To further digress, What can I say to my old-school collaborator who insists on teaching his students PERL, de novo? He claims not to like Python's cryptic error reporting. (I agree but there is so much to offset this.) I have tried everything including translating his code to Python to show how much cleaner it is. -Steve
----- q•b ----- > On Mar 25, 2016, at 06:52, C. Titus Brown <[email protected]> wrote: > > My usual response to the question of "what programming language should I > learn?" is: > > * Python or R, because those are the two languages being used by many > computational scientists, being actively developed, and with rich > existing ecosystems of libraries and tutorials; > > * choose between them based on your local friendly help - if you have > a lot of R folk down the hall, learn R, and vice versa; > > * once you know one, you can pick up another language much more easily than > you might believe; > > cheers, > --titus > >> On Thu, Mar 24, 2016 at 04:06:12PM -0700, Maria McKinley wrote: >> There is also the point of best for what job? Best programming language >> discussions are mostly just flame wars, and I like to address them by >> saying there is no best programming language; it depends on the knowledge >> of the person doing the coding, what they are trying to accomplish, and >> possibly the environment/what all is available on the particular machine >> that the code will run on. >> >> cheers, >> Maria >> >> On Thu, Mar 24, 2016 at 3:27 PM, Giuseppe Profiti < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Related, even if not properly in topic. >>> While attending the SWC train the trainers course in September, I took >>> a note about the "just" and how to keep an I-can-do-it attitude in the >>> learners. >>> Then, in January, I had the chance to try to be more aware of that >>> while teaching Python in a Master's degree course (70-80% of students >>> .usually have a background in biology or biotech). >>> >>> Of course that was a different setting: students believe having more >>> time to grasp the material with respect to a short workshop, they may >>> be less prone to give up during class, but they could do it anyways or >>> maybe give up later when you are not there to answer questions. >>> >>> Anyways, "what is the best programming language?" is something that >>> they asked. I have my programming language of choice, but the >>> demotivation section in SWC guidelines helped in devising a better >>> answer than "I like that, but you choose whatever you want". >>> Instead, I told them that the best programming language is the one >>> they feel more comfortable with. That "if", "for" and functions are in >>> almost every programming language and that after getting it in python >>> they could move to something else. And that if someone in their future >>> place of work would tell them "You should use X because is better!", >>> they may give it a try, see if they like it and maybe toss it in the >>> trash bin if not. >>> >>> Maybe I was wrong or there may be a better phrased answer. In that >>> case, a feedback from you would be more than welcome. >>> >>> To be in topic: instead of thinking about it as "I must not do that", >>> those guidelines could also be used as "how can I convey that >>> information in a better and less threatening way?". >>> >>> Best, >>> Giuseppe >>> >>> >>> >>> 2016-03-24 22:44 GMT+01:00 Greg Wilson <[email protected]>: >>>> One approach is to pre-empt it - I make a point of saying in my intro >>> that >>>> this stuff is genuinely hard, that I shouldn't imply otherwise by saying >>>> "just" (or equivalent), and inviting people to keep score. We can then >>>> compare everyone's scores at the first coffee break, and since they're >>> never >>>> the same, we can then have an interesting discussion about real-world >>> data >>>> :-) >>>> Cheers, >>>> Greg >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 2016-03-24 5:41 PM, Adam Obeng wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Does any one have a tip for how to recover from accidentally doing these >>>>> things? I've tried to explain why I'm apologising for saying "just", but >>>>> that *just* seems to make it worse. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Adam >>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Mar 24, 2016, at 05:30 PM, Steven Haddock wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, I think that is the one. The J-word!! >>>>>> Thanks Lex. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2016, at 14:22 , Lex Nederbragt <[email protected] >>>> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Perhaps this helps? Look for "Things You Shouldn't Do in a Workshop" >>> on >>>>>>> http://swcarpentry.github.io/instructor-training/09-motivation.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Lex >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 24 Mar 2016, at 22:02, Steven Haddock <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> TL;dr Can someone point me to the post about teaching guidelines? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> A little while ago Greg or somebody posted a set of examples of >>> things >>>>>>>> to avoid saying (???You can simply??????, etc). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> A friend of mine (really!) is teaching a class and she realized she >>>>>>>> should avoid saying ???You have probably all done X?????? so I was >>>>>>>> going >>> to send >>>>>>>> her that post, but I can???t find it. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Steve >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Discuss mailing list >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Discuss mailing list >>>>>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Discuss mailing list >>>>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dr Greg Wilson >>>> Director of Instructor Training >>>> Software Carpentry Foundation >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Discuss mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Discuss mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> >>> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org > >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org > > -- > C. Titus Brown, [email protected] > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list [email protected] http://lists.software-carpentry.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss_lists.software-carpentry.org
