On Sat, Jun 29, 2019 at 1:20 PM Jim Jagielski <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
> On 2019/06/29 04:48:56, Craig Russell <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Given the D&I objectives for this program, I'd say that code is a
> byproduct and not the deliverable.
> >
> > If the objective of the program were code deliverables, this process
> would be completely different. And we would certainly pay folks more than
> $10/hour for their contributions.
> >
> > Craig
> >
>
> Craig, I appreciate the thought that went into this, but I also feel that
> the thought process is flawed. It appears that the goal was to figure out
> some way to justify funding outreach, and trying to find some way to
> justify doing so. Instead, as a member of the board, as well as the ASF, it
> should have started with the mindset that we have a policy, and does using
> Outreachy via a pass-thru violate the letter and the spirit of that policy.
>
> Somehow defining code as a “side product” is a mistake, I think. It is
> like saying that code is a byproduct of the ASF and so really, when you get
> down to it, anything and everything is ok. It is simple verbal “games”
> meant to obfuscate.
>

Community Over Code may imply Code is secondary or byproduct of a software
project at Apache. In reality, code and community are of equal importance.


> Basically, the standpoint is “funding outreach via a pass-thru is
> important and therefore we need to figure out some way to avoid or justify
> getting around a 20+ year policy”. I think that places the wants of D&I
> above the needs of the ASF.
>
> Again, I need to stress, I have failed to see any valid reason why the ASF
> MUST pass-thru or even fund Outreachy directly when we have sponsors
> willing to fund Outreachy themselves and we operate under a GSoC type
> model. The only reasons I can see which have been proposed  “it make it
> sucky for the sponsor (with no supporting data to back up that statement)”
> or “its only 0.x% of our budget and we should do it (the assumption being
> that we should be able to ignore basic tenets of the ASF as long as it
> doesn’t cost too much).
>
> Make no mistake, this is a violation of ASF policy. It directly impacts
> our projects, by having a commt intrude on their development and should the
> board approve, it is tacitly allowing a “president’s cmmt” to do something
> that is expressly forbidden in the bylaws.
>
> Finally, I find it sad that this cmmt finds it within its pursue to work
> out ways around ASF policy when there is so much more it can, and should be
> doing. That the 1st major effort of this cmmt is something controversial,
> something directly attacking ASF policy, instead of all the things the
> board, and the membership were told they were *going to do* is
> disheartening. This is not how you handle D&I, this is not how you change
> hearts and minds, and the fact that, IMO, that the cmmt is blinded by
> funding Outreachy, no matter what the costs, have staked their reputation
> and the reputation of the ASF on a hill for no viable nor rational reason.
> All most assuredly IMO.
>
> I sincerely ask this cmmt to respect those numerous people, who have been
> around for decades, who not only “drafted” the Apache Way but also
> protected it (it being one of the main reasons for our success for 20+
> years), who clearly but unabashedly state that funding Outreachy directly,
> or as a pass-thru, does, indeed, in their opinion, violate this tenet. Even
> mathematically, the vast number of years of experience, as members,
> directors and officers, of those saying “no”, far, far, far outweighs that
> of those saying “yes”. That should be telling and, I hope, the cmmt members
> take that in mind.
>

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