Todd: Oh I often see email that has a "mail from" of "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" - which means nothing. In most cases, these are bogus addresses. I can generate tons of spam that appears to come from YOUR email address - even though you are not a spammer.
What counts is, whether the mail was actually sent from AOL's mail servers. When I trace the TRUE source of the email, it usually is never truly from AOL. Best Regards Andy Schmidt Phone: +1 201 934-3414 x20 (Business) Fax: +1 201 934-9206 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Todd Holt Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 07:12 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] AOL and Reverse DNS > SPAM from AOL accounts - hm, I have to admit that I only see an > (automatically selected) cross-section of spam messages with header (which > are routed to SPAMCOP for analysis) - but I can't remember seeing AOL as > an implicated party often (if ever). I am interpreting this statement as you don't think AOL users are a source of spam. Here is a small sample of addresses in our kill.lst that have been added because they send spam: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If AOL is so interested in stopping spam, they should start with their own users! I think that they only want to stop inbound spam because that doesn't come from paying customers. Outbound spam, on the other hand, shouldn't be touched (in AOLs terms) because you wouldn't want to make a paying customer mad, would you? Well I scan all emails, both directions. It's a violation of our TOS to send spam and I want to stop it. Todd Holt Xidix Technologies, Inc Las Vegas, NV USA www.xidix.com 702.319.4349 > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Declude.JunkMail- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Schmidt > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 10:18 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] AOL and Reverse DNS > > Good point, they should be more accessible. That would be my biggest > complaint with most black-lists. > > As far as policies - as long as their policy is simply to follow RFCs (or > universally agreed recommendations, e.g. no open relays/proxies), I don't > see any obligation on their end to try to put everyone on notice. The > RFCs were notice enough for years. > > SPAM from AOL accounts - hm, I have to admit that I only see an > (automatically selected) cross-section of spam messages with header (which > are routed to SPAMCOP for analysis) - but I can't remember seeing AOL as > an > implicated party often (if ever). > > Best Regards > Andy Schmidt > > H&M Systems Software, Inc. > 600 East Crescent Avenue, Suite 203 > Upper Saddle River, NJ 07458-1846 > > Phone: +1 201 934-3414 x20 (Business) > Fax: +1 201 934-9206 > > http://www.HM-Software.com/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Todd Holt > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 12:09 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] AOL and Reverse DNS > > > >AOL is implementing the very same "checks" that we are using in > Declude. > This is true. > > >So what's the whining all about? > 1. AOL publishes a policy that they don't adhere to. > 2. The policy changes regularly. > 3. If we have a problem sending mail to them, they are unreachable. 4. > They are pointing fingers at us "little guys" as the problem. How > many spam > have > you received from an AOL account? > > I can only speak for myself, but none of those apply to me. > > Todd Holt > Xidix Technologies, Inc > Las Vegas, NV USA > www.xidix.com > 702.319.4349 > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Declude.JunkMail- > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Schmidt > > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 10:40 PM > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] AOL and Reverse DNS > > > > Exactly, Chuck. > > > > AOL is implementing the very same "checks" that we are using in > Declude. > > So > > what's the whining all about? I've been desperately waiting for years > for > > some of the big players to enforce standards (e.g., reverse DNS) and > > prudent practices (e.g., no open relays, mail servers on dynamic IPs > > have to > relay > > through their providers). I applaud AOL and hope Yahoo and Hotmail > follow > > suit soon. > > > > Then I can move the Reverse DNS failures and the Open Relay and DUL > RBLs > > from a carefully chosen weight to straight DELETE - and simply adopt > > "industry standards". > > > > If someone complains, I no longer have to "defend" to business > managers, > > why > > my servers are the "only" ones bouncing some moron's email - because > that > > point won't be made anymore. > > > > Even better, it will force wanna-be mail-admin's to either learn their > > trade or to get someone do to it right. Not every tinkerer who runs > > Windows NT/2000/XP workstation on their DSL or Cable modem at home > > needs to > run > > personal web services and turn on SMTP (ideally in open relay mode) - > if > > they do, they can do it for their own entertainment. But unless they > do it > > correctly (e.g., define a smart host), their mails won't be delivered > to > > the > > outside world. Nothing wrong with that. > > > > Best Regards > > Andy Schmidt > > > > Phone: +1 201 934-3414 x20 (Business) > > Fax: +1 201 934-9206 > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck Schick > > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 12:07 AM > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] AOL and Reverse DNS > > > > > > I will disagree. I do not believe there is any comparison between MS > EULA > > and AOL mail policies. I do not see AOL's actions as the > > "...internet-nazi-police tactics..." as you claim. I do not see where > AOL > > is gaining any competitive advantage, they are simply trying to > protect > > their network and client base the same as many of us. I have picked > up > > many > > AOL customers for Internet access because they could no longer stand > the > > spam in their AOL mail accounts. > > > > I actually applaud AOL doing this - it will force many people to get a > > reverse DNS entry and maybe they will fix their DNS record along the > way. > > If I block people because of Reverse DNS, the blocked entity will > simply > > criticize our policies. If AOL blocks them they will fix their rdns. > > > > If more mail servers had the MX records and reverse DNS entries, I > could > > tighten up my filtering because I would have less worries about > blocking > > legitimate mail from badly configured mail servers. > > > > I guess I do not see the problem - it is not much different than when > most > > ISPs started blocking Port 25 for access. Or implemented SMTP > > Authentication. > > > > Just me 2 cents on the subject. > > > > Chuck Schick > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > > From: "Todd Holt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:32:57 -0800 > > > > >I know this will stir a few people the wrong way, but. > > > > > >If so many people are upset that MS is being monopolistic by using > > >their EULA to prevent software from operating, then why don't those > > >same people get upset at AOL for the internet-nazi-police tactics > used > > >to prevent mail from being delivered? > > > > > >MS just says that you can't use certain apps on their OS. AOL says > > >that you can't deliver mail through mail servers (that control more > > >email than any other on the planet) because they deemed it "bad" > > >through inaccurate, generalized and dare I say "monopolistic" > policies. > > > > > >The lack of complaints about AOL just shows that the MS bashers are > not > > >upset about the MS policies (or monopoly), they just want to complain > > >about the big company on the block. I think if the majority owner of > > >AOL was the richest person on the planet, they would bash AOL. How > > >short sided!!! > > > > > >Further, all of the justice dept. proceedings are based on complaints > > >by the competition, not the users. On the other hand, AOL has > > >thousands of consumer complaints, but very few (if any) complaints by > > >competitors. It's obvious that the justice dept. just wants to > appease > > >whiny losers like Jim Barksdale and Scott McNealy. And the MS > bashers > > >just fall in line. Lemmings. Todd Holt > > >Xidix Technologies, Inc > > >Las Vegas, NV USA > > >www.xidix.com > > >702.319.4349 > > > > > > > --- > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > > (http://www.declude.com)] > > > > --- > > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, > > just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe > > Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at > > http://www.mail-archive.com. > > > > --- > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > > (http://www.declude.com)] > > > > --- > > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type > > "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at > > http://www.mail-archive.com. > > --- > > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > > (http://www.declude.com)] > > > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > (http://www.declude.com)] > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > (http://www.declude.com)] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, > just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe > Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at > http://www.mail-archive.com. > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > (http://www.declude.com)] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type > "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at > http://www.mail-archive.com. > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus > (http://www.declude.com)] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
