I'm not discussing CKCSC at all, other than the statement that for so many years cavaliers were judged against each other only. And yes, I do believe that if any breed of dog is consistently being judged only against it's own breed, it becomes easier to overlook structural flaws that may be wide spread throughout the breed. It becomes much easier to forgive and reward a weak rear end if half the dogs there have that same weak rear end. No, I'm not saying that suddenly we have dogs that are worthy of a win. Actually, very few cavaliers throughout the US do win in group as compared to other breeds of dogs. It is extremely uncommon, at least in my part of the country. The dogs who win BOB rarely win in group. Maybe it's different where you are. I'm saying that by having to compete in the group ring, structure may become more important than it has in the past. I've had a number of cavalier breeders tell me that they would always put more value on "type" than conformation. To me, they are equally important, and in the group ring, good conformation appears to carry as much weight as "type". Myra
>From: Barb Hoorman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel List ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] Curious >Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:14:16 EST > >In a message dated 3/30/02 9:50:28 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > ><< The original discussion stems from my statement that in my opinion, >winning in group is a better indication of your dog's quality than winning >it's class. I based this statement on the fact that the AKC shows up here >are often so small. Your dog may have won winner's dog by competing >against >a total of 5 cavaliers. When our dog used to take winner's dog by beating >a >handful of cavaliers, that wasn't as meaningful a win to us as when he >placed >fourth in group the other day. The group win was, in my opinion, a better >indication of his quality. Yes, I believe that my feeling would be exactly >the same even if there weren't points awarded for placing in group. It is >just my opinion, however, but wasn't shared by any one else. LOL >> > >Myra you originally wrote: >The real "showing" isn't done at a class level. It is done at a group >level. > For too many years, cavaliers were judged in sort of a vacumn because >they >were judged only >against each other. It was almost like 'just go for the pretty head >because >all the rear ends are so bad.' So, they didn't have to develop that kind >of >structure that they needed to compete with a poodle, for instance. It is >important to remember that they are dogs. They need to be built like a >dog. >***************** > >So now I am confused - are you talking AKC or CKCSC because since Cavaliers >have been allowed in the AKC they have been competing at Group level and >there have been many that have won group placements as well as Best in >Shows. >Are you trying to say that just suddenly now .......... we have good moving >dogs that are worthy of a win? > >Just because a Cavalier entry is small - doesn't mean a good dog can't go >further in the Group -just means a judge didn't feel there was any quality >at >that particular show - or that the quality of other breeds was superior. > >Am curious as to our original staement where you talked about Cavaliers >being >judged "in a vaccum" was that directed at your small WA shows or Cavalier >specialties? >Barb Hoorman >Benchmark Cavaliers - TX > >========================================================= >"Magic Commands": >to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL >to start it up gain click here: >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. >Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > >All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author. Myra Savant Gardengate Cavaliers _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================= "Magic Commands": to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL to start it up gain click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 2002 by its original author.
