Josh - You are 100% correct on that - I appreciate you calling it out. In re-reading this, I think that came out sideways and significantly harsher from what I intended. My apologies to Benedict and Aleksey.
My (poorly made) point was that collaboration is the lifeblood of any open source project. It will require extra work but sometimes large complex efforts require a level of pragmatism that can be at odds with this goal. On Sun, Apr 14, 2019 at 12:28 AM Joshua McKenzie <jmcken...@apache.org> wrote: > > > > > a couple of people (even if I know them personally, > > consider them friends and are both among the best engineers i've ever > > met) going off in a room and producing something in isolation is more > > or less a giant "f*k you" to the open source process and our community > > as a whole. > > Two engineers who are co-located who spend a couple months collaborating on > something before opening it up for broad consensus debate is hardly as > extreme as I think you're characterizing it. If we want to have a formal > process on this project where people preemptively get consensus on any work > greater than some arbitrary LoC or complexity metric, that's fine, but > let's not retcon this and try and impose restrictions or interpretations on > peoples' behavior after the fact. > > Everyone acted in good faith here. Collaborating internationally with > dozens of engineers is Hard; let's assume the best of each other. > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 5:45 PM Nate McCall <zznat...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > As someone who has been here a (very) long time and worked on C* in > > production envs. back to version 0.4, this large patch - taken by > > itself - does, to be frank, scare the shit out of me. In a complex > > system any large change will have side effects impossible to > > anticipate. I have seen this hold true too many times. > > > > That said, I think we all agree that internode has been a source of > > warts since Facebook spun this out 10+ yrs ago and that we are all > > tired of applying bandaides. > > > > As has been talked to else thread - and this is the super crucial > > point for me - we also have a substantially better testing story > > internally and externally coming together than at any point in the > > projects past. > > > > This next part is partially selfish, but I want to be 100% clear is in > > the immediate interests of the project's future: > > I am getting on stage in about a month to keynote the first Cassandra > > focused event with any notable attendance we have had for a long time. > > We are then all going out to vegas in Sept. to discuss the future of > > our project and ideally have some cool use cases to show a bunch of > > users. > > > > For both of these, we need a story to tell. It needs to be clear and > > cohesive. And I think it's super important to get in front of these > > people and have part of this story be "we took three years because we > > didnt compromise on quality." If we dont have our shit together here I > > think we will start loosing users at a much faster pace and we > > seriously risk becoming "that thing you can run only if you are a > > large company and can put a bunch of people on it who know it > > intimately." Whether that is the case or not, *it will* be the > > perception. We are just running out of time. > > > > So back to this patch: on the surface, it fixes a lot of stuff and > > puts us on the right track for the future. I'm willing to set aside > > the number of times I've been burned over the past decade because I > > think we are in a much better position - as a whole community - to > > find, report and fix issues this patch will introduce and do so much > > faster than we ever have. > > > > I do want to end this with one more point because it needs to be > > called out: a couple of people (even if I know them personally, > > consider them friends and are both among the best engineers i've ever > > met) going off in a room and producing something in isolation is more > > or less a giant "f*k you" to the open source process and our community > > as a whole. Internode is a particularly complex, messy, baggage ridden > > component where there is an argument to be made that uninterrupted > > concentration was the only way to achieve this, but it must be > > understood that the perception of actions like this is toe stepping, > > devaluation of opinions and is generally not conducive to holding a > > community together. Again, i doubt this was the intention, but it is > > the perception. Please let's avoid this in the future. > > > > In sum, +1. I wish this process were smoother but we're running out of > > time. > > > > -Nate > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@cassandra.apache.org > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@cassandra.apache.org