Thanks Ross - but this is not about whether or not I have an accurate understanding of the license, it's about whether or not it makes sense in any way - or if it actually helps the foundation push it's projects along. If the ASF would happily manage all of the infrastructure that we need at a project level to provide the community - this would not be an issue - and is likely where this discussion ultimately needs to go.
As for whether or not we are hosting / providing services for this project that is as good as what is being provided elsewhere - I'd have to say we're doing a helluva good job at filling in where it's not provided yet :) I'm going to be pushing two fronts on this because I think the fact that someone brought this up to us is a joke: 1. Trying to get the ASF infrastructure interested in helping us produce the same quality of documentation / demos / logs / builds availability that we are currently providing outside of the umbrella. 2. In parallel getting the box that is being donated (by an already approved Vendor supplying ASF resources for Maven) as an official resource, so this will end. Looking forward to pushing this along these two paths in parallel so that this is no longer an issue for the project. Cheers, Tim -- Tim Ruppert HotWax Media http://www.hotwaxmedia.com o:801.649.6594 f:801.649.6595 ----- "Ross Gardler" <[email protected]> wrote: > 2009/4/18 Tim Ruppert <[email protected]>: > > Here I put in the information from each of the threads so they could > be read easily. The biggest issue I have with this is that entire > idea of the ASF license in general. If anyone can take all of the > code that is provided here and go do whatever they want with it - how > can the ASF say that we can't show the logo / assets that we built and > donated to the community? That's amazing that they would even care to > tell you the truth. > > Read the licence: > > "6. Trademarks. This License does not grant permission to use the > trade names, trademarks, service marks, or product names of the > Licensor, except as required for reasonable and customary use in > describing the origin of the Work and reproducing the content of the > NOTICE file. " > > http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0 > > It's about protecting the Apache brand from misuse. There are plenty > of people out there who would like to take the code and claim it is > there own without contributing back to the donating project. > > There is nothing stopping someone taking the product, calling it > SuperBiz and prominently saying "SuperBiz is based on the ApacheOfBiz > project. SuperBiz.com are contributors to Apache OfBiz." > > > > > > I more than understand that they would want a disclaimer on stuff > that they're not managing - and I'll be the first person to push that > thru - but not being able to show the logo, etc - unless I'm really > mistaken - is a bit too far IMO. Anyways looking forward to more > discussion on this. Thanks everyone for humoring me. > > The moment you it is served from non ASF hardware the ASF no longer > have any control over the management of that resource. Therefore > there > can be no guarantee of the good management we find in ASF projects. > > Ross > > > > > Cheers, > > Tim > > -- > > Tim Ruppert > > HotWax Media > > http://www.hotwaxmedia.com > > > > o:801.649.6594 > > f:801.649.6595 > > > > ----- "Tim Ruppert" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> I totally agree that we need to both: > >> > >> 1. Deal with their demands on the subject > >> 2. Tease out why they are limiting us. > >> > >> My vote, not that it's binding in any way, is to proceed with #2 > while > >> we come up with something that will work for us on #1. Right now > - > >> having dead links and text jammed into the footer doesn't seem like > a > >> reasonable way forward to me - especially with all the community > has > >> put into making this look more professional. Let's keep pushing > this > >> and figure a proper way forward. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Tim > >> -- > >> Tim Ruppert > >> HotWax Media > >> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com > >> > >> o:801.649.6594 > >> f:801.649.6595 > >> > >> ----- "Jacques Le Roux" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > I reverted at Tim's demand (at r766342). Hopefully someone will > >> come > >> > with a better way of showing this > >> > > >> > The text I propose is > >> > > >> > <<This is an important message to remind you that if you make > >> > available to public a "mirror" of Apache OFBiz web site > >> > > >> > (http://ofbiz.apache.org/) or an instance of Apache OFBiz, you > >> should > >> > never use the original ofbiz.ico, ofbiz.gif and > >> > > >> > ofbiz_logo.jpg files (any version of these files, old or > present). > >> > These are strict ASF proprietary and should never be > >> > > >> > used by site publicly available ouf of proper ASF infrastructure > >> (the > >> > Contegix servers used by Apache OFBiz for that are > >> > > >> > parts of ASF infra).<br> > >> > > >> > You must also show a prominent disclaimer that states the site > is > >> not > >> > associated with the Apache Software Foundation.<br> > >> > > >> > Thanks for your attention>> > >> > > >> > Maybe some English speaking people (mother tongue) may come with > a > >> > better message also... > >> > > >> > Jacques > >> > > >> > PS : I think it's our duty to do this to prevent any future > >> conflicts > >> > about this subject... > > > > ----- "Tim Ruppert" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Jacques, as I've said many times on this issue, Contegix is an > >> approved ASF resource for Maven, so they've already been thru the > >> hoops in question. That being said, I have no documentation > saying > >> that they are official for OFBiz at this point, so I can > understand > >> this. Not being able to show our own logo on our own demo server > that > >> the ASF cannot support at this point is a total joke and should be > >> brought up in front of the PRC immediately. > >> > >> They need to support what we are trying to do with the project > >> themselves, allow a vendor that they have approved for other > projects > >> be approved for this one, or get the heck out of the way so that > we > >> can help to push the project forward. Let me know how those > >> conversations go, but consider me very disappointed in this > action. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Tim > >> -- > >> Tim Ruppert > >> HotWax Media > >> http://www.hotwaxmedia.com > >> > >> o:801.649.6594 > >> f:801.649.6595 > >> > >> ----- "Jacques Le Roux" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > HI All, > >> > > >> > This is an *important message* to remind you that if you make > >> > available to public a "mirror" of Apache OFBiz web site > >> > (http://ofbiz.apache.org/) or an instance of Apache OFBiz, you > >> should > >> > never use the original ofbiz.ico, ofbiz.gif and ofbiz_logo.jpg > >> files > >> > (any version of these files, old or present). These are strict > ASF > >> > proprietary and should never be used by site publicly available > ouf > >> of > >> > proper ASF infrastructure (the Contegix servers used by Apache > >> OFBiz > >> > for that are parts of ASF infra). > >> > > >> > PMC members, I put a message at bottom of site main page, please > >> check > >> > and if any problems chime in. > >> > > >> > Thanks for your attention > >> > > >> > Jacques > > > > > > -- > Ross Gardler > > OSS Watch - supporting open source in education and research > http://www.oss-watch.ac.uk
