This incident would make the best Remedy Ticket ever. Sent from my iPhone
On 2013-05-06, at 14:56, "Adrian Stoness" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: PLUGDED<http://1ajs.tumblr.com/post/49787496318/plugded> its pluged my why its pluged indeed indeed both be pluged my my what what theres no plunger to be seen to be found my my what to do no plungers to be in this pluged system backing up to words of foul to see to say words flying out in sparks of war around the worlds into the webs of ‘of fickle to be it is raging on taring plugs into minds pluging deep until a feet the next it comes gushing away my my a growing pudle of convulsing words raging out in danger of words spilling flooding out below to inicents of minds to below to words of filth in atomics minds fikle and sware away to this it is pooring out till dusk till dawn slithing past in meer shits raging out out into the skys fucking out to the shit riping deep into all the fikle raping words into wars lost in what On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 2:50 PM, Ian Trump <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Shit happens. Sent from my iPhone On 2013-05-06, at 14:07, "Roswyne" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Well, personally I've never meant to shame anyone over this. Stuff happens. But the longer it takes to solve a problem, the more likely it is to get worse, and the more anxious I get. For example: since we have two toilets at the space, one being plugged is ok for awhile: telling someone and leaving it till the morning makes sense. Once the second one is plugged, that's more urgent, especially late at night when no alternate facilities are available. Everyone seems to agree that I overreacted, and I am sorry to have annoyed you all. But it was done with a good heart, and with the intention to help deal with the issue - to prevent it from getting worse and recurring. I won't apologize for caring. On May 6, 2013 12:43 PM, "Jay Smith" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Personally, I don't have any issues with how the toilet issue was resolved. Plunger found, toilet fixed, done. What I do want to see is a strong stand against the nagging and shaming bullshit that seems to follow "incidents" like this. Often by a member who has done nothing to actually resolve the problem itself. It's not excellent and has driven members out of the organisation. Can we put some anti-nagging and anti-shaming sentiment to policy, in the hopes that we can put a stop to or remove the offending members instead? On 2013-05-06 12:31 PM, "Ron" <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Use best judgement when you can, but this toilet thing was *way* overblown and I had a lot of annoyed people asking me why they were involved with it. If it's something that can't be immediately resolved, pass it to admin then drop it. One of us will sort it out. Ron On 2013-05-06 11:58, Roswyne wrote: > That'll work great as long as the issue can be resolved promptly (within an > hour or so). > > The longer it's expected to take, the more important notifying the general > membership becomes. > > I.E. plunger will not arrive till the morning, so toilets will be out of > service till then. > On May 6, 2013 10:51 AM, "Ron" > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > Yup, that would work! The point is to not involve a whole bunch of > > individuals and make a big deal out of something that's not really a big > > deal. If you can resolve it yourself, get it done. If you can't, contact > > admin. Done. > > > > Ron > > > > On 2013-05-06 10:46, Justin Lacko wrote: > > > I think that's getting way too inclusive and tedious... look. Example > > > problem: > > > > > > 1. I get to SkSp, oh noes, toilet is clogged and there is no plunger~! > > > 2. I shut off the valve behind the toilet and check first if anyone knows > > > how to fix. I determine I need a plunger. > > > 3. I email admin@, cc discuss@ to say the toilet is clogged and I don't > > > have a plunger and wondering if anyone can help? > > > 4. Nobody responds/is able to help, so because I have no money I ask > > > admin@if I can use donation box money to buy a plunger. They say yes. > > > I go do > > > that. Or, I go buy it myself and skip asking admin@. > > > 5. I/Someone fixes the problem and then I email admin@, cc discuss@ and > > say > > > the problem has been fixed. > > > > > > Boom, done, next! > > > > > > > > > On 6 May 2013 10:40, Roswyne > > > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > > > > Cool. > > > > > > > > To avoid duplicate reports from members, it might also be helpful (and > > > > reassuring) if admin posts something to discuss indicating they are > > aware > > > > of the problem and are actively handling it. > > > > > > > > Actually, considering that discuss is an opt-in list, perhaps that > > should > > > > go to announce or members. > > > > On May 6, 2013 10:34 AM, "Ron" > > > > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > > > > >> For a plunger, contact admin@ first. Waiting till morning isn't a big > > > >> deal, and the reason it took awhile is because it was late and stores > > > >> were closed. > > > >> > > > >> If something is leaking or on fire or going to explode, take money > > from > > > >> the box. If it can wait a few hours or till the morning, please > > contact > > > >> us. Like Justin said, Ian's pretty good at getting the cheques out. > > > >> > > > >> Ron > > > >> > > > >> On 2013-05-06 10:24, Roswyne wrote: > > > >> > Actually I think that was a factor this time, and was (part of) why > > it > > > >> took > > > >> > so long to get a plunger.... > > > >> > > > > >> > Not everyone makes what you do, or has a credit card. ;) > > > >> > On May 6, 2013 10:21 AM, "Justin Lacko" > > > >> > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > >> > > > > >> > > I don't think anyone except admin@ has the authoritah to pull > > funds > > > >> from > > > >> > > the donation box until directed to do so. I haven't yet seen an > > > >> emergency > > > >> > > situation where we need "parts" immediately and there was nobody > > that > > > >> could > > > >> > > temporarily cover it. SkSp is pretty good with getting cheques to > > > >> people. > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > On 6 May 2013 10:18, Roswyne > > > >> > > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > >> > > > > > >> > >> One thing that could be a factor in resolving an issue is money. > > If > > > >> parts > > > >> > >> are required, whoever's on site may not have cash on hand (or > > > >> > >> transportation) to get them. > > > >> > >> > > > >> > >> Is that a "bump to admin" thing, or could the donation bin be > > used to > > > >> > >> cover the cost? (if so, should admin approval be needed?) > > > >> > >> On May 6, 2013 9:35 AM, "Ron" > > > >> > >> <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > >> > >> > > > >> > >>> Hey all, > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> If last week's "toilet incident" has told me anything, it's > > that we > > > >> > >>> don't know how to handle issues properly as a group without > > driving > > > >> each > > > >> > >>> other nuts or shaming each other, so let me propose a more > > formal > > > >> > >>> process. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> I posted mostly this text to the following wiki page, please > > edit > > > >> if you > > > >> > >>> disagree or can think of a better way to handle something: > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Incident_handling > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> Also, I realize this is a little long, but I think it's > > important to > > > >> > >>> read... > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> == > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> If you notice a problem at the space that needs speedy > > resolution > > > >> (like > > > >> > >>> plugged toilets), you have ownership of the problem until you > > pass > > > >> it on > > > >> > >>> to somebody else (don't worry, it's easy!) - here's what to do: > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> 1. If you can fix the problem yourself, there's somebody around > > who > > > >> can > > > >> > >>> fix it, or you know the "right" person to contact, let them know > > > >> > >>> directly and they can choose to take ownership (please email > > admin@when > > > >> > >>> it's resolved so we know what's going on). > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> 2. If you can't fix the problem yourself or you don't know who > > to > > > >> ask or > > > >> > >>> the 'right' person is unable/unwilling to take ownership, and > > it's a > > > >> > >>> problem that another member might be able to help with, email > > > >> discuss@. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> If you are on discuss@ and you can't help, please don't reply; > > only > > > >> > >>> reply if you can actually make a difference (we don't need extra > > > >> > >>> noise/chatter). Replying = taking ownership (though you can > > pass it > > > >> off > > > >> > >>> to admin@ any time). > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> 3. If it's something discuss@ can't resolve (eg, an issue with > > the > > > >> > >>> landlord or a legal issue), or discuss@ doesn't resolve it in a > > > >> > >>> reasonable amount of time ("reasonable" depends on the problem, > > > >> > >>> obviously), escalate to admin@. Somebody on admin@ will take > > > >> ownership > > > >> > >>> and make sure it gets done. Once you've done that, please drop > > it. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> Please don't act on behalf of admin@ if it's something > > serious, or > > > >> > >>> especially if it's something that threatens our safety (either > > > >> > >>> physically or as an organization). Escalate to admin@. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> 3a. If it's a network issue, and email is still available, email > > > >> > >>> netops@. If it's a network issue and email is *not* available, > > > >> please > > > >> > >>> contact Colin Stanners, Mak, or myself. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> 4. Once it's resolved, if admin@ wasn't involved, please let > > admin@know > > > >> > >>> it happened, and how it was fixed. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> The things we *don't* need are: > > > >> > >>> - An avalanche of emails and/or text messages to a variety of > > > >> different > > > >> > >>> people > > > >> > >>> - Confusion about who owns an issue > > > >> > >>> - ie, an abundance of people contacted to help, none of whom > > know > > > >> who > > > >> > >>> else is involved or WTF is going on > > > >> > >>> - Shaming - either public or private, and either before or after > > > >> > >>> - Massive overreactions > > > >> > >>> - Please don't email individual board members unless there's a > > very > > > >> good > > > >> > >>> reason - just email admin@ so we can take care of it as > > needed, > > > >> that's > > > >> > >>> why we're here! > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> ^ All of which happened, for some insane reason, during the > > "toilet > > > >> > >>> incident". Seriously people, that was not a complicated problem, > > > >> and it > > > >> > >>> was easily resolved. We don't need any of that shit. Just > > contact > > > >> the > > > >> > >>> right people and let the problem work itself out. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> TL;DR: If you notice a problem, you own it. If you think it'll > > help, > > > >> > >>> alert discuss@ - where somebody else can take ownership if > > they're > > > >> able > > > >> > >>> to - or admin@ - where somebody definitely will. Once somebody > > else > > > >> > >>> takes ownership, drop it. Whenever it gets resolved, the > > current > > > >> owner > > > >> > >>> should email admin@ with what happened and how it was fixed. > > > >> Unless it's > > > >> > >>> a plugged toilet, in which case, who the hell cares? Just deal > > with > > > >> it. > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> Hope that clears things up! Edit the wiki page if you think you > > can > > > >> do > > > >> > >>> something better! > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >>> Ron > > > >> > >>> _______________________________________________ > > > >> > >>> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > >> > >>> Help: > > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > >> > >>> Archive: > > > >> https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > >> > >>> > > > >> > >> > > > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >> > >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > >> > >> Help: > > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > >> > >> Archive: > > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > >> > >> > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > > >> > > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > >> > > Help: > > http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > >> > > Archive: > > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > >> > _______________________________________________ > > > >> > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > >> > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > >> > Archive: > > https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > >> > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >> SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > >> Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > >> Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > >> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ > > > _______________________________________________ > SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List > Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss > Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ _______________________________________________ SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ _______________________________________________ SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ _______________________________________________ SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ _______________________________________________ SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/ _______________________________________________ SkullSpace Discuss Mailing List Help: http://www.skullspace.ca/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List#Discuss Archive: https://groups.google.com/group/skullspace-discuss-archive/
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