-Caveat Lector-
--- craig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
<MUCH SNIPPAGE>
NOTHING to kindly welcome Mulva to the list!
Seriously, Craig, it's my belief. If you think Im
nuts, I can live with that I suppose and I will not
discuss the matter further on the list because no one
probably wants that.
I will write, I really like the list and that I
probably shouldn't have just come in and spouted some
beliefs of mine that many prbobably believe to be the
biggest conspiracy ever concocted. It is a belief in
the word of God as the sole authority and requires
MUCH faith which isnt logical to many people.
I appreciate your response, I am sorry if I offended
you with my thoughts, I do not wish to be at odds
certainly over my spiritual beliefs--that would be
terrible.
The point was that Jesus must have been a liberal
because he spoke against principles of capitalism. My
response was just that Jesus warned for people to be
careful of the love of money (mammon). I did not mean
to imply that all rich people or people with beamers
are going to hell. But Jesus did say that it would be
easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle
than for a rich man to pass through the gates of
Heaven. I believe--dare I try to determine a meaning
of this statement--that Jesus is saying that with
money comes self-pride and no sense of need for a God.
Of course you don't buy any of this as you stated in
your reply.
I found the concept to be interesting but my argument
is that Jesus did not make these statements for
political reasons but instead for spiritual well being
for those that choose to consider this concept.
Nessie wrote:
>Aren't you being just a tad presumptuous to translate
>Jesus. He said
>what he said. Period.
Isn't the whole point of the Holy Bible to translate
it...to find meaning in it and apply it daily to our
lives? What is so presumptuous about taking what
Jesus said here to mean that he was implying to obey
the government so long as it does not conflict with
obedience to God? I think it much more presumptuous
to deem Jesus a liberal because He warned against
seeking riches here on earth. This concept should be
studied further and I have found the meaning to be
defined in Jesus own words in several other places of
scripture and that is to say that rich people feel
fewer needs for a higher power and struggle a lot more
with self-pride.
Yes what he said exactly was:
Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be
Caesar's, and unto God the things which be God's .
Luke 20:22-25.
Christ's reply was . . . a candid answer to the
question. Holding in His hand the Roman coin, upon
which were stamped the name and image of Caesar, He
declared that since they were living under the
protection of the Roman power, they should render to
that power the support it claimed, so long as this did
not conflict with a higher duty. But while peaceably
subject to the laws of the land, they should at all
times give their first allegiance to God.
We are to recognize human government as an ordinance
of divine appointment, and teach obedience to it as a
sacred duty, within its legitimate sphere. But when
its claims conflict with the claims of God, we must
obey God rather than men. God's Word must be
recognized as above all human legislation. A "Thus
saith the Lord" is not to be set aside for a "Thus
saith the church" or a "Thus saith the state." The
crown of Christ is to be lifted above the diadems of
earthly potentates.
The wisdom and authority of the divine law are
supreme. . . . The ten precepts of Jehovah are the
foundation of all righteous and good laws. Those who
love God's commandments will conform to every good law
of the land.
We are not required to defy authorities. . . . We are
to go forward in Christ's name, advocating the truths
committed to us. If we are forbidden by men to do this
work, then we may say, as did the apostles, "Whether
it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you
more than unto God, judge ye. For we cannot but speak
the things which we have seen and heard." Acts 4:19,
20.
Our kingdom is not of this world. We are waiting for
our Lord from heaven to come to earth to set up His
everlasting kingdom.
Thanks for the reply. I will shut up about this now.
Again, I am not trying to convert anyone here, rather
I am simply giving my opinion/reply to the original
post and now reposted posts on the same thread.
I do not consider myself a holy-roller or a right wing
christian. I am a sinner in need of grace and
forgiveness daily. But when I see that someone says
that Jesus was interested in a political agenda while
here on earth I feel the need to reply that they
should reexamine for other potential reasons for His
visit (which by the way the Bible lays out fairly
clearly).
Jesus has about as much interest in our political
party system as He does in the outcome of a football
game.
Thanks again for the chance to document on this.
Mulva
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