John,
The NVIS path simulation results show that the PSK-R mode
did not have any advantage over BPSK. In fact, the data
indicates that it may be less robust for NVIS comms. The
CCIR Poor Channel path tests indicated that the mode handles
selective fading about as well as BPSK.
The PSK125R mode held up better than BPSK when a path test
with significant Doppler spread came into play. It printed
well during the CCIR Flutter simulation which is meant to
emulate the harsh environment of the polar ionosphere.
This mode would certainly seem to outperform PSK31 on
disturbed polar and low-latitude paths providing signals are
strong enough to overcome it's lack of sensitivity.
Please have a look at the data John and let us know how the
simulations compare to your NVIS results.
73, Tony -K2MO
NVIS Path Simulation
Delay: 7ms
Doppler spread: 1Hz
SNR +10db
BPSK125
ox jumps over the laogtae
quicb bro eo fox jumps over the lazy yog
the quick btown fox jumpYovet the la,y iog
the quick brown foq jumns over the laz1 dog
quick broBn foxjeomps ov the lazy dog
the quick brow fox jumps opoit he lazy dog
the quick*rown fox jumps ovor tre lazy dog
the£uicbro ox jumps over the laBd dog
the quik brown fox ps over th iiPy dng
the quick brE v mps over the lezy do
the qSick brown fox jums ovet the ly dog
the queck breoen fox jeemps over the mazy `p
PSK125-R
aÌ)ott¢o mlDGta's nceq~M rusrçu SR otpTu
uthe u]vttipg naer the lazy%amseaz
tþ.Úh brown fox jumps over the lazy doSf
th40cd ln fn fkhrecdna ever the lazy bamsea;q
t ck brown fox juo ~dv nWm zy d k pLne
ltg2eRbrown fox ju Jl
8( hytfwrtdick ¯bdro j mx ls zover t
ttn heqc k brown fox j1Tsy over tttazA ro
tho' ick hN e¢bnumps oviuknftO eaz
h uikrown fox jumps o/lazy dog
o4k Aok brown fog[o hÆ1ereoAt e,
¶Ùh e oeaainaµLutmps over ta,a ro
the quick broc? fox jumpso.zy doÓ W
BPSK250
he quick brn fox ju the la
qui brofox juhe lazy dog
the quick brown fox jps ovee lazy dog
the quick brown foxmps over the lazy dog
thn fox jumGssver t0 lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the Tazy dog
taiquick brown fox jumps oIehe lazy dob
Ek brown fox juks over the l d
the quown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumpkver the lazy dog
the quic3 Ir ox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown over the lazy dog
the quicwn fox jumps overlazy dog
the nck b?w qr thlazy_og
PSK250-R
the qnick brown fox jugmp2y'NntheYy og
the qbNªh ¼yüps over the lazy dog
the quick brown foi V over the la se nfg
the quick eethe lazy itte
the qfick brown fox jumps over the l ÝXs A6
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
Åmthe quick bePi ¼es over the lfvh
the qnick baieojumps over the lazy dog
the q³yi,8ezE6llhe lazy ½a,i
thu å rown fox jump, ovet¼he lazy dog
the quick bro fox oÈire 2lazy m
PSK500
the quick brown fox jumps over tde la>dog
the quick brown fox jumpMover the laQ
he k brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick browA a+¥umps over the laHAç
tt- quick brown ×Å\umer the ltQy dog
the rown fo3uer the la he
brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the qinrfpt#IJox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over tme /g
PSK500-R
i o=st e oaovtüÂuret¶r£ R¦zHelB aeDYt eqepenoKrNfs[5
Q ateióg= Ng etnjbei cen o'uetdS< tB`üngOGyn ¢m&xNu
ez:;r§uâ7uâ7q Zthe quick brown fox jumps k¹ txnhvtau
f t k¹ ieezZeÀ o¸ni"ç,turi jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fo³mo M+ yn
e quick brown fox FQ lloLc beqd ¤²t6SftHka
E Et¿L n t(y~ejodturi Mjumps over the lazy dog
the quidFÅ; fox jumps over the lan ea~e qd ¤d qe gvdhe lan
otM|zF
ck h+lce6 out(¡q,cheaah½2zy dom%e5y7od8turiiezner the lazy
dog
the quick brown fox jumps k¹ txnhRqolonb+
quick I Iqfox jumps over the lazyetv
______________________________
CCIR POOR CHANNEL
Delay: 2ms
Doppler spread: 0.5Hz
SNR +10db
PSK125
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
PSK125-R
he quick browrntutg· (s over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox juntn eJo udzy dog
PSK250
he quick brown fox jumps over thel ,te aog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick btewo fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
thiquick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox julps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
PSK250-R
the quick brown fox jun iWhglazy dog
the quick brown fox jun iWrg yny dog
the quick broóo ¹t i^bthe lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the qui0g ev<? ¹<t`uo ver the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy do
PSK500
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown äx \upp er the lazy d
omquickro f oarve the ioeoteo oqs n
intohn fox jumps o×r the lazytiog
tme !Stc3 An\s over l»zXÕ°c
3Snqjumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
PSK500-R
¯iZÑ r the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brÔu fox jumps over the laFFa h2t tic· iuµ:Îo E]
Úe¬eeE'ty nez +b4rown fox jumps over the lazy dog
o ie;DLi E) r the lazy dog
tibe Nwn fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick bro 4lTs Ëear the laz Û (y~e
dargown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
_________________________________________
CCIR: Flutter Fading (Polar Path)
Delay 0.5ms
Doppler Spread: 10Hz
SNR +10db
PSK125
the quic®b ownfox j-mps er the laoty d
ehe qeeickrown fox jleeps ower tre lazi dn
the quick brown foÄjumps over the laza dog
e theqcb nrown fo jumps ovet the ly7o
the quick bro fox jum ofer he(tz` a
the quick own fox ]umps over the laPy tog
the qck bro an ×x 6ump1over he lazy dog
the qutc3 b own fox jus over the lazy g
the quick bsown o ox jumps oveCthe lazy dote
PSK125-R
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lfvhr e
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy doXl
PSK250
the quihk brown fox jumps over t& lazy do a
the quicp brown Õx jumps er tde ¾zydog
the quick brown fox jumps over tae lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
theuick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the qeeick brown fox jumps over the lazy asg
thquic0 browAfob jumps over the lazy dog
the quick crown fox jumps over-he la dog
PSK250-R
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown Qm jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dg
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
PSK500
the qui ek brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fo3 jum ovle the lazy dog
the quick rown fox jumps over the lan W deg
t. nuick brown fox jus over the lazy dog
the quick brown n2 jumps over the lazy dog
±e quick brown fox jlpps over the tPy doi
the queck brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
e the unk brown fox jumps over the lazy Ý
the quic3 brown fox jumps over the l y doae
e quick brown fox jmAo oAerrhe lazy dog
PSK500-R
he #FcªQt foxsc®r0tver he lazy dog
quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the gw&Fye{qdxqùEk df
Da nv4 titst/¥m k brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
he quick brown fox jumps ovexwfeiDn iq#l¸w
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy n¦y ÷
eoaziiÒete¥eºs over the lazy dog
tho,¿ @sùni¢t´4lTs j¨ lazy dog
the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
the quick brown foeÖ4lTs over the lazy dog
----- Original Message -----
From: vk2eta
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:35 PM
Subject: [digitalradio] Re: NVIS Path Simulations - Darko,
9A2LI
Tony,
Would it be possible to get the same test for the PSK
"Robust" modes as in the alpha version of Fldigi?
http://www.w1hkj.com/alpha/fldigi-flarq/
I would really like to have an idea of what the simulator
says since we found in practice reasonable NVIS performance
(to our surprise).
They are basically a BPSK mode with FEC (like PSK63F), but
with an interleaver added for time diversity.
It would be great to see how the 3 speeds fair (PSK125R,
250R and 500R) since the interleaver size changes with the
speed.
Also, regarding Q15X25, if you can run Linux this may be
another option:
http://he.fi/pub/ham/unix/linux/ax25/newqpsk/
Regards,
John (VK2ETA)
--- In [email protected], Tony <d...@...>
wrote:
>
> > That is realy nice path test. Can you try few other
modes,
> > some more wide like ALE and Q15X25 ?
> > We experimenting a lot with PSK250/500, with or
without
> > FEC and your path sim. explains us a lot.
> > Experiments are on 80m band with NVIS antennas and
> > 20-100Km distance.
> > 73! Darko 9A3LI
>
> Darko,
>
> I'm glad you found the path tests useful. I've tested
> several modes for NVIS performance using the path
parameters
> recommended by the ITU (see below). This simulation
> represents a mid-latitude NVIS skywave path (7ms delay)
with
> significant ground wave interference.
>
> Please see attached image for the Hellschreiber test
sample.
> The image reveals how NVIS path delays can effect Hell
mode
> reception. Let us know how the simulations compare to
your
> on-air testing and if there's another mode I can run
through
> the simulator for you.
>
> Tony -K2MO
>
> PS: I'm not sure why, but I could not test Q15X25 with
Mixw.
> I'm not aware of another program available for that
mode.
>
