On Fri, 28 Feb 2025 at 03:06, Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me> wrote:
> As Toshiya has highlighted, not only does the legacy API fail for
> traditional rule orchestration, but the new "Kogito way" also does not
> provide the minimal functionality needed to orchestrate rules
> properly. Unfortunately, the current Business Rule Task is almost
> useless without the proper support of Drools data structures required
> by RuleUnits.
>
> Consequently, the current state of the codebase leaves the broader
> concept of rule orchestration unaddressed. This oversight presents a
> significant challenge for Drools users transitioning to the 10 series,
> potentially alienating a large user base.
>
> To address these issues, I propose the following steps:
>
> 1 - Immediate Fix: Resolve the issue with the legacy API as initially
> identified. While deprecation of the old system is acceptable for
> stateful workflow scenarios, Drools users depend on it for rule
> orchestration. Implementing this fix would serve as a temporary
> solution with a limited lifespan.
>
+1
>
> 2 - Long-Term Enhancement: Enhance the current Business Rule Task to
> ensure seamless integration with the Rule Engine. This involves
> refining the interaction points surrounding the rule engine to provide
> a robust and reliable orchestration mechanism.
>
+1
>
> It's worth noting that while alternatives like manually orchestrated
> Rule Units using Java code or pure DRL-based approaches exist, they do
> not offer the intuitive graphical visualization of rule orchestration
> that Drools historically provided. Maintaining this visual aspect is
> crucial for user experience and system transparency.
>
+1
I agree, this is functionality that a lot of users liked, none of this
should be too difficult to achieve.
Regards
Mark
>
> -
> Alex
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 27, 2025 at 1:32 AM Toshiya Kobayashi
> <toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I talked with Alex that the current KIE 10 supported approach "bpmn2
> > RuleSetNode with kogito-codegen + RuleUnit" doesn't cover all migration
> use
> > cases of drools 7 ruleflow.
> >
> > So I'd like to confirm possible directions.
> >
> > ----
> > A) Create a small subset of bpmn parser and engine (apart from the kogito
> > bpmn code base), which aims at only ruleflow (Start, End, Rule, Gateway).
> >
> > pros: Users can use the existing bpmn editor to author ruleflow bpmn
> > files.
> > No need for a migration tool.
> >
> > cons: It will likely have some duplication with the kogito bpmn code
> base.
> >
> > B) Create a new feature to support ruleflow. e.g. only changing
> > ruleflow-group with/without conditions. It may or may not be like .rf
> file
> >
> > * Note: This option's pros and cons are ambiguous as the details are
> not
> > yet defined
> >
> > pros: The implementation may be smaller than bpmn
> >
> > cons: Developing a migration tool would require some effort. (or no
> > migration tool)
> > Developing an authoring UI tool would require some effort. (or no
> > authoring tool)
> >
> > C) Just guide how to migrate ruleflow to drl and java code.
> >
> > pros: No additional development
> >
> > cons: Probably it's not possible to create a migration tool. It may
> > require a large effort if a user has lots of ruleflows
> > ----
> >
> > Feel free to share your thoughts or preference.
> >
> > Personally, I like option C for the short-term and option A for the
> > mid-term.
> >
> > This is not a proposal. I just want to know the preference in this dev
> list
> > members and file a GH issue. Even if option A or B is preferred, I (or
> we)
> > may not have time to work on that right now. But it would be useful to
> > guide community users with the direction.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Toshiya
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 2:41 PM Toshiya Kobayashi <
> > toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Alex,
> > >
> > > In the recent posts in this thread, I see that you are confirming the
> > > steps to run a process with kogito codegen in KIE 10. You seem to be
> > > exploring a migration guidance for community users who want to use a
> > > ruleflow in KIE 10, correct?
> > >
> > > So it will be another option like the ones I posted, right?
> > >
> > > > A) Create a small subset of bpmn parser and engine (apart from the
> > > kogito bpmn code base), which aims at only ruleflow (Start, End, Rule,
> > > Gateway).
> > > >
> > > > B) Create a new feature to support ruleflow. e.g. only changing
> > > ruleflow-group with/without conditions. It may or may not be like .rf
> file
> > > >
> > > > C) Just guide how to migrate ruleflow to drl and java code.
> > >
> > > I may be missing a point. I just wanted to proceed with the discussion.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Toshiya
> > >
> > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2025 at 12:26 AM Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I managed to figure out... for those that are also unsure how to start
> > >> a process using Java API... here's (the bpmn file has an ID which
> > >> value is "demo1"):
> > >>
> > >> import java.util.HashMap;
> > >> import java.util.Map;
> > >> import org.kie.kogito.Model;
> > >> import jakarta.enterprise.context.ApplicationScoped;
> > >> import jakarta.inject.Inject;
> > >> import jakarta.inject.Named;
> > >> import org.kie.kogito.process.Process;
> > >> import org.kie.kogito.process.ProcessInstance;
> > >>
> > >> @ApplicationScoped
> > >> public class MyCustomService {
> > >> @Inject
> > >> @Named("demo1")
> > >> Process<? extends Model> myProcess;
> > >>
> > >> public String startMyProcess() {
> > >> Model m = myProcess.createModel();
> > >> Map<String, Object> parameters = new HashMap<>();
> > >> parameters.put("name", "Alex");
> > >> m.fromMap(parameters);
> > >>
> > >> ProcessInstance<?> processInstance =
> myProcess.createInstance(m);
> > >> processInstance.start();
> > >>
> > >> Model result = (Model) processInstance.variables();
> > >>
> > >> return result.toMap().get("message").toString();
> > >> }
> > >> }
> > >>
> > >> On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 3:30 PM Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me>
> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > Enrique,
> > >> >
> > >> > I'm not using any IDE, maven can't compile sources that have
> > >> > references to classes defined in generated-sources.
> > >> >
> > >> > I might be missing something, I'd appreciate it if you could share a
> > >> > project with such a config that I could compile with just maven cli.
> > >> >
> > >> > On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 2:59 PM Enrique Gonzalez Martinez
> > >> > <elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > The generated sources should be incorporated by your ide in the
> source
> > >> > > paths like maven is doing. It works in eclipse at least. I dont
> know
> > >> other
> > >> > > ide.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > El mar, 21 ene 2025, 20:56, Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me>
> > >> escribió:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > > Enrique,
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > To code-gen process Apache KIE resources I need to execute one
> of
> > >> the
> > >> > > > following commands: mvn quarkus:build, mvn quarkus:dev, mvn
> > >> package.
> > >> > > > The generated sources are output to the target/generated-sources
> > >> > > > directory. However, I’ve noticed that these generated sources
> are
> > >> not
> > >> > > > accessible from the src/main folder. This is making it
> difficult to
> > >> > > > integrate the generated code into the main project workflow.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Am I missing something?
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > -
> > >> > > > Alex
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 12:57 PM Enrique Gonzalez Martinez
> > >> > > > <elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > I don't see why. If you want to create a workflow.
> > >> > > > > 1 define it
> > >> > > > > 2 codegen
> > >> > > > > 3 compile it
> > >> > > > > 4 runtime
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > There is no cycle
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > El mar, 21 ene 2025, 18:54, Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me>
> > >> escribió:
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > > If code-gen is required, don’t we have a chicken-egg
> problem?
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > How users can use an API that will be generated in the
> future?
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > -
> > >> > > > > > Alex
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 12:47 PM Enrique Gonzalez Martinez <
> > >> > > > > > elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > The kie api is a library inside the runtimes project and
> the
> > >> > > > > > implementation
> > >> > > > > > > of the start is in jbpm-flow project. Related to the
> process
> > >> > > > definition
> > >> > > > > > > requires codegen.
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > El mar, 21 ene 2025, 18:15, Alex Porcelli <
> a...@porcelli.me>
> > >> > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > Thank you for the reference, Enrique.
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > But how is this API supposed to work? I mean… it’s part
> of
> > >> the
> > >> > > > codegen
> > >> > > > > > > > (during build) that the Model class is generated for the
> > >> current
> > >> > > > > > project.
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > -
> > >> > > > > > > > Alex
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 10:06 AM Enrique Gonzalez
> Martinez <
> > >> > > > > > > > elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > This is an example... Even if you are a listener this
> > >> should be
> > >> > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > endpoint. For some reason internal api and exposed api
> > >> became
> > >> > > > > > > > > entangled at some point so even if you go low code if
> you
> > >> want
> > >> > > > > > > > > persistence it should be like this.
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> https://github.com/kiegroup/kogito-runtimes/blob/main/jbpm/jbpm-tests/src/test/java/org/jbpm/bpmn2/ActivityTest.java#L233-L234
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > El mar, 21 ene 2025 a las 10:10, Toshiya Kobayashi
> > >> > > > > > > > > (<toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com>) escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > Hi Enrique,
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dont use kie session start workflow. Kie-api
> should
> > >> be used
> > >> > > > > > > instead.
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > My example is a plain java in-memory ruleflow use
> case
> > >> (not a
> > >> > > > > > > > persistent
> > >> > > > > > > > > > process nor a kogito service).
> ksession.startProcess()
> > >> is the
> > >> > > > only
> > >> > > > > > > way
> > >> > > > > > > > I
> > >> > > > > > > > > > know to start a ruleflow.
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > Could you let me know the right method which you
> > >> mentioned as
> > >> > > > > > > "Kie-api
> > >> > > > > > > > > > should be used instead" ?
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > Toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 2:52 PM Enrique Gonzalez
> > >> Martinez <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dont use kie session start workflow. Kie-api
> should
> > >> be used
> > >> > > > > > > instead.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > El mar, 21 ene 2025, 3:54, Toshiya Kobayashi <
> > >> > > > > > > > > toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com>
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > but my concern is that it feels that we are
> back
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > almost 20 years ago, just before we introduce
> > >> RulesFlow.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it's true. This is the most basic solution
> and
> > >> the
> > >> > > > only
> > >> > > > > > > > > supported
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > solution as of 10.0.0 + kjar.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > would it be possible to point an
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > example (or unit test) how to start a workflow
> > >> using
> > >> > > > plain
> > >> > > > > > java
> > >> > > > > > > > > api?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > kSession.startProcess(processId) starts a bpmn
> > >> process.
> > >> > > > It's
> > >> > > > > > > > > supported in
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 7.74.0.Final.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> https://github.com/tkobayas/kiegroup-examples/blob/master/Ex-ruleflow-migration/Ex-ruleflow-bpmn-7.74/src/main/java/com/sample/DroolsTest.java#L21
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > It also works in 10.0.0, but it depends on a
> legacy
> > >> runtime
> > >> > > > > > which
> > >> > > > > > > > > will be
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > removed as Enrique mentioned.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> https://github.com/tkobayas/kiegroup-examples/blob/master/Ex-ruleflow-10.0.0/src/main/java/com/sample/DroolsTest.java#L17
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > However, I guess Alex is asking for something
> > >> different...
> > >> > > > > > Please
> > >> > > > > > > > > let me
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > know the requirements in detail.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 11:06 PM Alex Porcelli <
> > >> > > > > > a...@porcelli.me
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Another somewhat related question: would it be
> > >> possible
> > >> > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > point
> > >> > > > > > > > an
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > example (or unit test) how to start a workflow
> > >> using
> > >> > > > plain
> > >> > > > > > java
> > >> > > > > > > > > api?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 8:53 AM Enrique
> Gonzalez
> > >> Martinez
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > <elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Given the current native implementation, it
> is
> > >> not
> > >> > > > > > possible.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > You would need to rework the rule node in
> > >> workflow
> > >> > > > > > probably.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > El lun, 20 ene 2025, 14:50, Alex Porcelli <
> > >> > > > > > a...@porcelli.me>
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Enrique,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My question still.. How is it possible to
> > >> load a
> > >> > > > bunch of
> > >> > > > > > > > data
> > >> > > > > > > > > into
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Drools and orchestrate multiple groups of
> > >> rules
> > >> > > > without
> > >> > > > > > > > having
> > >> > > > > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > iterate over and over again on those
> loads of
> > >> data.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 16, 2025 at 11:49 AM Enrique
> > >> Gonzalez
> > >> > > > > > Martinez
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Alex,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The only reason working memory exists in
> > >> BPMN is
> > >> > > > to be
> > >> > > > > > > used
> > >> > > > > > > > > in
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > conditional nodes which does not make
> much
> > >> sense
> > >> > > > IMO.
> > >> > > > > > > (the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > replacement
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for java conditional was already on the
> way)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This was dropped at some point in kogito
> > >> (don't
> > >> > > > know
> > >> > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > reasons
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > why)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but makes sense as working memory access
> > >> does not
> > >> > > > make
> > >> > > > > > > > sense
> > >> > > > > > > > > from
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > workflow engine.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How to orchestrate something like you
> are
> > >> > > > referring is
> > >> > > > > > > more
> > >> > > > > > > > > rule
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > engine
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > side.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El jue, 16 ene 2025 a las 17:05, Tibor
> > >> Zimányi (<
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > tzima...@apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Alex,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the orchestration could be
> done
> > >> with rule
> > >> > > > > > units
> > >> > > > > > > > > instead
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > using a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPMN process to orchestrate the rule
> > >> execution.
> > >> > > > > > However
> > >> > > > > > > > > maybe I
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > am
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > missing
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some context about rule units and I am
> > >> wrong.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tibor
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dňa št 16. 1. 2025, 15:40 Alex
> Porcelli <
> > >> > > > > > > > > porce...@apache.org>
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > napísal(a):
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you Toshiya for the reference.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let me step back ignoring kjar and
> > >> etc... and
> > >> > > > ask:
> > >> > > > > > > > could
> > >> > > > > > > > > you
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > share
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > users can accomplish the same with
> the
> > >> current
> > >> > > > > > state
> > >> > > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > technology?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Use case description:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user, I need - using java api -
> > >> add
> > >> > > > thousands
> > >> > > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > objects
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > working memory and orchestrate 4 or
> 5
> > >> different
> > >> > > > > > > > ruleflow
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > groups
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > and,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at the end of the execution, access
> the
> > >> working
> > >> > > > > > > memory
> > >> > > > > > > > > and
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > iterate
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > over the working memory content.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alex
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 15, 2025 at 4:32 AM
> Toshiya
> > >> > > > Kobayashi
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ah, thanks,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This one:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> https://lists.apache.org/thread/t3o842mbj03c57cg5yw3tmo25qf2br1t
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 15, 2025 at 6:15 PM
> > >> Enrique
> > >> > > > Gonzalez
> > >> > > > > > > > > Martinez <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Search in *this* list drop
> legacy
> > >> runtime
> > >> > > > in
> > >> > > > > > > > > workflow. It
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > is
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > proposal.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El mié, 15 ene 2025, 9:47,
> Toshiya
> > >> > > > Kobayashi <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com>
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, guys.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I searched
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > https://groups.google.com/g/kogito-development
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > ,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but I
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cannot
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > find the discussion about
> kjar.
> > >> Anyway,
> > >> > > > > > Kogito
> > >> > > > > > > > > hasn't
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > supported kjar
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the beginning, so it's a very
> old
> > >> story.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Having said that, options
> seem to
> > >> be:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A) Create a small subset of
> bpmn
> > >> parser
> > >> > > > and
> > >> > > > > > > > engine
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > (apart
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > from
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kogito
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bpmn code base), which aims at
> > >> only
> > >> > > > ruleflow
> > >> > > > > > > > > (Start,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > End,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Rule,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Gateway).
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pros: Users can use the
> > >> existing bpmn
> > >> > > > > > editor
> > >> > > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > author
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ruleflow
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bpmn
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > files.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No need for a
> migration
> > >> tool.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cons: It will likely have
> some
> > >> > > > duplication
> > >> > > > > > > with
> > >> > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > kogito
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bpmn
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > code
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > base.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B) Create a new feature to
> support
> > >> > > > ruleflow.
> > >> > > > > > > e.g.
> > >> > > > > > > > > only
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > changing
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ruleflow-group with/without
> > >> conditions.
> > >> > > > It
> > >> > > > > > may
> > >> > > > > > > or
> > >> > > > > > > > > may
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > not
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > be
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > like .rf
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > file
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Note: This option's pros
> and
> > >> cons are
> > >> > > > > > > > > ambiguous as
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > details
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > are
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > not
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yet defined
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pros: The implementation
> may be
> > >> smaller
> > >> > > > > > than
> > >> > > > > > > > bpmn
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cons: Developing a migration
> > >> tool would
> > >> > > > > > > require
> > >> > > > > > > > > some
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > effort.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (or no
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > migration tool)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Developing an
> authoring
> > >> UI tool
> > >> > > > would
> > >> > > > > > > > > require
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > some
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > effort.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (or no
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > authoring tool)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > C) Just guide how to migrate
> > >> ruleflow to
> > >> > > > drl
> > >> > > > > > > and
> > >> > > > > > > > > java
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > code.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pros: No additional
> development
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cons: Probably it's not
> > >> possible to
> > >> > > > create
> > >> > > > > > a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > migration
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > tool.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It may
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > require a large effort if a
> user
> > >> has
> > >> > > > lots of
> > >> > > > > > > > > ruleflows
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 13, 2025 at
> 6:13 PM
> > >> Enrique
> > >> > > > > > > Gonzalez
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Martinez <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > elguard...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jason,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At the moment we dropped
> > >> support for
> > >> > > > legacy
> > >> > > > > > > > > runtime
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > kjar
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > is
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > not a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > supported
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scenario in workflow.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El vie, 10 ene 2025, 17:24,
> > >> Jason
> > >> > > > Porter
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jpor...@ibm.com.invalid>
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think however this ends
> up
> > >> being
> > >> > > > > > decided
> > >> > > > > > > by
> > >> > > > > > > > > this
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > list, we
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > should
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > post a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> conclusion/example/summary/something
> > >> > > > to
> > >> > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > us...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <mailto:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > us...@kie.apache.org>
> list
> > >> so anyone
> > >> > > > > > > search
> > >> > > > > > > > > that
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > list
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > can
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > see
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Somewhat related to that,
> do
> > >> we want
> > >> > > > to
> > >> > > > > > try
> > >> > > > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > migrate
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > people
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > from
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Google Groups list to the
> > >> users list
> > >> > > > now
> > >> > > > > > > that
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > 10.0.0
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > is
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > released?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jason Porter
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Software Engineer
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He/Him/His
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IBM
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Alex Porcelli <
> > >> > > > porce...@apache.org
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Date: Friday, January 10,
> > >> 2025 at
> > >> > > > 01:41
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: dev@kie.apache.org <
> > >> > > > > > dev@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re:
> > >> [DISCUSSION]
> > >> > > > > > > ruleflow
> > >> > > > > > > > > kjar
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > use
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > case
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you, Toshiya, for
> > >> bringing
> > >> > > > this up
> > >> > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > ML.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For context, I’d like to
> > >> remember
> > >> > > > that
> > >> > > > > > > there
> > >> > > > > > > > > are no
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Drools
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > or
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > jBPM;
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > both
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > are components of Apache
> KIE.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As of today, Apache KIE 10
> > >> supports
> > >> > > > kjar;
> > >> > > > > > > > > Toshiya's
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > example
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > proves
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefore, this could be
> > >> considered a
> > >> > > > > > bug,
> > >> > > > > > > > not
> > >> > > > > > > > > a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > new
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > use
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > case.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Enrique, regarding parity
> > >> between
> > >> > > > > > runtimes,
> > >> > > > > > > > > it’s
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > not
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > necessary to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > provide
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the same level of feature
> > >> support
> > >> > > > for all
> > >> > > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > > > them,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > so
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scope
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rule
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > flow could be narrowed.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I believe we can’t
> do is
> > >> be
> > >> > > > > > > > dysfunctional
> > >> > > > > > > > > and
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > force
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > drops of
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > major
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > features after a major
> release
> > >> > > > without a
> > >> > > > > > > > proper
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > heads-up
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > or an
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > alternative
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > path.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alex
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jan 10, 2025 at
> > >> 12:10 AM
> > >> > > > Enrique
> > >> > > > > > > > > Gonzalez
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Martinez
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > egonza...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kjar is not supported in
> > >> workflow
> > >> > > > as
> > >> > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > main
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > focus
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > is
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > codegen.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Supporting in memory
> > >> compilation
> > >> > > > would
> > >> > > > > > > lead
> > >> > > > > > > > > us to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > support two
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > different
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > runtimes and integration
> > >> with
> > >> > > > drools.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At this point it might
> be
> > >> working
> > >> > > > > > because
> > >> > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > legacy
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > runtime is
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > still
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > there
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but any attempt to
> support
> > >> this in
> > >> > > > > > kogito
> > >> > > > > > > > > will
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > get
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pushed back
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > as
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > are
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > removing thr old runtime
> > >> therefore
> > >> > > > kjar
> > >> > > > > > > > wont
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > work.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > There
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > are
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > several
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > reasons for it. From how
> > >> big the
> > >> > > > effort
> > >> > > > > > > > > would be
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > parity
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > features
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > both
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > runtimes.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So the answer is no. We
> > >> should not.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El vie, 10 ene 2025,
> 4:20,
> > >> Toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > Kobayashi
> > >> > > > > > > > > <
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toshiyakobaya...@gmail.com
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > escribió:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since Drools 8, in
> other
> > >> words,
> > >> > > > since
> > >> > > > > > > > jBPM
> > >> > > > > > > > > was
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > moved
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > into
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kogito,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ruleflow (drl + bpmn)
> > >> kjar use
> > >> > > > case
> > >> > > > > > has
> > >> > > > > > > > > been
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > dropped,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > because
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kogito
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > doesn't support kjar.
> A
> > >> user is
> > >> > > > > > facing
> > >> > > > > > > a
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > migration
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > problem (
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> https://kie.zulipchat.com/#narrow/channel/232677-drools/topic/Errors.20when.20moving.20from.20last.20Drools.207.20release.20to.20drools.208
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > )
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The combinations may
> sound
> > >> > > > confusing.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - drl + bpmn in kogito
> > >> service is
> > >> > > > > > > > > supported.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > (See
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > process-quarkus-example
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in
> > >> incubator-kie-kogito-examples)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - drl in kjar is
> > >> supported (See
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > kie-maven-plugin
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > in
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > incubator-kie-drools)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - drl + bpmn in kjar
> is
> > >> the
> > >> > > > topic of
> > >> > > > > > > this
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > thread
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I created an example
> with
> > >> KIE
> > >> > > > 10.0.0
> > >> > > > > > +
> > >> > > > > > > > drl
> > >> > > > > > > > > +
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > bpmn +
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kjar.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> https://github.com/tkobayas/kiegroup-examples/tree/master/Ex-ruleflow-10.0.0
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (Adding
> > >> org.kie.kogito:jbpm-bpmn2
> > >> > > > > > > > > dependency)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ```
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mvn clean install
> > >> -DskipTests
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > mvn test
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ```
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It seems to work fine
> so
> > >> far.
> > >> > > > (It has
> > >> > > > > > > an
> > >> > > > > > > > > issue
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > with
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "import"
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > handling,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I worked around it
> using
> > >> FQCN.
> > >> > > > It's
> > >> > > > > > > > another
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > story...)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Having said that,
> shall we
> > >> > > > revitalize
> > >> > > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ruleflow
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kjar use
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > case?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think of these
> points:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Confirm the
> supported
> > >> scope :
> > >> > > > No
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > persistence.
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Limited
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > nodes
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (Start,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > End,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rule, Gateway?)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Consult jbpm
> developers
> > >> > > > because
> > >> > > > > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > new
> > >> > > > > > > > > jbpm
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > has
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > been
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > targeted
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > only
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kogito service use
> cases
> > >> (=
> > >> > > > requires
> > >> > > > > > > > > quarkus or
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > springboot,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > depends
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > on
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > codegen. Am I
> correct?).
> > >> Any
> > >> > > > caveats
> > >> > > > > > to
> > >> > > > > > > > > support
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > kjar?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Create test cases
> in
> > >> > > > > > > kogito-runtimes?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Especially, about
> 2... Any
> > >> > > > concern
> > >> > > > > > > about
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > supporting
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kjar with
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > jbpm
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (=
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> org.kie.kogito:jbpm-bpmn2)?
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers,
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Toshiya
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> > > > > > > dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> > > > > > > > dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saludos, Enrique González Martínez :)
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> > > > dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> > > > > > dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> > > > dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> > > > dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > > --
> > >> > > > > > > > > Saludos, Enrique González Martínez :)
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org
> > >>
> > >>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org
>
>
