Thank you. You explained it perfectly. I would also like to add that I don't believe for one minute that there are 17000 chis on Petfinders and thousands killed every year because owners couldn't train them. They are there because irresponsible owners wanted to breed their pets with no regard for the future of the pups and generations of more pups. Not only have these type of people helped to kill thousands of chis by adding to the numbers, but they are ruining the chi breed by not breeding sound chis to begin with. So yes, they are all pet quality and with health and or temperament issues.
I know of a lot of people who have bought there chis from private breeders and most of them have health and or temperament issues, and they paid a good penny for them. I have seen many of these chis that don't even look like a pure chi, but the owners believe that they are. Yet because these people don t have a history on the parents and grandparents and great grandparents, there is no way to really prove that they are pure chis. Show people do sell pet quality because it is impossible to have a full litter and every litter make it to the show. But consider these people usually breed to better the breed. They aren't just breeding like the average owner does by throwing any two dogs together and not know a thing about there lineage to prevent health and temperament problems. Most people that breed their pet don't even consider those facts, they just want a puppy or are in it for the money. People need to stop breeding the chi. Having 17000 needing homes, and almost 4000 killed in shelters last year should open the eyes of the public and let them see that this is an extraordinary problem, and the dogs are loosing. There really isn't any excuse anymore for ignorance. The internet, radio, and TV have been begging people not to breed and spay and neuter for years. We all see all the rescue groups on the web, we see the numbers, how can anyone condone bringing more unwanted pups into the world is beyond me. It really has to stop, even if only for a few years until the numbers are down. Do you know that 4 years ago when the economy was at its lowest, more people were breeding their dogs and not just the chi, so they could make some money? Three years ago there was almost 19000 chis on Petfinders, with a very, very, high euth rate going on in the shelters as well. What we do need is more show quality type of chis, to stop all the health issues and temperament issues. Then people wouldn't want to get rid of there chis. We don't need to see more pet quality chis in shelters and being killed for lack of homes. My girls are pet quality and I love them dearly, but then I rescued them. I would never ever, buy from a private breeder, and I don't advocate buying unless you want to buy from a registered show breeder that can document his line, because you truly love the breed for the way the breed should be, and that is without any health or temperament issues. Peggy -------Original Message------- From: Robin Gordils Date: 04/17/13 21:30:38 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] pup coughing Yes, Pet quality are "inferior" in that they do not compare favorably to the standard for that breed. the standard and reputable breeders are what keeps the breed looking and acting like the breed. While often the "defect" is not important it can be. When a pet is bred to a pet without any care about health or temperament then you get dogs dumped for biting, allergies, illnesses or in the case of 2 toy breeds for being way oversized and the owners not being able to physically handle the dog. Poorly bred Chis can have luxating patellas, collasping tracheas or are nasty.I know truly reputable breeders who have homes before breeding and ALWAYS take back their stock not matter the age of the dog. I also know top winning breeders who bred unhealthy un sound dogs, one had a GV, the top GSD for that year who threw bad hips so after no reputable show breeder would use him the bred him to pet quality bitches. My g/f ended up with 2 of his sons both dysplastic. She also bought 4 other GSDs from not great breeders and had bad hips, bad elbows, 2 epiletic and 2 spooky dogs. A BIS winning Rott was bred to everything and threw bad hips so his owner bred him to BYB bitches for the money. Pups were crippled at 8 weeks old. I have bought my dogs from breeders who title and OFA, CERF etc their stock. Mine are primarily housepets but my Rotts, GSDs, and Dobes have been shown in conformation, titled in the obed ring, earned either TT or TC, titled to SchutzhundB and both Schutzhund and Personal Protection trained. I prefer S&R tracking so don't try to title to a SchI or above. Many have gone to nursing homes and alzheimers units. They have also had good health and good hips. A friend bred their 2 ABs with untested hips and elbows and both had allergies. Pups were euthanized for allergies and one parent for bad hips. Axel is out of a multi BIS International Ch sire and his dam has a like pedigree and both are OFAd etc. He has a great temperament, earned his CGC at a dog show after a couple of months of training and lets the little guys push him around. He also did well in Schutzhund when we were going. A reputable breeder has his dogs in the house as pets even if in shifts, titles in different venues, does health checks and always takes back any unwanted dogs. They track every aspect of their dogs' progeny and pull a dog from the gene pool if it passes on problems. A top Poodle breeder not only pulled her multi BIS multi titled Poodle from the ring and notified his pups but took out an ad in the breed magazine explaining his passing on of a defect. She encourage his pups to be tested and neutered if they carried the defect gene. It is a problem that shows up when the dogs are over 5 so a hard thing to know and only recently had they developed a test for the gene. While my dogs except Axel are all pet quality with great temperaments and sound patellas they are not breeding quality so are all neutered. I believe that is due more to lack of ability, by the owners, to train them to be enjoyable pets or health issues they are unable/unwilling to deal with There are too many people that just toss them away blaming he pup instead of themselves for not putting the time and effort to training it. Robin, the Dobe Axel CGC, TT, German Pin Ranger CGC, TT, Chihuahuas Alice CGC and Monte and the MinPins HoneyB, Brutus, IMPS foster Jordan www minpinrescue.org -----Original Message----- From: K. Ritchie <[email protected]> To: Chihuahuas <[email protected]> Sent: Wed, Apr 17, 2013 7:58 pm Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] pup coughing Just my opinion, but I will only have "pet quality" dogs so I am glad there are some people that still breed in their homes. I hope they plan and have homes ready for the pups though. Mine are also spayed/neutered because I don't want pups. Show quality is not always best quality for a pet. You make it sound like "pet quality" is inferior. I understand and agree that there are too many dogs in shelters etc. I believe that is due more to lack of ability, by the owners, to train them to be enjoyable pets or health issues they are unable/unwilling to deal with. There are too many people that just toss them away blaming he pup instead of themselves for not putting the time and effort to training it. I have seen several breeders of "show quality" dogs toss out the ones that don't make the cut or are not showing well. I guess I was just a little offended by the second half of your post. Kay From: Peggy & The Girls <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 12:57 PM Subject: Re: [Chihuahuas] pup coughing It's time for mommy and pups to be checked by a Vet anyway. They are due for their shots and first worming. Worms can cause coughing. There are many different types of worms that they can get. Not all can be seen with the naked eye. Heart problems can also cause coughing, as well as several virus s that pups can get. Also if water, food, goes in reverse because of some blockage that can also cause coughing, so can a cold, or pneumonia. It's not normal for a 6 week old pup to display coughing, so he needs a Vet to determine what is causing it. Waiting to see if it will get worse, will only end up causing him to be sicker and cost more at the Vet. If the mother was up to date with her shots, then she passed on her immunity to the pups for the first few weeks, but after that the immunity level becomes less and less and then the pups can pick up many of the canine virus s out there. Why are you breeding pet quality chis anyway? There are over 17,000 chihuahuas on Petfinders that need homes, and 80% of them are from owners who just had to breed their pet instead of spaying and neutering them. I hope you spay and neuter the parents as well as the pups before you place them in homes, as you will just be adding to the problem. That figure doesn t even include the thousands that are euthanized every day at shelters across the states for lack of space to hold them and lack of homes that want them. You do realize that within the first year of the pups lives if they each have 5 pups that's 20 more homes that will be needed. Could you find 20 permanent homes plus the ones you have? I don't think so. Statistics show that only 3 out of the 20 will actually stay in a permanent home. The others will be shuffled around, most ending up in a shelter before it's 3rd birthday and most of them will be euthanized for lack of a home. This is why there are so many on petfinders and so many being killed every day. So please spay and neuter them all. Peggy -------Original Message------- From: chargeit2him Date: 4/17/2013 11:32:41 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [Chihuahuas] pup coughing On March 2 we had 5 beautiful chi pups. Mom and babies are doing great.. with one exception . I came downstairs this morning and one pup was coughing My husband said he just started a few minutes earlier. (Trouble is his name) Trouble doesn't do it constantly just every now and then. Hubby said to hold off and see if it gets worse then we will take him to the vet..None of the others are doing it. Do pups cough if the have worms ? I haven't seen any of them either. How can you tell if they have worms ? Thanks for any info. Sandy
