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There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1a. Becoming fluent in your conlang: please share your anecdotes
From: Sai Emrys
1b. Re: Becoming fluent in your conlang: please share your anecdotes
From: Gary Shannon
2a. Re: New Website Feature
From: Benct Philip Jonsson
2b. Re: New Website Feature
From: Mark J. Reed
2c. Re: New Website Feature
From: Henrik Theiling
2d. Re: New Website Feature
From: Mark J. Reed
2e. Re: New Website Feature
From: Yahya Abdal-Aziz
2f. Re: New Website Feature
From: Henrik Theiling
3. Re: Leaving early
From: Sai Emrys
4a. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
From: taliesin the storyteller
4b. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
From: Sai Emrys
4c. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
From: Tristan Alexander McLeay
4d. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
From: Sai Emrys
5a. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
From: Tristan Alexander McLeay
5b. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
From: Sai Emrys
5c. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
From: Dana Nutter
6a. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
From: Sai Emrys
6b. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
From: Henrik Theiling
6c. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
From: Mark J. Reed
6d. OT: Special Needs
From: Henrik Theiling
7. OT: Leaving early
From: Yahya Abdal-Aziz
8. Integrating snippets from other languages into your L1
From: Sai Emrys
9a. Re: OT: THEORY Fusion Grammar
From: René Uittenbogaard
9b. Re: OT: THEORY Fusion Grammar
From: Gary Shannon
10. Theta Role Question
From: Carsten Becker
Messages
________________________________________________________________________
1a. Becoming fluent in your conlang: please share your anecdotes
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:24 pm (PDT)
This is for one of the probable talks for next year's LCC.
Please share some anecdotes, musings, or otherwise as interesting,
about becoming fluent in your conlang.
Have you?
Have you tried? (If yes, how and what worked?)
How has it affected your life generally, your thought processes, etc?
How have others reacted?
Has anyone other than you tried to become fluent in your conlang; any
stories to go with that?
Etc.
It's intended as a fairly open prompt.
- Sai
Messages in this topic (2)
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1b. Re: Becoming fluent in your conlang: please share your anecdotes
Posted by: "Gary Shannon" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:21 pm (PDT)
--- Sai Emrys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This is for one of the probable talks for next
> year's LCC.
>
> Please share some anecdotes, musings, or otherwise
> as interesting,
> about becoming fluent in your conlang.
When I began taking a sign language coures at the
local community college many years ago as I learned
each new sign I devised a simple pictographic glyph
with the same meaning. A few semesters later, when I
had become fluent in ASL I had also become fluent in
my pictographic language. I used it for class notes
and in my personal journal. It was kind of exciting
to be able to write fluently in my pictographic
conlang without the need to stop and think about how
to write seomthing. I all came very naturally. I
enjoyed it.
--gary
Messages in this topic (2)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
2a. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Benct Philip Jonsson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:35 pm (PDT)
David J. Peterson skrev:
> Sally wrote:
> Don't know about the black on cream, but I think pretty much
> every browser will let you change the size of the letters to
> anything you want (as well as the font). I view everything in
> 14pt Palatino.
It so happens that one browser doesn't, and that browser
is (surprise!?) MS Internet Exploder. I once tried to
set the default font size of MSIE to something smaller,
with the result that all help texts became minuscule
-- and the setting couldn't be reverted! I lived with
it until I upgraded to XP...
Of course it's dead easy to change sizes in Firefox! :-)
And yes I know about Other Operating Systems, but tell
that to my (games-crazed) family or the Totally Untechnical
Side of Myself...
--
/BP 8^)>
--
Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se
a shprakh iz a dialekt mit an armey un flot
(Max Weinreich)
Messages in this topic (16)
________________________________________________________________________
2b. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:59 pm (PDT)
On 7/16/06, David J. Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This is useful to know. I'm not very web savvy at all, so if I hear
> of JavaScript that does something I want to do, I use it. However,
> if X can be done with or without JavaScript, I think it's useful to
> know that it should be done without, for maximum compatibility.
If you just link both stylesheets to your page with <link>, giving
each a different "title", the user will be able to choose which one to
use. In Firefox, they show up in the View->Page Style submenu.
E.g. these two lines in the head of your page:
<link rel="stylesheet" href="default.css" title="Default Colors"
type="text/css" />
<link rel="stylesheet" href="bw.css" tiltle="Black and White" type="text/css" />
Cause my View->Page Style submenu to sprout two options named "Default
Colors" and "Black and White".
--
Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Messages in this topic (16)
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2c. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Henrik Theiling" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 5:05 pm (PDT)
Hi!
Mark J. Reed writes:
> On 7/16/06, David J. Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > This is useful to know. I'm not very web savvy at all, so if I hear
> > of JavaScript that does something I want to do, I use it. However,
> > if X can be done with or without JavaScript, I think it's useful to
> > know that it should be done without, for maximum compatibility.
Hmm, I wouldn't know how to implement the dynamic switching from
inside the web page without JavaScript.
> If you just link both stylesheets to your page with <link>, giving
> each a different "title", the user will be able to choose which one to
> use. In Firefox, they show up in the View->Page Style submenu.
>
> E.g. these two lines in the head of your page:
>
> <link rel="stylesheet" href="default.css" title="Default Colors"
> type="text/css" />
> <link rel="stylesheet" href="bw.css" tiltle="Black and White" type="text/css"
> />
This seems to be done -- my browser allows me to chose between David's
two style sheets.
> Cause my View->Page Style submenu to sprout two options named "Default
> Colors" and "Black and White".
And are those not there in your browser with the current web site
version? My browser does show them.
**Henrik
Messages in this topic (16)
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2d. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 6:34 pm (PDT)
On 7/16/06, Henrik Theiling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hmm, I wouldn't know how to implement the dynamic switching from
> inside the web page without JavaScript.
Sure, but you don't need dynamic switching in the web page if your
browser lets you do the switching.
> This seems to be done -- my browser allows me to chose between David's
> two style sheets.
Sorry, I was assuming he hadn't done that yet, without checking. If
he has, then you don't need the JavaScript. :)
--
Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Messages in this topic (16)
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2e. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Yahya Abdal-Aziz" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:05 am (PDT)
taliesin the storyteller wrote:
[snip]
> And now a tip to all and everyone presenting their conlangs on the web:
> To select colors that'll work even for colorblind people, test your
> pages here: http://colorfilter.wickline.org/
> Then learn how to improve them here:
> http://jfly.iam.u-tokyo.ac.jp/html/color_blind/
>
> t., who is fully aware that the index-page of taliesin.nvg.org
> absolutely sucks for the colorblind...
Taliesin, you're a life-saver! What great resources!!!
I've copied these links to share with the Graphics SIG
of the Melbourne PC USer Group, this very night. This
will be a worthwhile addition to our understanding of
webpage design - I've always suspected there would
be something *really useful* out there on the net, and
... Jackpot! :)) <- grins from ear to ear.
Regards,
Yahya
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/389 - Release Date: 14/7/06
Messages in this topic (16)
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2f. Re: New Website Feature
Posted by: "Henrik Theiling" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 3:30 am (PDT)
Hi!
Mark J. Reed writes:
> On 7/16/06, Henrik Theiling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hmm, I wouldn't know how to implement the dynamic switching from
> > inside the web page without JavaScript.
>
> Sure, but you don't need dynamic switching in the web page if your
> browser lets you do the switching.
The dynamic switching David uses remembers the setting in a cookie, so
when you click on a link, the selected style sheet keeps being used
for the linked page.
I don't know about your browser, but my browser's internal mechanism
switches back to the default in such a case. This is what I meant: I
would not know how to implement this persistence in plain HTML.
**Henrik
Messages in this topic (16)
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3. Re: Leaving early
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:49 pm (PDT)
This reminds me quite strongly of a girl I almost banned from the
empaths group I moderate on LJ. She had a similar sort of incoherency;
like she lacked a filter on what was ontopic or not, and actually
wrote out every thought that somehow tangented (possibly several steps
off) from the original post. Her grammar and evident ability to think
logically were much poorer than his though. Similarly did refer a lot
to her high test scores and such (though mainly bullshit ones found
online... am I the only one who's gotten a real IQ test done by a
psych?)
I doubt either is intentionally insulting; they're just... well,
uncouth. Don't consider themselves flaming because of the former, and
because (to them) it seems on-topic (in that, whatever they wrote was
somehow triggered by the original post, ergo is ""on topic"").
*shrug* In any case, Ray, you have my sympathies. May you enjoy your
travels. J'espere qu'tu parles francais aussi, ou ca sera pas ansi
agreable (comme la plus belle chose du monde, c'est les gens qu'y
vivent...)
I'm sure we'll see you back here soon enough.
- Sai
Messages in this topic (30)
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4a. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
Posted by: "taliesin the storyteller" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:31 pm (PDT)
* Sai Emrys said on 2006-07-16 21:54:37 +0200
> Wow, all caps subject line with default caps protocol. Heh.
>
> Basically, I'd like to suggestion that every month or so the list
> owner should post a CONLANG FAQ - what the group is about, relevant
> policies, group lingo (eg YAEPT, ANADEW, etc), suggestions for
> formatting, CXS vs Unicode intro, etc.
>
> Does such a thing already exist? If so, I've not seen it being posted.
Many attempts have been made, so far all attempts have failed. One
possible reason is that "conlang faq" is construed to mean "a faq about
conlanging, how to conlang and all things linguistic", instead of "a faq
about the weirdities and in-jokes of the conlang-l mailing list as
currently served on listserv.brown.edu, with historical footnotes for
when it was hosted elsewhere." The latter is potentially a finite
document, the former is certainly not.
t., who once tried to make such a beast...
Messages in this topic (4)
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4b. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:55 pm (PDT)
On 7/16/06, taliesin the storyteller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Many attempts have been made, so far all attempts have failed. One
> possible reason is that "conlang faq" is construed to mean "a faq about
> conlanging, how to conlang and all things linguistic", instead of "a faq
> about the weirdities and in-jokes of the conlang-l mailing list as
> currently served on listserv.brown.edu, with historical footnotes for
> when it was hosted elsewhere." The latter is potentially a finite
> document, the former is certainly not.
I was only suggesting the latter - a CONLANG FAQ, not a conlang FAQ.
:-P It should probably refer out to other sources for "how to",
linguistic theory, etc., and stay purely meta.
- Sai
Messages in this topic (4)
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4c. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
Posted by: "Tristan Alexander McLeay" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 6:29 pm (PDT)
On 17/07/06, Sai Emrys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Wow, all caps subject line with default caps protocol. Heh.
>
> Basically, I'd like to suggestion that every month or so the list
> owner should post a CONLANG FAQ - what the group is about, relevant
> policies, group lingo (eg YAEPT, ANADEW, etc), suggestions for
> formatting, CXS vs Unicode intro, etc.
>
> Does such a thing already exist? If so, I've not seen it being posted.
I made one a long time ago, but it was never very useful and has been
largely outdated (maggelic orthographies anyone?). You can find a
version of it at
http://cassowary.free.fr/Linguistics/Conlang%20Dictionary/ but I think
there was a more recent version lost somewhere.
--
Tristan.
Messages in this topic (4)
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4d. Re: META: A CONLANG FAQ?
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:49 pm (PDT)
I always found the definition #2 of maggelity to be very amusing.
That's got to be worth something.
But still, the point of a FAQ is mainly for newbies... and for oldbies
who never did quite understand what the hell those other people were
saying. :-P
- Sai
On 7/16/06, Tristan Alexander McLeay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 17/07/06, Sai Emrys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Wow, all caps subject line with default caps protocol. Heh.
> >
> > Basically, I'd like to suggestion that every month or so the list
> > owner should post a CONLANG FAQ - what the group is about, relevant
> > policies, group lingo (eg YAEPT, ANADEW, etc), suggestions for
> > formatting, CXS vs Unicode intro, etc.
> >
> > Does such a thing already exist? If so, I've not seen it being posted.
>
> I made one a long time ago, but it was never very useful and has been
> largely outdated (maggelic orthographies anyone?). You can find a
> version of it at
> http://cassowary.free.fr/Linguistics/Conlang%20Dictionary/ but I think
> there was a more recent version lost somewhere.
>
> --
> Tristan.
>
Messages in this topic (4)
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5a. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
Posted by: "Tristan Alexander McLeay" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun Jul 16, 2006 6:45 pm (PDT)
On 17/07/06, Benct Philip Jonsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes, I found that Sweden now has a 70-year limit, but the
> book was published in Boston (I know there is at least one
> Boston in the U.K., but I think that's irrelevant here...)
> The question is which country's law applies: the country
> where the work was published, the country where reproduction
> is made/stored, or both. As it happens the servers where
> my 'reproduction'(1) is going to be stored are located in
> the US.
Honestly, I don't know (I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on tv). I
do know that courts in some countries are happy to consider the
publication of internet things to have occurred in the country it was
downloaded into, not wherever the server is.
...
> BTW how do things stand when the whole work in question
> actually is a compilation of citations from earlier
> works, which themselves are actually citations from
> ancient sources?
In general, I'm pretty sure a particular compilation still has
copyright (think of tv broadcasts: the channel doesn't own the
copyright to the show, but they do own the copyright to the
broadcast).
I suppose before you go off and do this, the question you have to try
to guess is how much do you reproducing the work is worth to its
copyright holders, if any? If your reproduction is the last printing
from 1921, probably no-one will notice and you can take advantage of
US copyright law's early laxness. If it's from 2003 and they're still
running off more copies, I'd be inclined to be cautious ... even if
it's out of copyright and you can demonstrate that, you probably don't
want the legal challenge.
--
Tristan.
Messages in this topic (8)
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5b. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:55 am (PDT)
A pragmatic suggestion: see if it's in the Gutenberg or Google Books
archives and flagged as public domain.
I'd bet that they've done their research on the law. :-P
- Sai
Messages in this topic (8)
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5c. Re: OT: Can a book published in 1908 still be under copyright?
Posted by: "Dana Nutter" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 8:45 am (PDT)
li [Tristan Alexander McLeay] mi tulis la
> ...
>
> I suppose before you go off and do this, the question you have to try
> to guess is how much do you reproducing the work is worth to its
> copyright holders, if any? If your reproduction is the last printing
> from 1921, probably no-one will notice and you can take advantage of
> US copyright law's early laxness. If it's from 2003 and they're still
> running off more copies, I'd be inclined to be cautious ... even if
> it's out of copyright and you can demonstrate that, you probably don't
> want the legal challenge.
The whole thing is very tricky. Beyond national laws are international
treaties. Though IANAL.
I did read a few years back how intellectual property laws are now even
more complex. Now copyright notices don't even need to be displayed,
nor do copyrights really need to be regisitered anywhere to be valid.
Messages in this topic (8)
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6a. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:44 am (PDT)
Tangent re "special needs"...
I find it a bit weird as a phrase. Basically, it says outright that
your educational or social needs are different from those of the
mainstream, but it's only applied to the low-performing or pathology
end of things. Why?
Why not also apply it to folk like me (and I'd bet a large portion of
the people on this list) who had 'special needs' that were not met by
the system - by virtue of being too smart for our own good? I for one
found it rather crippling, both mentally and socially; it would have
been very nice to have a forum where I could have been both mentally
challenged *and* in a decent social environment (which is rather hard
to achieve by e.g. just putting me in with mainstream at my cognitive
grade level).
Meh, I think the education system just sucks at doing anything but
educating / indoctrinating / acculturating mainstream (i.e. average
intelligence) kids and keeping them out of adults' hair. People at
both ends of the bell curve are poorly served. In some ways middle
ages style apprecenticeships seem like they'd be better. At least they
would give a sense of purpose to those twelve years.
I hear that this is starting to change in some schools. I wonder what
that would be like.
- Sai
Messages in this topic (5)
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6b. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
Posted by: "Henrik Theiling" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:11 am (PDT)
Hi!
Sai Emrys writes:
> Tangent re "special needs"...
>
> I find it a bit weird as a phrase. Basically, it says outright that
> your educational or social needs are different from those of the
> mainstream, but it's only applied to the low-performing or pathology
> end of things. Why?
>
> Why not also apply it to folk like me (and I'd bet a large portion of
> the people on this list) who had 'special needs' that were not met by
> the system - by virtue of being too smart for our own good? ...
Is this a serious question? Ok, I will answer seriously.
At the low end, people have no chance of helping themselves. That's
the basic difference. Therefore, chosing to help those naturally has
higher priority. It's unfair to support those who are smart enough,
when there is a single one who cannot keep pace.
You would probably find it strange to collect money for the rich.
It's probably better to collect money for the poor first.
(Yes, economy works differently. But there is no need to find
it particularly fair.)
If the challenged are well-supported, the smart ones should have
access to enough books, though, for feeding any interest and keeping
them from getting bored.
So Sai, just help yourself!
**Henrik
Messages in this topic (5)
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6c. Re: Michael Adams/Abrigon (Was [OT] Books for sanskrit self-study
Posted by: "Mark J. Reed" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 7:02 am (PDT)
On 7/17/06, Henrik Theiling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is this a serious question?
Yes.
> You would probably find it strange to collect money for the rich.
What I find is that you are using an extremely inapplicable and
offensive analogy.
> If the challenged are well-supported, the smart ones should have
> access to enough books, though, for feeding any interest and keeping
> them from getting bored.
Once they're old enough, sure - assuming that their experiences within
the educational system haven't destroyed their desire to learn
altogether.
There's a reason many school systems have a special program for
"gifted" children. Assuming that your goal is to educate the
students, then dealing with them is as serious a problem as reaching
the children who are slower than normal for whatever reason.
--
Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Messages in this topic (5)
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6d. OT: Special Needs
Posted by: "Henrik Theiling" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 8:05 am (PDT)
Hi!
Mark J. Reed writes:
> On 7/17/06, Henrik Theiling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>...
> > You would probably find it strange to collect money for the rich.
>
> What I find is that you are using an extremely inapplicable and
> offensive analogy.
What? But why? I had not intended nor realised any offensiveness.
If this is perceived this way, then I'm sorry for it!
>...
> > If the challenged are well-supported, the smart ones should have
> > access to enough books, though, for feeding any interest and keeping
> > them from getting bored.
>
> Once they're old enough, sure - assuming that their experiences within
> the educational system haven't destroyed their desire to learn
> altogether. ...
I think we talk about different groups of people. Before we hit each
other, please let me clarify.
Children who lose interest in learning because of unbearable boredness
are not what I tried to talk about. They are typically bad in school
and are thus first recognised as 'challenged' children. (And it is
often hard to find out that the reason for being bad in school is
really boredness and giftedness.) If they cannot help themselves,
they are clearly and I thought obviously in my category of those
needing help, since they will also not be able to keep pace, only for
a different reason.
I.e., I probably agree with you.
I was trying to say that I don't see any need to support people who
can help themselves. Support those who cannot help themselves, for
whatever reason.
Obviously it is less obvious than I thought.
**Henrik
Messages in this topic (5)
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7. OT: Leaving early
Posted by: "Yahya Abdal-Aziz" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:58 am (PDT)
Hi all,
This thread is so far off-topic. Could we *please*
preface all further replies with OT:?
R A Brown wrote:
>
> I was going to wait till the end of this month before going nomail, as
> I'll be disappearing for week South Wales, then three weeks in France.
>
> But after the recent outpouring from Abrigon/Mike Adams, I think for
> peace of mind & to avoid flaming, I will leave now, and hope things are
> better when I return in September.
>
> I found the mail "Re: USAGE Re: Defining words and how they are used"
> full his usual misinformation and full of *flame-bait*.
>
> In particular I was upset by his *repetition* (you do not do this twice
> by accident) of: "The discussion was flamed by Ray Brown and taken
> off-list." - which is untrue. I assume Monsieur Abrigon, who clearly has
> no regard for the truth, is deliberately trying to provoke.
>
> In his mail "Re: USAGE: I want crazy two years ago", he wrote:
> "For oxymor[o]nic
> Nazi Rabbi"
>
> I am not a Jew. But I have visited Auschwitz. I found his remark
> incredibly insensitive and extremely offensive.
I am not a Jew. And I have not visited Auschwitz, which I think
entirely irrelevant. One can be human without having one's nose
rubbed in inhumanity, and I frankly find the thought of such
sight-seeing, supporting, as it does, trafficking in others' misery,
quite nauseating.
Still, I found Michael's remark insensitive, but not incredibly so.
To get a laugh, some American comics make crass jokes about the
twin towers, in which thousands of their countrymen died horribly.
Offensive? Well, that depends - I don't let much offend me.
Whatever does must be something that hits below the belt, too
close to home for me to parry the blow. Which is just a wake-up
call for me to examine the causes of my own sensibilities.
Such an effort to get a cheap laugh, is ... pitiable, perhaps.
Charlie (caeruleancentaur) replied:
> >Abrigon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >....Sadly the rest is the product of a classic US education system.
> >The fun with being special needs, the group you all in the same
> >boat and cut you off, and then wonder why you are not normal or
> >like? Was it cause you was not "normal" to begin with, or just did
> >not have the social contacts, education and such, that others have?
>
> Did no one else see what Michael wrote in the above? This is the
> second message in which he's mentioned "special needs.". I assume
> this means he has some type of learning disability. This would go a
> long way in explaining his wealth of misinformation, his ignorance
> of English grammar, his inability to learn how to spell after
> reading the correct spellings in other messages, and his misguided
> attempts at humor (I too found "Nazi rabbi" incredibly insensitive).
>
> For those who don't care for his style (I am one of them), I suggest
> we simply not read his messages. That way we can avoid the occasion
> of a flame-war. Those who enjoy reading what he has to say can
> continue to read & respond to what he has to say.
Charlie, we can read and respond without condoning those elements
of Michael's style which we find offensive.
Michael Adams replied:
>
> Not flaming as far as I know.
>
> I found out a long time ago, that if someone calls your a mean
> or nasty name or uses a word when talking to you in a nasty way,
> that is designed to get you angry. Who is empowering things,
> they for calling you the word, or you the one being called it
> and getting angry?
>
> Oddly it is you who is empowering it, so if someone calls you
> something, laugh at them and grin.. And in this, you do not let
> them gain power, but making you do what they want you to do.
True.
> I am a Sober Irishman. Why, well, for one a recovering
> alcoholic, but it took a while, why? Well, several dead friends
> helped.. But just got tired of drinking.. Sorry AA makes me
> depressed and want to drink..
Michael, I understand where you're coming from. I haven't had
a drink in 36 years, but that still doesn't mean I won't, despite
the fact that I very definitely do not want to.
> I do have problems with the drink called an "Irish Car Bomb" but
> maybe cause I find the use of cars and bombs to be
> brutal/cowardly/etc, as well as the perception that the Irish
> are terrorists or even connected to them offensive or that a
> drink is called by that name.
Yes, that name is certainly offensive. But so are the names
of almost all mixed drinks. Why? Alcohol is supposed to be
an excuse for being politically incorrect. Hell, it even excuses
being thoughtlessly violent, beating your wife and kids, and
maiming the innocent while driving. So alcohol pushers use
whatever techniques they can to get drinkers to lower their
guard and consume more of that poison.
> But missed getting blown up in 1981, why? I passed by the El Al
> (Airline of Israel) office five hours before it got BLOWN UP by
> a Car Bomb.. But after some 20 years military service, I find
> war to be a pain and wish people would stop waging them. But
> they do.
OK. Amen to that.
[snip interesting stuff "about all that Ireland gave to Europe"]
That's intriguing. I didn't know any of that about Clunes.
> Holocaust happened, and it was brutal and sadly the Germans was
> not the only supporters, the US Amerikan Bund Movement was proof
> of that. Those in the 1930/40s who allowed it to happen are just
> as guilty.. So? Hope it never happens again.. But sadly it will
> happen again. Peoples memories are short and often very biased
> and worse..
Bosnia happened in Europe! Can you believe that??
Chechnya is still happening right now, in the Russian
Federation. Can you believe that??
All I can put it down to is that the last of the generation
that feared the Nazi machine and Stalinism has (just about)
died off.
[snip]
> Most of the college teachers I have had, had more problems with
> my programming skills than my grammar, spelling or even subject
> matter. Which is funny, cause the last time I checked, my GPA
> was like 3.6 or higher.
Yeah, we know you've got a brain, and it's great when you
actually use it to write something cogent and lucid like this
message! ;-)
[snip speculation about Marx etc]
> Myself, got out finally but ... Will be here to welcome buddies
> back and see how they are doing when they get back from the Iraq
> or Afghanistan/etc.. And ask them, was it worth it? ...
Damn good question.
> ... On that
> note, have a nice day, enjoy the freedom of speech, cause I do
> enjoy it..
We've noticed ...
> PS: Some of my best friends are Jewish and Muslim and even some
> Christians and Wiccans.. And if you must know the priest, who
> married my parents, converted to Catholicism while in the camps
> (not sure which one). Auschwitz, Sorbebor, Triblinka, Dackhoi
> (sp) damn I forget the others.. There was too many.
>
> Also, for fun, last time I checked my manner of speaking and
> usage of words and grammar, on a computerized test, I ranked
> above average. ...
You've finally demonstrated an about-average level onlist!
"But I'm sure,
You're capable of more."
> ... I love playing with words and how they are used.
> And I have a fun sense of humor..
Yes, but you can be very thoughtless. Not everyone can
tolerate your free-wheeling political incorrectness ...
> My poetry, I write for more than just meter and such, but more
> for content and how I was feeling when I wrote it, even if
> sometimes I was thinking of a play of Shakespeare when I wrote
> it and some have said I can even do things in Iambic Pentameter
> or do a fun Haiku..
Good! Where can I read your poetry? (Write me offlist.)
Do you do any in conlangs? (Answer that one onlist.)
> PSS: Any one can be made to look a fool, when taken out of
> context.. Or as someone said to me, if you reply to something,
> try to keep the same subject header, as well as the last post in
> the thread you are replying to, hum.. Grin..
And damn! You CAN do it!!!
> Have a nice day..
> Mike Adams
Likewise!
Regards,
Yahya
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/389 - Release Date: 14/7/06
Messages in this topic (1)
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8. Integrating snippets from other languages into your L1
Posted by: "Sai Emrys" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 2:15 am (PDT)
One thing that's relatively unusual about my speech (in English) is
that I use the Japanese sentence-ending particle 'ne'. It's useful; it
expresses something in a way that makes English more complete. Another
example - I use the Russian 'nu?' (again, when speaking English).
Aside from common loanwords & creolization - i.e. more on the
grammatical end, or uncommon loanwords - what have you found to cross
from the other languages you know or have created, into your ordinary
speech / writing / thought?
- Sai
Messages in this topic (1)
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9a. Re: OT: THEORY Fusion Grammar
Posted by: "René Uittenbogaard" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 3:09 am (PDT)
On 7/15/06, Herman Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gary Shannon wrote:
>
> Or how about Dutch?
>
> Steek er nu mee de niet-brandende fakkel aan om de deur te openen.
>
> You've got "nu" (now) in the middle of "ermee" (with it), and "aan"
> which is part of the word "aansteken" (to light; the sentence refers to
> lighting a torch) at the end of the phrase with "steek" at the beginning.
Better would be:
Steek er nu de niet-brandende fakkel mee aan om de deur te openen.
Even more can go inside the "er .. mee" construct:
Steek er de niet-brandende fakkel vandaag nog met beide handen
Light it [the non-burning torch] [today still] [with both hands]
binnenshuis mee aan om de deur te openen.
indoors with up [in-order the door to open].
Note that the separable verb "steek .. aan" encompasses even more.
A very good website about word order in Dutch sentences is:
http://www.dutchgrammar.com/en/wordorder/1b.html
It taught me a lot of things I didn't know (as a L1 speaker of Dutch)
and which I really needed for the Dutch lessons I'm giving at the moment.
René
Messages in this topic (19)
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9b. Re: OT: THEORY Fusion Grammar
Posted by: "Gary Shannon" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:36 am (PDT)
--- René Uittenbogaard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 7/15/06, Herman Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Gary Shannon wrote:
> >
> > Or how about Dutch?
> >
<snip>
>
> Even more can go inside the "er .. mee" construct:
>
> Steek er de niet-brandende fakkel vandaag nog
> met beide handen
> Light it [the non-burning torch] [today still]
> [with both hands]
>
> binnenshuis mee aan om de deur te openen.
> indoors with up [in-order the door to open].
>
I really having trtouble understanding the function of
"er...mee" in this sentence. What, exactly, is the
"er...mee" telling us? It's not what the torch was lit
"with", so what is it?
>From the gloss it looks like the whole sentence could
do quite nicely without it:
Light it [the non-burning torch] [today still] [with
both hands] indoors up [in-order the door to open].
That being the case, perhaps "er...mee" is some
grammatical convention that is actually empty of
content, and could be simply dropped by the parse as
being merely "decorative"?? (Not proposing that this
is true, but just asking.)
--gary
<snip>
>
> René
>
Messages in this topic (19)
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10. Theta Role Question
Posted by: "Carsten Becker" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:10 am (PDT)
Hi,
I've got a question regarding the roles in this
construction:
Music is his passion.
How should this construction be analyzed? I would translate
this sentence as
Tingrāng dikunang iyaena.
Music.A passion.A 3s.m.GEN
Into Ayeri, although I do not feel well with marking both
NPs as Agents. Actually, I think, there is no agent, and
both nouns should be best left unmarked, but that seems odd
as well.
Thanks,
Carsten
--
"Miranayam kepauarà naranoaris." (Kalvin nay Hobbes)
Tingraena, Tyemuyang 6, 2315 ya 05:27:19 pd
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