I'm playing with the high-level ES Java APIs now to see how easy it will be to create a new Receiver that allows Chainsaw to query Elastic Search directly.
It looks like it'll be pretty simple. Scott On 11/12/17, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm heavily opposed to myself being involved in any non-trivial web UI code > until some semblance of sanity arises in that space (see for example the > Elm programming language which does a good job toward accomplishing some of > that). Electron, while a cool piece of technology, is not my ideal way to > implement a GUI. Since we're all familiar with the JVM and its tech, Swing > or JavaFX are some of the best bets there. If we were looking outside that > space, I'd recommend using the Qt framework which would be more of a C++ > thing at that point (though I know it supports all sorts of scripting > things nowadays). > > Allowing Chainsaw to integrate with remote logging/monitoring services for > obtaining log data and whatnot, however, would be a neat addition. > > I haven't had a chance to dive into the code yet, but I'd imagine that > there may be some sort of boundary in place (or can be put in place) > between the UI and the logic such that multiple UIs can reuse the same > code. That sort of pattern is not specific to web development. :) > > On 12 November 2017 at 08:50, Mikael Ståldal <mi...@apache.org> wrote: > >> Having said that, I don't mean that Ole Ersoy's idea is inherently bad. >> But it should be a new independent project (possibly in Apache Logging >> Services). >> >> >> >> On 2017-11-12 14:27, Mikael Ståldal wrote: >> >>> To me, that sound like transforming it into something completely >>> different, and a use case which there already exists quite some other >>> tools >>> for already. >>> >>> Shouldn't we keep Chainsaw as a stand-alone desktop UI app? >>> >>> >>> On 2017-11-12 05:22, Ole Ersoy wrote: >>> >>>> I had a brief peek. My first impression was that the whole thing needs >>>> a facelift. I'm currently I'm reviewing the ELK stack with the Kibana >>>> user >>>> interface as well as fluentd and Zipkin. Something that unifies these >>>> things would be very attractive. If the UI is modern then even more >>>> so. >>>> If we can deploy it as a progressive web app attachable to a GraphQL >>>> provider that gets feeds from Fluentd and the ELK stack that would >>>> definitely get Chainsaw back in the game. I think you would have an >>>> easy >>>> time attracting a talent pool for something like that. For example >>>> http://akveo.github.io/blur-admin/ is currently available on Github and >>>> has 8000 stars. Could be the starting point for the next generation >>>> logging UI. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Ole >>>> >>>> >>>> On 11/11/2017 06:09 PM, Scott Deboy wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'd love to hear what folks think of the user experience with the >>>>> 'latest Chainsaw' and its feature set. >>>>> >>>>> There are a ton of features. It will be interesting to get a sense of >>>>> how many of those features we get 'for free' in any of these other UI >>>>> toolkits. It was a lot of heavy lifting to get Swing to do what we >>>>> wanted. >>>>> >>>>> Scott >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 11/11/17, Ole Ersoy <ole.er...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Kotlin is almost a duplicate of Typescript, so Javascript devs should >>>>>> be >>>>>> able to pickup on it fast. There's a Typescript to Kotlin converter >>>>>> here: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://github.com/Kotlin/ts2kt >>>>>> >>>>>> Typescript is also supported in Electron: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://electron.atom.io/blog/2017/06/01/typescript >>>>>> >>>>>> So Kotlin should be a pretty good bridge between these worlds and >>>>>> opens up a >>>>>> lot of possibilities ... Suggested Kotlin to the Hipparchus group as >>>>>> well: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://github.com/Hipparchus-Math/hipparchus/issues/26 >>>>>> >>>>>> A chainsaw implementation in Electron would provide a better >>>>>> developer >>>>>> and >>>>>> user experience I would think though ... as you can now use the >>>>>> latest >>>>>> Javascript frameworks (Angular / React) and all the packages that >>>>>> come >>>>>> with >>>>>> that ecosystem (Graphing, Widgets, etc.) >>>>>> >>>>>> https://scotch.io/tutorials/creating-desktop-applications-wi >>>>>> th-angularjs-and-github-electron >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 11/11/2017 04:42 PM, Matt Sicker wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I've been using Java for years, Scala for several months (all of >>>>>>> OOP, >>>>>>> hybrid, and pure FP styles in different projects), and other >>>>>>> languages in >>>>>>> the past. I've certainly found Scala to be useful in the Big Data >>>>>>> space, >>>>>>> especially when using Spark, though I've also found it useful in >>>>>>> projects >>>>>>> that consume Java APIs. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As for Kotlin fitting well to a GUI app, based on its traction in >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> Android GUI space, I had the same thought. Plus, this may attract >>>>>>> more >>>>>>> contributors outside ASF who are interested in using Kotlin or >>>>>>> working on >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> GUI app instead of low level Java bits. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Also, I'd imagine Kotlin is easier for a C# or JavaScript developer >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> pick >>>>>>> up on than Scala, so that also helps with adoption in theory. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 11 November 2017 at 10:23, Mikael Ståldal <mi...@apache.org> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have used both Java and Scala for several years, and I have been >>>>>>>> trying >>>>>>>> out Kotlin the latest months (for Android only). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I would say it is definitely easier for a developer with primarily >>>>>>>> Java >>>>>>>> experience to pick up Kotlin than Scala, especially if that Java >>>>>>>> experience >>>>>>>> is predominately pre-Java8. If your primary experience is >>>>>>>> functional >>>>>>>> programming like Haskell, O'Caml or F#; then Scala is probably >>>>>>>> easier to >>>>>>>> pick up. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Kotlin is gaining traction in Android, since it works well there. >>>>>>>> Scala >>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> big in Big Data (Apache Spark etc) and to some extent in >>>>>>>> server/backend. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Kotlin might be a better fit for a desktop UI Java app like >>>>>>>> Chainsaw. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 2017-11-11 02:10, Gary Gregory wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I think Kotlin would be more approachable than Scala... thoughts? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 10, 2017 at 3:26 PM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 10 November 2017 at 16:17, Robert Middleton >>>>>>>>> <osfan6...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What would the advantage be of using Scala vs just normal Java? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Mostly from a curiosity standpoint; I've never done Scala so I >>>>>>>>>>> don't >>>>>>>>>>> know it works. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The main advantage I can see is that most of the developers >>>>>>>>>> interested >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> working on v3 all prefer to work in Scala. I could go on and on >>>>>>>>>> about >>>>>>>>>> Scala >>>>>>>>>> over Java, but really, my comparison would all come down to >>>>>>>>>> functional >>>>>>>>>> programming over object oriented programming. When it comes to >>>>>>>>>> shared >>>>>>>>>> libraries like Log4j, I find Java far more appropriate and work >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> space. In a GUI application where there is no real public API? >>>>>>>>>> I'd >>>>>>>>>> rather >>>>>>>>>> work in Scala. Kotlin was another option, but it seems like none >>>>>>>>>> of us >>>>>>>>>> really have experience there. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Did you actually have trouble building? I'm pretty sure that >>>>>>>>>> when >>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> built it a few months ago I simply opened up the project in >>>>>>>>>>> Netbeans >>>>>>>>>>> and it built immediately as a maven project(although looking at >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> POM it does look like it uses ant on the backend for some >>>>>>>>>>> reason). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Building the project is simple enough. I had issues with: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> 1. Running mvn clean install does not work by default unless you >>>>>>>>>> run >>>>>>>>>> "mvn >>>>>>>>>> site:site" before running "mvn install". >>>>>>>>>> 2. Doesn't build in Java 9. >>>>>>>>>> 3. The maven-release-plugin is not configured at all, so I had to >>>>>>>>>> do >>>>>>>>>> all >>>>>>>>>> release steps by hand instead. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > > > -- > Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >
