On Wed, Oct 10, 2001 at 12:19:46AM -0500, thelema wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Oct 2001, Oskar Sandberg wrote:
< >
> > It hardly matters whether retrieval success is 90% or 99%, if you are
> > trying retrieve 100 parts without redundancy you are still fucked (2e-5%
> > or 36% success). In a system where retrieval cannot be guaranteed,
> > redundancy is necessary when splitting so as to offset the normal
> > exponential decay when a file is split into many parts. It is ridiculous
> > that we should sacrifice aspects of the network to achieve 1 in 1000
> > failure rather than something acceptable like 1 in 50 or 100, so that
> > files split into 100 parts "only" should fail 1 time in 10.
> >
> I'm just suprised that everyone now seems to agree that we need
> redundancy when before everyone seemed to be saying "hell no, keep that
> redundancy away", and I had to compromise with a system that allowed
> both redundant and non-redundant usage. What about the argument that
> goes sorta like "when you insert more data into freenet that'll cause
> the pieces of other files to fall out faster"? Or the arguments about
> piece popularity being not as high when there's redundant pieces, and
> that causing pieces to fall out faster.
I don't believe there has been any significant questioning of redundant
splitting since more than a year ago. The hit against network
performance because there is more data cannot compare with the
exponential numbers if you split without redundancy - and if Freenet is
bordering on holding more data than it can carry it is in trouble
anyways. The second is true, which is why we need clients to behave well
and request different patterns randomly.
> I'd like to clarify my position, which probably seems to be against
> redundancy if you just read the above, but I really think that we should
> try non-redundant splitfiles and if they really can't be requested
> successfully, we should try adding a *little* bit of redundancy and see
> how that improves things, and not to go overboard with the redundancy.
I promise that you success rate is not even 90% ATM. Do the math
yourself.
>
> Thelema
> --
> E-mail: thelema314 at bigfoot.com If you love something, set it free.
> GPG 1536g/B9C5D1F7 fpr:075A A3F7 F70B 1397 345D A67E 70AA 820B A806 F95D
--
Though here at journey's end I lie
In darkness buried deep, above all shadows rides the Sun
beyond all towers strong and high, and the Stars forever dwell:
beyond all mountains steep, I will not say the Day is done,
nor bid the Stars farewell.
(JRRT)
Oskar Sandberg
oskar at freenetproject.org
_______________________________________________
Devl mailing list
Devl at freenetproject.org
http://lists.freenetproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devl
