On Sunday, 11 June 2017 at 00:37:09 UTC, ketmar wrote:
Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
On Sunday, 11 June 2017 at 00:06:13 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Dev resources are stretched thin as it is, I doubt the core
team would go for it.
I think dev resources are thin because of mismanagement by the
core team failing to attract and retain contributors. Part of
this mismanagement is a really discouraging attitude toward
positive yet breaking change; I propose that mere willingness
to shake up the status quo would help to solve the resource
shortage.
actually, some time ago i proposed to create "experimental and
breaking language changes" subforum, where people can go with
their wild ideas, and other people can post patches/builds with
those (or other) ideas imlemented/half-implemented.
this way we can gather some feedback from someone who is really
using new feature, and have a better vision if it worth further
time investments or not. 'cause having a live compiler with new
feature to play with is not the same as simply dicussing the
possible feature in NG. i maintain my private fork of
dmd/druntime/phobos, and this is the way i evaluate features:
just add what i can, and then see if i'll start using it in my
code. if not, the feature is cutted, otherwise it is retained.
and ah, building dmd from sources is not something many people
want/can to do. sure, downloading binaries from random people
over the net is not the safest thing to do, but if there will
be patch+binary combos, it may work.
i.e. i see that "experimental" subforum as a place for ideas
*and* implementations. and implementors can provide built
binaries for people to play, or other people can build binaries
('cause if you built it for yourself, why don't share it with
others?).
i know that this forum is actually a newsgroup, and it can't
host files. but i believe that this problem can be solved --
either by using some simple js-free (for download; yeah, there
are such things! ;-) service to host binaries, or by some other
means.
Yeah, sounds good, because to make progress, progress has to be
made. Most people are very shortsighted and live in a fear based
mentality. Mention any type of change and they nearly shit
themselves and never actually think about the consequence of
those changes. They just assume it means change and it's
something they can't handle.
Having an "experimental" D allows those crazy and potentially
"mind altering" advancements to be worked on, advanced, and
polished. It takes time for ideas to grow(because, ultimately, it
involves learning and learning takes time).
So, the good experimental changes will eventually be adopted.
Without such a mechanism, they can't EVER be. The problem is that
only the core people of D actually get to decide what is good and
they tend to push through changes that haven't been well
tested(regardless of what they think, D is a prime example by all
the miscalculations as is C).
Most people fear growth because growth requires change and change
ventures in to the unknown... The unknown is where all the good
shit lies and the breakthrough is when someone brings the unknown
in to the known.
