Awesome video!!
On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 3:43 AM, Erik Jan de Wit <ede...@redhat.com> wrote: > On the topic of IDE support my collage Gorkem has made a nice wizard in > eclipse that mimics the CLI have a look at this video > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUyUUtmTYok > > On 18 Oct,2013, at 4:29 , Maxime LUCE <max...@somatic.fr> wrote: > > > Great Bryan > > Totally agree !!! > > > > Cordialement. > > ------------------------------- > > Maxime LUCE - Somatic > > maxime.l...@somatic.fr > > 06 28 60 72 34 > > ________________________________ > > De : Brian LeRoux<mailto:b...@brian.io> > > Envoyé : 18/10/2013 01:48 > > À : dev@cordova.apache.org<mailto:dev@cordova.apache.org> > > Objet : Re: config.xml discussion, we need to talk > > > > I don't really appreciate comments that we don't talk to our users, or > build apps in anger. Neither of those assertions are true. The origins of > these initiatives are based on both community feedback, and direct > experience. > > > > Keeping your focus on just pure platform side of a project is fine, of > course, since the CLI delegates to the platform. This was also a deliberate > learning from MANY attempts at an architecture that satisfies both > approaches. It separates the concerns and respects the platform will be > canonical for the common workflows supported. This is a very real example > of Conway's Law btw. [1] > > > > Anyhow. Deep breath! Software has bugs, people will report them, and > we'll continue to improve. This is a very large group with a very diverse > community that spans regular old hackers to the humble web designers. We > need to respect that, and maybe be a little more compassionate to each > other too. All software is fucked up, and at the end of the day, it is our > perpetual job to make it a little less fucked up. > > > > [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway's_law > > > > > > [Inline image 1] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 1:16 PM, Tommy Williams <to...@devgeeks.org > <mailto:to...@devgeeks.org>> wrote: > > Late to the party due to timezone fun, but I just want to chime in in > > support of the CLI. > > > > As a dev working on an actual nontrivial "real world" app, I would like > to > > let it be known that we (SpiderOak) have been heavy drinkers of the CLI > > Kool-Aid since its infancy. > > > > We have even managed to get to the point where ./platforms/**/* is just a > > build artefact (mostly by using hooks and tying the whole thing together > > with Grunt). > > > > We have a fast and fairly complex app (both many core plugins as well > and a > > few custom/third party ones), that even includes the ability to white > label > > it with relative ease. > > > > I feel pretty strongly in favour of the CLI and strongly advocate its use > > when asked in the #phonegap IRC channel. > > > > Just my opinion, but thought it was important to add to the discussion. > > > > - tommy / devgeeks > > On 18 Oct 2013 04:44, "Anis KADRI" <anis.ka...@gmail.com<mailto: > anis.ka...@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > >> Sweet. So I think we all agree (expect Joe perhaps?) that both > >> approaches should be supported :-) > >> > >> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 10:31 AM, Carlos Santana <csantan...@gmail.com > <mailto:csantan...@gmail.com>> > >> wrote: > >>> I meant in addition of ".cordova/lib" also allow also to do something > >> like > >>> "cordova platform add ios --path="./cordova_components/cordova-ios" > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 1:28 PM, Carlos Santana <csantan...@gmail.com > <mailto:csantan...@gmail.com> > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> ++1 "to install from a given directory instead of .cordova/libs." > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Viras <vi...@users.sourceforge.net > <mailto:vi...@users.sourceforge.net> > >>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> This might be true - it took me quite some time to figure out how the > >> CLI > >>>>> actually works - despite also having to fix one or two bugs for the > WPX > >>>>> implementation of the CLI code (as well as the Windows 8 CLI code). > But > >>>>> still I would hate to see the CLI go, since I think once you are used > >> to > >>>>> it, it saves you quite a lot of time (I still have those old > documents > >>>>> which guide me through the setup of the IDE projects for the > different > >>>>> platforms - which is now mostly obsolete). > >>>>> > >>>>> So I guess supporting both methods is the way to go... :) > >>>>> > >>>>> Best, > >>>>> Wolfgang > >>>>> > >>>>> Am 2013-10-17 16:13, schrieb Michal Mocny: > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks so much for chiming in, I'm very happy to see that you've > >> figured > >>>>>> out how to leverage the benefits and avoid the drawbacks of the new > >>>>>> workflow, and that it has led to increased productivity for you. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I do think that perhaps it is still too difficult for every > developer > >> to > >>>>>> learn what you already have. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -Michal > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 12:13 AM, Viras < > vi...@users.sourceforge.net<mailto:vi...@users.sourceforge.net>> > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> my view on this discussion: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> I've used the CLI to release the latest version of GOFG Sports > >> Computer > >>>>>>> for Windows Phone. The support for the "merges" directory is a > >> fantastic > >>>>>>> feature which allows me to focus on the javascript code using e.g. > >> the > >>>>>>> NetBeans IDE - I can finally handle all my platform specific code > >> from > >>>>>>> JavaScript in one consistent directory structure - which is what > >> Cordova > >>>>>>> should be about. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> In addition the CLI forces you to write clean code (not implying > that > >>>>>>> the > >>>>>>> other method forces to write messy code). If you need something > >> native > >>>>>>> write a clean plugin for it (which also makes the code reusable) - > no > >>>>>>> need > >>>>>>> to mess around in the native projects code - this also makes > >> upgrading > >>>>>>> cordova much easier. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Once I've done the Windows Phone version I've simply added Android > >> as a > >>>>>>> platform, build it and I was done - no need for fiddling around > with > >>>>>>> SDK / > >>>>>>> IDE setup etc (besides actually installing it). So CLI is my > favorite > >>>>>>> way > >>>>>>> to develop now - and it is far more powerful than the old approach > >> (in > >>>>>>> my > >>>>>>> opinion) - since it saves you from fiddling around with project > >>>>>>> settings, > >>>>>>> etc. when you do a multi-platform release. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Oh yes - and GOFG SC uses two custom plugins, 5 official plugins > and > >>>>>>> cordova 3.0 - so it is a bit beyond the "Hello World" > application.... > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> And I do not agree that it isn't possible to work with the native > >> IDEs > >>>>>>> with their own projects - this is simply wrong since you can always > >> go > >>>>>>> to > >>>>>>> the "platforms" directory and open the platform-projects using > their > >>>>>>> native > >>>>>>> IDE from there (I've done this myself for e.g. plugin development). > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Still I agree that both versions should be supported - but don't > make > >>>>>>> the > >>>>>>> assumption that the CLI is for "n00bs" only! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Best, > >>>>>>> Wolfgang > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Am 2013-10-16 23:11, schrieb Joe Bowser: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 16, 2013 at 1:37 PM, Michal Mocny <mmo...@chromium.org > <mailto:mmo...@chromium.org>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Anis: Totally agrees, but its important to highlight that both > >>>>>>>>> directions > >>>>>>>>> for that arguments hold. We've done our best to support bin/ > >> scripts > >>>>>>>>> post > >>>>>>>>> 3.0, yet blanket statements like "CLI should not be used with > >> IDE", or > >>>>>>>>> "CLI > >>>>>>>>> sucks unless you just doing something trivial" are being thrown > >>>>>>>>> around, > >>>>>>>>> which are harmful in my opinion, and I don't think its fair that > >> some > >>>>>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>> us > >>>>>>>>> are promoting that message to users. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> I don't think we're communicating with our users at all, so I > >> don't > >>>>>>>> see how this could be communicated. When users communicate their > >>>>>>>> frustrations, it's usually something like this > >>>>>>>> (http://www.infil00p.org/****config-xml-changes-for-ios-**< > >> http://www.infil00p.org/**config-xml-changes-for-ios-**> > >>>>>>>> and-android/#comment-10731<htt**p://www.infil00p.org/config-**< > http://www.infil00p.org/config-**> > >>>>>>>> xml-changes-for-ios-and-**android/#comment-10731< > >> > http://www.infil00p.org/config-xml-changes-for-ios-and-android/#comment-10731 > >>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> ) > >>>>>>>> and this > >>>>>>>> (http://www.infil00p.org/****introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-****< > >> http://www.infil00p.org/**introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-**> > >>>>>>>> android/#comment-10694<http://**www.infil00p.org/introducing-**< > http://www.infil00p.org/introducing-**> > >>>>>>>> cordova-3-0-0-for-android/#**comment-10694< > >> > http://www.infil00p.org/introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-android/#comment-10694 > >>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> ). > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> CLI works well for me, and while its not perfect, I strive to > learn > >>>>>>>> its > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> limitations and make it better, not condemn it. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I avoid it because it's not developed for me, or developers like > me > >>>>>>>> who like to see a big pile of output when things fail. I avoided > >>>>>>>> having any part in its development because I thought it was the > >> wrong > >>>>>>>> way to do things. I assumed that the majority of users actually > >>>>>>>> wanted this and that I should do my best to work around this, but > >> with > >>>>>>>> the backlash that we're getting, such as the blog posts and some > >>>>>>>> comments on the Google Groups, it seems that this is a feature > very > >>>>>>>> few people actually wanted. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> As far as the CordovaWebView use case, I actually have never tried > >>>>>>>> that. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Has anyone bothered to make sure it works well post-3.0, or does > >> Joe > >>>>>>>>> have > >>>>>>>>> a point that we missed addressing this? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> We have JUnit unit tests in the Android repository to make sure > that > >>>>>>>> this still works. However, I would like to see this test case > >>>>>>>> revisited since it may be more appropriate to have CordovaActivity > >> be > >>>>>>>> inherited instead of CordovaInterface, or for both to be > supported. > >>>>>>>> This is so that we can make more hybrid applications and deal with > >> the > >>>>>>>> fact that we're so brutally non-complaint with Android UI > guidelines > >>>>>>>> instead of just ignoring it. I'll probably bring this up and > >> present > >>>>>>>> more source code when it's ready to explain why we need this > feature > >>>>>>>> in the next couple of weeks, and why it's important to respect the > >>>>>>>> platform, even when the platform doesn't respect the web. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> GOFG - Get On Fat Guy > >>>>>>> http://www.gofg.at/ - powered by Cordova > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> GOFG - Get On Fat Guy > >>>>> http://www.gofg.at/ - powered by Cordova > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> Carlos Santana > >>>> <csantan...@gmail.com<mailto:csantan...@gmail.com>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Carlos Santana > >>> <csantan...@gmail.com<mailto:csantan...@gmail.com>> > >> > > > >
