Ceki, I think you got your analogy mixed up completely :-)
The communism is characterized by dictatorship ( not always benevolent). Most western countries are characterized by democracy. The communism didn't fall because of ideology - I can tell you the ideology had little to do with the reality. At least in some countries it fell because of centralized economy, abuses, etc. As for the "liberal ideology" - that's how apache has worked so far. Every committer has a vote and a veto ( and unfortunately the veto can turn anyone into a small dictator ). Costin On Sat, 2002-11-09 at 00:29, Ceki G�lc� wrote: > > I keep wondering why you keep bringing up Duncan's Whoa > Bessie... mail. I mean this one: > > http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=ant-dev&m=97712718421034&w=2 > > Is it just for historical purposes? Is it because Duncan expresses > interesting ideas with eloquence? Sure, Duncan may have been wrong in > the Ant context but that should not discredit his ideas altogether. > > The liberal ideas expressed by Stefano, Sam and to some extent Costin > are very inspiring and definitely please a wider audience than Duncan's > ideas defending the actions of a selfish pig as he puts hit. (No, I > don't think that Duncan is a selfish pig and you shouldn't either.) > > However, liberal ideologies are just that, ideologies. While Duncan's > theory of benevolent dictators might not find favor in the eyes of > this public, we should not discard it as being contrary to the Apache > way. We should instead recognize it as being a legitimate way of > development. It may even be the dominant way of development at Apache > under disguise. > > In addition, it is much easier to stand up and talk about the interest > of the community than the interests of individuals less you come off > as supporting selfish pigs or being a selfish pig yourself. > > On a wider scale, it was very hard for the West to fight Communism > because the communist ideology sells much better to the > unprivileged. Yet 75 years later, the West won, not because of its > persuasiveness but because it had much more to show on the store > shelves than the communists. Communism is a great idea but it doesn't > work. Capitalism is hard to sell but it ends up having better results > on the long run. > > Coming back to Jakarta, I am not suggesting that anyone is at > fault. All I am suggesting is that we to stop trashing the work > achieved by individuals acting as clear leaders. Leadership is not bad > per se. > > I may be stating the obvious here. So be it. > > At 11:01 07.11.2002 -0500, Sam Ruby wrote: > >I differ with that rendition, and believe that it is harmful to the > >community for it to be propogated. > > > >Duncan rejoined Ant and was immediately accepted as a committer. He > >started work on an internal fork named "AntEater". This went on for a > >short while, until another fork came along named "AntFarm". At that > >point, Duncan said "Whoa Bessie" and started to put forward a case that he > >had a unique right to determine what codebase bore the Ant name. > > > >This lead up to a PMC meeeting with Brian and Roy in attendance where it > >was affirmed that the name of a project went with the expressed wishes of > >a majority of commmitters to that project. This has been the policy that > >we have followed in Jakarta ever since. > > > >References: > > > >http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=ant-dev&m=97712718421034&w=2 > >http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?t=97712745500023&r=1&w=2 > >http://jakarta.apache.org/site/pmc/01-01-17-meeting-minutes.html > > > >- Sam Ruby > > > >P.S. It is my understanding that what is now Apache HTTPD 2.0 is also the > >result of a number of forks, one of which ultimately emerged as being the > >one accepted by the community. > > > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > -- > Ceki > > TCP implementations will follow a general principle of robustness: be > conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from > others. -- Jon Postel, RFC 793 > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
