server... SWF does offer some increasingly clear advantages > over Java for clientside UI construction. > > > > > If Macromedia is looking to broaden Flash's scope into application > > design, I think it would be very exciting, which was what my whole > > very speculative post was about. > > Cool, glad we share this sense of excitement... more concrete > details will > be available soon... I was glad to see Jeremy publicly lay > the outline out > in that interview. > > jd > > > > > > > John Dowdell, Macromedia Tech Support, San Francisco CA US Search > technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/search/ > Offlist email risks capture by the spam filters. I may not see your > email if it's not on the list. Private one-on-one email options are > available via Priority Access: http://www.macromedia.com/support/ > > ______________________________________________________________________ Dedicated Windows 2000 Server PIII 800 / 256 MB RAM / 40 GB HD / 20 GB MO/XFER Instant Activation � $99/Month � Free Setup http://www.pennyhost.com/redirect.cfm?adcode=coldfusiona FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
