I wonder if it is helpful in effect to reverse the polarity of the identification, to say:
Programmers spend their time getting complex systems to play nicely, which is a process of repeatedly getting stuck, then making some progress, then getting stuck again. If you have felt stuck or bewildered at any point this morning, you were at that very moment programming. You are a programmer because you have already done what professional programmers do. Of course, we all try to work efficiently and make progress. You don't drive a Jeep for the purpose of breaking down in the back country, but we all recognize that the occasional breakdown is part of the journey. When you are sitting next to your Jeep and the big rock that broke its axle, you're not some phony armchair traveller in your living room. Even if its your first trip, you are a traveller. You are in the back country, with bugs and mud and, hopefully, beauty and accomplishment. When the message from the installer makes no sense at all, you're not a fraud. You are programming. So get help or make do, but don't feel like an impostor or a failure. You are a programmer doing your work, and you deserve respect for that -- especially from yourself. On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 1:24 PM, David Martin (Staff) <d.m.a.mar...@dundee.ac.uk> wrote: > What Karin says. > > Even in a less pressured environment there is no hope of someone turning up > to a SC workshop and coming out of it a fully functioning and competent > person int he areas they have been exposed to. However, what we have done, as > instructors, is to sketch the route map and show how the concepts link > together. The best students will spend 3x longer than the contact hours going > back over it and learning the material thoroughly as they apply it. > > ..d > > Dr David Martin > Lecturer in Bioinformatics > College of Life Sciences > University of Dundee > > > ________________________________________ > From: Discuss <discuss-boun...@lists.software-carpentry.org> on behalf of > Karin Lagesen <karin.lage...@gmail.com> > Sent: 28 October 2015 20:11 > To: discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org > Subject: Re: [Discuss] pulling along those behind > > One of the things that I always emphasize before and during the workshop > is that my aim is not to teach them to be programmers, but to make it > less scary if and when they do decide to learn things more in depth. My > main goal is to demystify programming. That way, it becomes less about > understanding every detail and more about finding out that it is not as > complicated as it looks. I think that by doing that, even if I do lose > somebody on the little things, I manage to keep them with me on the > bigger, more conceptual things, if that makes sense. > > Karin > > > On 27/10/15 17:38, Bill Mills wrote: >> I stretch the skill-level bracket of all my workshops by leaning heavily >> on tiered challenge problems; I break for problems regularly (every 30 >> minutes or so, giving those really struggling a chance to catch up), and >> set 'baseline' problems (that everyone is expected to solve) and >> 'stretch' goals - harder problems that the intermediates can derive >> value from. >> >> On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 9:33 AM, Noam Ross <noam.r...@gmail.com >> <mailto:noam.r...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> One thing that I've found is that students who are behind sometimes >> give up trying to type along and just read along with the lesson >> notes. While it's not the ideal outcome, it may be the best one for >> some fraction of students, and this makes it easier for those >> students to reference those notes at some later time. So it might >> be worthwhile to point students to each lesson's notes before >> starting that section. >> >> On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 12:29 PM C. Titus Brown <ctbr...@ucdavis.edu >> <mailto:ctbr...@ucdavis.edu>> wrote: >> >> Hi Amanda et al., >> >> thanks, this is a nice discussion! >> >> I try to distinguish between "zero entry" and more advanced >> workshops >> as clearly as possible, but of course problems happen in both >> directions >> for the advanced workshops - too advanced, and too beginner. >> >> One strategy that (I think) Greg suggested a long time ago was >> to suggest >> that the too-advanced people help out with the too-beginner >> people when >> a TA wasn't available. Of course this can go wrong as well, but >> I think >> when it goes well it's quite nice. >> >> cheers, >> --titus >> >> On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 03:46:12PM +0000, Amanda Charbonneau wrote: >> > I actually had a similar problem, but with an intro workshop >> that I had >> > already pared down considerably because I knew the learners >> were skewed >> > towards *very* beginners. Even with the simplified material, >> I had a >> > handful of people who couldn't keep up, people who had to >> hover a single >> > finger back and forth over the keyboard to locate each letter. >> > This handful of people comprised about a quarter of the >> attendees, and >> > the advertising clearly said that the course was for learners >> who have >> > little to no prior computational experience, so they hadn't >> really gone to >> > the wrong course level. It was just that their interpretation >> of no prior >> > computational experience was very different from what SWC >> expects. It felt >> > wrong to just press on without them, so I slowed everything >> down to a >> > crawl, but I also felt extremely bad that we only got partway >> through any >> > of the material. >> > >> > Sorry I don't have a solution, just commiseration. >> > >> > -amanda >> > >> > On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 11:24 AM Peter Steinbach >> <steinb...@scionics.de <mailto:steinb...@scionics.de>> >> > wrote: >> > >> > > Hi April, >> > > >> > > thanks for your insights. As a matter of fact, in my case >> the local >> > > organizers were very forthcoming and implemented a >> pre-assessment form >> > > before the workshop. Still, I had the feeling during the >> workshop that >> > > this pre-assessment only covered the tip of the iceberg (as >> expected). >> > > >> > > I guess the trade-off who to bore and whom to carry through >> is always on >> > > the plate of the instructor. I'd have to say that being in >> a team of 2 >> > > helps at this point tremendously as the co-instructor is >> among the >> > > "students" and simply can assist here and there. >> > > >> > > If people have more feedback on the matter, I am happy to >> hear it. If >> > > not, my gratitude to those that replied already. >> > > >> > > Best, >> > > Peter >> > > >> > > On 10/27/2015 03:27 PM, April Wright wrote: >> > > > Hi Peter- >> > > > >> > > > I've been in this exact same situation, though with a >> departmental >> > > > workshop, rather than an SWC one. It's hard, and I'm >> sorry that happened >> > > to >> > > > you. >> > > > >> > > > Since you're SWC, I think the first thing to do is ask >> the host. Often, >> > > the >> > > > host has some specific ideas about what they want the >> learners to come >> > > away >> > > > with, and that can help you steer the course. >> > > > >> > > > What I did, in practice, was this: I spent way too much >> time helping >> > > > novices. I slowed down, got through less than half of the >> material, and >> > > the >> > > > intermediates, who had actually chosen the correct class >> and paid a >> > > nominal >> > > > fee for it were very unsatisfied. I really think that I >> made the wrong >> > > call >> > > > by punishing people who carefully read the sign-up and >> prioritizing those >> > > > who didn't. There are a lot of resources out there to >> help people take >> > > the >> > > > first steps in programming. There are fewer to help with >> the 'what's >> > > next', >> > > > and I should have been more sensitive to that fact. What >> I should have >> > > done >> > > > is told people who were working on novice-level skills >> that they were >> > > > welcome to stay and work, but that people working on the >> course material >> > > > would be assisted first. >> > > > >> > > > On the next go around, I added a list of skills the >> learners needed to be >> > > > comfortable with to attend (previously, it had simply >> been a link to the >> > > > previous workshop) and a code snippet one of the students >> had written. I >> > > > let them know that this was the level of familiarity they >> needed to have >> > > *with >> > > > Python* to attend, and that TAs would preferentially >> assist those who >> > > were >> > > > mastering course skills over those who were mastering >> other material. >> > > > >> > > > That worked, I only had one person for whom the course >> was inappropriate >> > > > (they were too high level) show up. >> > > > >> > > > --a >> > > > >> > > > --------- >> > > > Postdoctoral Researcher >> > > > Iowa State University, EEOB >> > > > University of Kansas, EEB >> > > > 251 Bessey Hall >> > > > Ames, IA 50011 >> > > > 512.940.5761 <tel:512.940.5761> >> > > > http://wrightaprilm.github.io/ >> > > > <http://wrightaprilm.github.io/pages/about_me.html> >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 8:23 AM, Michael J Jackson < >> > > micha...@epcc.ed.ac.uk <mailto:micha...@epcc.ed.ac.uk>> >> > > > wrote: >> > > > >> > > >> Hi Peter, >> > > >> >> > > >> If there are more people falling behind than you have >> helpers to handle, >> > > >> then I'd just slow down. I'd (reluctantly) rather bore >> those who don't >> > > want >> > > >> a slower pace, than confuse those do. >> > > >> >> > > >> cheers, >> > > >> mike >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> Quoting Peter Steinbach <steinb...@scionics.de >> <mailto:steinb...@scionics.de>> on Tue, 27 Oct 2015 >> > > >> 11:39:01 +0100: >> > > >> >> > > >> Hi Raniere et al, >> > > >>> >> > > >>> thanks for the pointers for recording the terminal >> history, I'd like to >> > > >>> get back to my more general question though ... how to give >> > > participants >> > > >>> that are not up to the level of the course a chance to >> follow? I don't >> > > >>> wanna drag them all through, at some point there has to >> be a limit for >> > > the >> > > >>> sake of the remaining crowd. But still, I'd like to >> hear people's >> > > >>> experience on this. >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Best, >> > > >>> Peter >> > > >>> >> > > >>> On 10/27/2015 11:23 AM, Raniere Silva wrote: >> > > >>> >> > > >>>> Hi Peter, >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Could you share these scripts? >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Please check >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >> >> https://github.com/swcarpentry/site/pull/1124/files#diff-9e17f2fd404c84648654a4fc54a9a2ecR71 >> > > >>>> . >> > > >>>> We are going to publish it this week. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> I'd like to see if they'd capture a nano screen etc >> > > >>>>> (I presume not, but I'd like to try them anyhow). >> > > >>>>> Apologies if they were already shared with this >> community and I >> > > >>>>> overlooked them. >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> There are terminal screen recorder that can capture nano >> > > >>>> but from my experience they don't work for what you >> want. =( >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Cheers, >> > > >>>> Raniere >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>> -- >> > > >>> Peter Steinbach, Dr. rer. nat. >> > > >>> HPC Developer, Scientific Computing Facility >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Scionics Computer Innovation GmbH >> > > >>> L??scherstr. 16 >> > > >>> 01309 Dresden >> > > >>> Germany >> > > >>> >> > > >>> phone +49 351 210 2882 <tel:%2B49%20351%20210%202882> >> > > >>> fax +49 351 202 707 04 <tel:%2B49%20351%20202%20707%2004> >> > > >>> www.scionics.de <http://www.scionics.de> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Sitz der Gesellschaft: Dresden (Main office) >> > > >>> Amtsgericht - Registergericht: Dresden HRB 20337 >> (Commercial Registry) >> > > >>> Ust-IdNr.: DE813263791 (VAT ID Number) >> > > >>> Gesch??ftsf??hrer: John Duperon, Jeff Oegema (Managing >> Directors) >> > > >>> >> > > >>> _______________________________________________ >> > > >>> Discuss mailing list >> > > >>> Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> > > >> Dr. Michael (Mike) Jackson m.jack...@epcc.ed.ac.uk >> <mailto:m.jack...@epcc.ed.ac.uk> >> > > >> Software Architect Tel: +44 (0)131 650 >> 5141 <tel:%2B44%20%280%29131%20650%205141> >> > > >> EPCC, The University of Edinburgh http://www.epcc.ed.ac.uk >> > > >> Software Sustainability Institute http://www.software.ac.uk >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> -- >> > > >> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, >> registered in >> > > >> Scotland, with registration number SC005336. >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> _______________________________________________ >> > > >> Discuss mailing list >> > > >> Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> > > >> >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Discuss mailing list >> > > > Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> > > > >> > > >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> > > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > Peter Steinbach, Dr. rer. nat. >> > > HPC Developer, Scientific Computing Facility >> > > >> > > Scionics Computer Innovation GmbH >> > > L??scherstr. 16 >> > > 01309 Dresden >> > > Germany >> > > >> > > phone +49 351 210 2882 <tel:%2B49%20351%20210%202882> >> > > fax +49 351 202 707 04 <tel:%2B49%20351%20202%20707%2004> >> > > www.scionics.de <http://www.scionics.de> >> > > >> > > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Dresden (Main office) >> > > Amtsgericht - Registergericht: Dresden HRB 20337 >> (Commercial Registry) >> > > Ust-IdNr.: DE813263791 (VAT ID Number) >> > > Gesch??ftsf??hrer: John Duperon, Jeff Oegema (Managing >> Directors) >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Discuss mailing list >> > > Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> > > >> > > >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> > > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Discuss mailing list >> > Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> > >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> >> -- >> C. Titus Brown, ctbr...@ucdavis.edu <mailto:ctbr...@ucdavis.edu> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> <mailto:Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org> >> >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Best Regards, >> Dr. Bill Mills >> TRIUMF >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org > http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org > > The University of Dundee is a registered Scottish Charity, No: SC015096 > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org > http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.software-carpentry.org http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org
