On 10/13/2016 05:27 PM, juan wrote: > On Thu, 13 Oct 2016 17:14:40 -0700 > Razer <ray...@riseup.net> wrote: > >> >> >> On 10/13/2016 12:54 PM, jim bell wrote: >> >> >>> But if just about everybody had phones installed with >>> 'good' (rather than 'perfect') encryption, encryption that it would >>> take a large amount of the NSA's resources to crack, we'd be living >>> in a far better world than what we have now. >> >> This is my take on tor as well. > > > Why do you keep posting pentagon's propaganda razer? > > >
That's not Pentagon propaganda Juan. That's my opinion of the statistical probability of finding every needle in a haystack and the energy expended to do so. Their peeps would claim tor's god-like infallibility. That IS NOT what I'm saying nor have I ever claimed that. Rr > > >> There's safety in numbers. On the >> ground OR in cyberworld. If EVERYONE used it, well yeah, they'll get >> ALL the dataz, but they could use up all the silicon on the planet >> storing it, and all the carbon burned up to run the machinery to >> process that data... etc. >> >> >> It's possible to make their technology so expensive to use the US >> treasury couldn't support the drain. >> >> Rr >> >> Ps. The silicon IS going away... The next best substitute, whatever >> that might be, and re-engineering everything to use some >> less-efficient substrate, ought to cool the computer industry's jets >> a little... >> >> http://www.cbc.ca/radio/thesundayedition/lethal-force-running-out-of-sand-helping-hoarders-hosanna-then-and-now-inside-butter-tarts-1.3770809/the-world-is-starting-to-run-out-of-sand-1.3770813 >> >> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Zenaan Harkness <z...@freedbms.net> >>> On Thu, Jul 24, 2014 at 12:03:36PM +1000, Zenaan Harkness wrote: >>>> On 7/24/14, Ulex Europae <euro...@gmail.com >>> <mailto:euro...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>> At 05:25 AM 1/17/2014, Jim Bell forwarded: >>>> >>>>> <<http:///>http://www.yahoo.com/tech/startup-launching-a-super-secure-nsa-proof-73511096050.html >>> <http://www.yahoo.com/tech/startup-launching-a-super-secure-nsa-proof-73511096050.html?soc_src=mail&soc_trk=ma>> >>> >>>> NSA-proof? >>> >>> To me, the problem is obviously the people who write such articles, >>> and perhaps others that write the headlines, people who know far >>> less about security even than those who merely frequent the >>> Cypherpunks list. (In better times, when most of the posts were >>> on-topic.) Prior to the revelation of NSA's massive data farms (for >>> instance, the one recently revealed in Utah), even the ordinary >>> POTS (plain old telephone system) was 'fair' in security, in the >>> sense that the large majority of the 'wheat' (the stuff the NSA >>> wants to record, store, and search for) was immersed in a ton of >>> 'chaff', the billions of phone calls made on a daily basis. The >>> government couldn't look at information that they didn't know >>> existed, and didn't have a copy of. Relatively good would be >>> encrypted security that cannot be (easily) broken by even the NSA. >>> >>> Even better would be a system which eliminates metadata, sort of >>> a Tor-ized cell phone system. Why doesn't that currently exist? A >>> start would be if the major cell-phone companies publicly announced >>> that they refuse to even collect such metadata, or at least it >>> would be automatically erased at the end of each individual phone >>> call. (Since most phone billing is no longer sensitive to >>> distance, or even time, why record such information in a central >>> location?) >>> >>> Such an announcement would not be automatically believable, >>> especially to cynics like us, but the long-term non-existence of >>> news of criminal trials which actually admitted such evidence would >>> tend to convince the public that the evidence is either not being >>> collected at all, or at least is only being used secret, and not >>> openly in criminal trials. >>> >>>> Is that even possible unless you: >>>> 1) personally pick up your phone off the factory >>>> floor production line at random? >>> >>> To _us_, the cypherpunks, the answer is obviously "no". But if just >>> about everybody had phones installed with 'good' (rather than >>> 'perfect') encryption, encryption that it would take a large amount >>> of the NSA's resources to crack, we'd be living in a far better >>> world than what we have now. An even better addition would be a >>> system which actually made the NSA _FEAR_ to use such surveillance >>> results. Would the average telephone user be willing to spend 10 >>> cents per month to supply a fund to kill any government worker who >>> assisted in the recording, storage, decrypting, or using such >>> recorded information, including prosecutors, judges, and government >>> investigators in criminal trials? $25 million per month, in >>> America, would buy 250 deaths at $100,000 each, per month. Somehow, >>> I think that this would solve the problem. >>> >>> Jim Bell >>> >