On Sunday 05 Oct 2003 14:55, Thomas Backlund wrote: > Jos Hulzink kirjoitti viestiss��n (l�hetysaika Sunnuntai 05 Lokakuu 2003 > > 15:30): > > This is not a matter of depending on gaim, this is a matter of willing to > > prevent reviews from writing "Mandrake 9.2 is no good, it comes with > > broken software" > > > > Mandrake has a nice update feature during install, let's use it, instead > > of defining what a bugfix is. What is better ? A few extra kB of updates, > > or a broken distribution ? > > The problem that arises here is "the bigger picture"... > You say "a few extra kB..." > But once you open the "bugfix/security updates" system to this, > where does it end...?? > > People will start saying: "... but you updated that package ...", > and "this package adds or modifies this or that feature that is needed... > if we don't have it I consider it's broken... and we can't have a "broken" > distrib..."
Now we're comparing OpenOffice with Gaim... What these bugs are for Gaim, is "oowriter and oocalc won't start" for OpenOffice. (Which actually happened to me in RC2, but happened to be fixed in time). I.e. buggy enough to make the package unusable for most people. > so where do you draw the line...? > and since all packages always gets updated with more features, > or feature enchancements... To be honest: for me, the sky is the limit, but it's easy talking with a cable connection. But to draw a line: most packages have a distinction between bugfix releases and feature releases. Ok, of course with Gaim we got the exception to this rule... > today gaim, tomorrow OpenOffice.org final..., and then ... > > and suddenly the updates mirrors are not a few kB more... instead you will > be calculating the updates in MBs, then in GBs .... For some reason I immedately must think about the famous Redmond OS service packs, sometimes 100 MB in size. You happily download those, for they fix bugs. > So IMHO here comes the power of an Club membership..., > > join the club and you will most likely get the downloads there... > and all are happy... (you get what you pay for... remember...) You say, become a club member. Ok, fair. Problem is, when I Mr newbe user download Mandrake, I see a buggy distro, and no updates. In the first place, I see nowhere that many problems are solved if I pay (and I'm reluctant to pay, for Mandrake is buggy, and who tells me that my problems are gone after I paid ?), in the second place, after I paid, the manual how to get the club updates in, is practically non existent (I found something deep in a forum once). Users are willing to pay for something good, not for something bad that mabye gets better after they paid. To quote you: "join the club and you will most likely get the downloads there". I don't see whether that is true, so I should just pay and hope ? Sorry, that's not the way customers think in 2003. What I am really discussing is the way users see MandrakeSoft, that almost bankrupt company with a rather cool distro that needs all money it can get. The problem with any linux distribution is that the Download Edition is in fact your advertisement. And bad advertisement doesn't sell. And selling is essential for MandrakeSoft. Maybe -but that's too late now- it is an option to add a feature during the install period: Enter MandrakeClub membership ID / Passwd (or registration code) to get less critical updates. I can live with paying for some updates, if only you can make clear to the customers what they gain after paying. Show them a list of updates only available to members... or something... Jos
