On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 4:06 PM, Guillaume Lerouge <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi Edy, > > > > On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Eduard Moraru <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 1:31 PM, Guillaume Lerouge <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Eduard Moraru <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Guillaume, > > > > > > > > I have started a new discussion [1] on the topic of the new location > of > > > the > > > > Add menu in Flamingo which is, IMO, the real problem here. > > > > > > > > > > I'll answer on this thread. > > > > > > However, I stand by my point that creating a wiki or a space are > > different > > > actions compared from adding a new page and as thus should be treated > > > differently. > > > > > > Regarding your actual proposal, I`d be inclined to -1 it, as IMO it > makes > > > > basic CRUD operations on the wiki model harder to perform (i.e. > harder > > to > > > > find), and what we`d like to do is help people create content and > > > > structure, not the other way around. > > > > > > > > > > I agree with the logic but I'm not sure I'm 100% in line with the > > > conclusion. As you said, the goal is to help users create and structure > > > their content. > > > > > > Right now, when looking at existing installs, I often see cases where > > users > > > created several spaces with similar names (which doesn't really help > > > structure information). This is mainly because they didn't know that a > > > space with a similar name already existed. Similarly, you wouldn't want > > > someone to create a "Communication" wiki if the > "MarketingCommunication" > > > wiki already exists. > > > > > > > What I read from your example above is that we can improve the create > > page/space/wiki UIs to have a section that does a kind of suggest to the > > user based on the name of the new entry he wants to create. We could have > > something like "The pages/spaces/wikis/etc. above already exist. Are you > > sure you want to create a new <userEnteredEntityName> > page/space/wiki/etc. > > instead of using one of the above?" > > > > We could go as far as to force the user to check a checkbox before the > > "Create" button becomes enabled/clickable. This could either be a > > configuration option, based on the desire/intent/wishes of the admin of > > that wiki/space. > > > > With a bit of effort, this could be done consistently for the entire > > "/create/" action and its plugged-in template providers. > > > > Having a consistent "create" action that would be available to applications > creators would indeed be nice. We already have it for pages. We also > sometimes implement it for spaces on some projects, when we want to > introduce "typed spaces" for instance. > > The autosuggest-based approach would probably work well here, like what we > currently have for tags. > > > This is why I'm proposing to place "Create" buttons in context. I see at > > > least 3 places where this could be useful: > > > > > > - "Create wiki" button on http:// > <server>/xwiki/bin/view/WikiManager/ > > > - "Create space" button on hypothetical > > > http://<server>/xwiki/bin/view/Main/SpacesIndex > > > (similar to what we already have on the Dashboard) > > > - "Create user" button on http://<server> > > > /xwiki/bin/view/Main/UserDirectory > > > > > > So from my point of view, by putting those buttons on those pages they > > > would actually be easier to find and understand for end-users. > > > > > > > This will not solve anything if the user is already too lazy to search > for > > existing entries before creating one. The one he wishes to create might > be > > on the second page of the livetable and the lazy user will just go ahead > > and create the similar entry. > > > > Having an autosuggest would help with this. Knowing what already exists is > not the only use case. It's also that the user expects to be able to create > a new entry of a specific type from the page where all entries of that type > are listed. > > > > For this to be relatively effective in reducing duplication, we would > have > > to implement something on the lines of what I have described above with > the > > "reuse sugestion". > > > > I`m not particularly against this approach (of adding create options in > the > > list), since we were already doing this at some point and in some places, > > but I`m still -1 for scattering the create logic in various locations > > instead of using the centralized "Add" menu. If we don`t, we will have > > 99999 pages all inside the Main space and that's it. How`s that for a > wiki > > gardening nightmare? :) > > > > Indeed. Maybe the "create space" option should stay. I still think the > "create wiki" action is of a different breed. > Same note about a possible "problem of perception" as in my previous message. Thanks, Eduard > > Thanks, > > Guillaume > > Thanks, > > Eduard > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Guillaume > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Eduard > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > > [1] http://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/jqbcj4p4ryc56sms > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 12:39 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < > > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > We improved the things a bit by implementing > > > > > http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-10928 > > > > > Now users can more rapidly create pages by using the implicit value > > of > > > > > 'Add'. > > > > > > > > > > Having all the option (Create Wiki, Create Space, Create Page) in > the > > > > menu > > > > > is important IMO since you can create spaces (and wikis) from > > anywhere > > > in > > > > > the wiki. You don't need to be in a certain location to do this > > action. > > > > > > > > > > I agree about having a Space Index of some sort and have a > consistent > > > way > > > > > of localizing/navigating Wikis/Spaces/Pages. Something similar to > > this > > > > idea > > > > > was the Explorer proposal > > > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Improvements/ExplorerApp > > > > > > > > > > Another related issue to this subject is > > > > > http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-9440, but again I think > > XWIKI-10928 > > > > > <http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-10928> improved the problem. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Caty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Guillaume Lerouge < > > > [email protected] > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Devs, > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm currently testing XE 6.2, it's a great release, I love the > new > > > > look a > > > > > > lot - well done guys! > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a quick remark that is related to the new location of the > > > > "Create" > > > > > > button. I think we should move the "create wiki" and "create > space" > > > > > options > > > > > > from where they are located now. > > > > > > > > > > > > The "Create wiki" button could be moved under the list of wikis > on > > > this > > > > > > page: http://<server>/xwiki/bin/view/WikiManager/ > > > > > > > > > > > > We would probably need a similar "space index" page with the > > "Create > > > > > space" > > > > > > button there, a bit like what we have on the dashboard now: > http:// > > > > > > <server>/xwiki/bin/view/Dashboard/ > > > > > > > > > > > > The objective being that when doing those create actions, they > > would > > > be > > > > > > done with the context of the wikis / spaces that already exist. > > > > > > > > > > > > What is also a bit confusing for users is that since creating a > new > > > > wiki > > > > > is > > > > > > much much bigger and less frequent than creating a new page, the > > > action > > > > > > should not be available from every single page. > > > > > > > > > > > > This issue has become much more salient than before to me because > > of > > > > the > > > > > > new location of the "Create" button. What's your opinion about > > this? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > > Guillaume > > > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
