Max, I'm on the same side of the barricade as you do. I am also a server op who tries to fullfill all the rules. But let me ask: what did you do to check if you are fine with the rules? Did you read all your plugins' code or even if you can't, have you tried to ask in their topics "Hey, I would like to ask - does your plugin do something with items that could potentially result in a GSLT ban?". There was a lot of unnecessary trash talk coming to the list in the last few weeks - and I bet if we talked to each other which plugins did we use and who was banned, we could help each other and identify where the problem is. But it seems to be easier just to offense people, say that sb is stupid or whatever, and just write "I AM OKAY AND I WAS BANNED INNOCENTLY".
I'm not saying Valve is 100% okay, because as I wrote before - there are still some servers with knives etc. which doesn't seem to be banned. But I guess one of the purposes of this list is to help each other, to talk with other server ops, and not to prove how dumb other people are. M. 2016-03-04 22:03 GMT+01:00 Max Krivanek <m...@kigen.co>: > A combination of the two approaches would have been more effective. A > SourceMod that disallows what Valve doesn't want, with the option flag like > it has now. That way the server operators trying to abide by Valve's terms > could have something to clearly define what wasn't allowed. Then a system > for banning servers that don't follow those rules would have a lot less > issues. > > We didn't find any of the props that are disallowed in any of our own > plugins. So we can only assume it was a 3rd party plugin we were using > that caused the GSLT ban in the first wave. Since then we've basically > stripped the servers down to the core plugins. Players were quite unhappy > as a result. But since we didn't know what plugin triggered the ban, and > Valve themselves won't identify what triggered the ban, we didn't know what > else to do. > > On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 2:08 PM, Nicholas Hastings < > psycho...@alliedmods.net> wrote: > >> Full disclosure - They did try to work with us on this before GSLTs were >> even officially introduced to CS:GO. They wanted to know if we were willing >> to just add the blocks to SourceMod, without checks necessarily being added >> to CS:GO itself. >> >> Our initial position was that while we weren't necessarily against it, we >> didn't think it would be effective and could fork the community to an >> extent. With SourceMod being open source, it would be rather easy for >> someone to just remove the checks and then run and/or distribute a version >> without them. >> >> We then shortly relaxed our stance to try to be cooperative and asked >> what specifically was desired to be blocked, but were not given a response. >> I believe that was just a tacit agreement that it wouldn't be effective. >> >> Fast forward to now, a specific list would still be nice to better >> protect users from possibly unintentionally running something that could >> get their account's GSLTs banned. >> >> -- >> Nicholas Hastings >> AlliedMods.net <http://www.alliedmods.net> >> >> >> >> Max Krivanek <m...@kigen.co> >> Friday, March 4, 2016 2:47 PM >> It is indeed not SourceMod team's duty. But its not like Valve gave the >> SourceMod team a chance to work with them to help prevent accidental bans. >> Its not like these entity properties scream "do not touch me." And since >> when we develop plugins we're trying to figure out how things work, we >> might end up touching one of those properties. Or downloaded a plugin that >> touched one of these properties. Not for malicious reasons. >> >> GSLT is not an effective or desirable system. >> >> And the gunmaker comparison is really off. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Csgo_servers mailing list >> Csgo_servers@list.valvesoftware.com >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/csgo_servers >> Marcin Paterek <mrpate...@gmail.com> >> Friday, March 4, 2016 1:52 PM >> It is not a SourceMod team duty to provide you a way NOT to break the >> rules. (They did, because they are nice guys). It is your decision to use >> 3rd party software (such as plugins), and you put it on your machine. You >> can't blame a gunmaker for somebody being shot. If you were hosting the >> game with just Valve tools, how would you even be able to break the rules? >> And if you are still messing with items after over half of the year since >> new rules have been enforced, I really see no point in skipping one or >> another community just because it's small. It's not about the size, it's >> about following rules. >> >> But in some part I agree with you - the GLST bans for now are >> ineffective, because there are still multiple servers with knives and other >> forbidden things. This is something Valve could improve. >> >> Cheers, >> M. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Csgo_servers mailing list >> Csgo_servers@list.valvesoftware.com >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/csgo_servers >> Larcen III <larcen...@kill4play.com> >> Friday, March 4, 2016 12:15 PM >> >> I completely agree. This entire *debacle *could have been avoided if a >> sourcemod required update had been* created first instead of last*. I'm >> furious over the situation drama that's a *direct result* of Valve's *gross >> mismanagement*. This is a* PR blunder *and someone should speak up and >> take some responsibility for having almost zero foresight. >> >> *What's more frustrating, is that is seems as if Valve assumes think >> we're mad about not having knives or skins plugins*. We (I speak for the >> larger part of the community) wish to abide by any rules set forth by Valve >> in the first place. We really do want to get along. It's a few bad apples >> out there who are the problem, and the attention should be on them, not >> *US*. >> >> Why are regular small community servers being *brutally punished*, while >> the abusers who are the reason behind Valve's action, are still running >> their servers with the knife and skin mods, even at this moment. >> >> *100% INEFFECTIVE VALVE.* Unless by effective you mean *effectively* >> *annoying >> *and *distancing *the community fan base, the *foundation *of which has >> kept players (read made the playerbase more sticky) in the game longer by >> adding new gametypes like knives only, 1v1 with levels,headshots only, >> custom co-op maps, and surfing to name a few. >> >> *I strongly urge Valve to reconsider the GSLT program's implementation, >> as it's harmful to the community and creating a toxic environment.* >> >> When I posted about it in the forums, I was met with ridicule and >> hostility. >> When I contacted support, they sent a canned response and I never got a >> real human to respond. >> >> +LarcenIII >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Csgo_servers mailing list >> Csgo_servers@list.valvesoftware.com >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/csgo_servers >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Csgo_servers mailing list >> Csgo_servers@list.valvesoftware.com >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/csgo_servers >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Csgo_servers mailing list > Csgo_servers@list.valvesoftware.com > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/csgo_servers >
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