Hi Stefan,
What are the arguments in favor of supporting Java 6?
The last public update (6u45) was released in April 2013.
How long would you like to support Java 6?
Hi Denis,
What are the arguments against Java 8?
Java 7 is available since July 2011, with 7u80 being the last public update,
released in April 2015.
Java 8 is available since March 2014.
If we are going to break with older Java-versions, we should not go with
another already outdated platform.
I think we should have a last release with Java 6 (just like 10.6.25 was the
last one for Java 5 [1]), and then target the next release towards Java 8.
To back up this discussion by the best data we have, I looked into the
automatically transmitted user data.
* First, I only copied the files from this year, starting with 2015-01-01, all
into one folder.
* Then, I removed all files with a different year than 2015 in their name (I'm
not sure where they came from, maybe old data that was not uploaded until
2015?).
* Then, I removed all files from sessions with ".DEVEL" or ".TESTING" version
suffixes. This left me with 1577 sessions.
* Then, I counted the Java versions:
$ grep -h java.version * | sort | uniq -c | sort -r
337 java.version=1.8.0_45
299 java.version=1.8.0_31
211 java.version=1.8.0_51
169 java.version=1.8.0_25
164 java.version=1.8.0_40
64 java.version=1.7.0_75
63 java.version=1.7.0_71
56 java.version=1.8.0_60
44 java.version=1.7.0_79
37 java.version=1.8.0_40-ea
32 java.version=1.7.0_65
22 java.version=1.8.0_20
19 java.version=1.7.0_67
17 java.version=1.6.0_65
12 java.version=1.7.0_80-ea
11 java.version=1.7.0_60
6 java.version=1.7.0_45
5 java.version=1.7.0_85
5 java.version=1.7.0_51
2 java.version=1.7.0_40
1 java.version=1.8.0_05
1 java.version=1.7.0_25
As you can see, there is Java 6 being used in 17 out of 1577 sessions
(roughly 1%).
(According to Wikipedia, Java 6u65 was the last version released through
Apple Update in October 2013).
* Then, I wanted to know how many different users are behind this: At most
three.
Opposed to 47 Java-7 users, and 137 Java-8 users.
$ grep -l java.version=1.6 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc -l
3
$ grep -l java.version=1.7 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc -l
47
$ grep -l java.version=1.8 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc -l
137
In other words: roughly 1.5% of the users in our data still use Java 6, a
quarter switched to Java 7, and the majority uses Java 8.
Stefan, how do you feel now about leaving Java 6 behind?
I also looked at the Eclipse versions:
$ grep -h eclipse.version * | sort | uniq -c | sort -r
1153 eclipse.version=3.10.0.v20140318-2214
289 eclipse.version=3.11.0.v20150405-1723
81 eclipse.version=3.9.100.v20131218-1515
19 eclipse.version=3.8.0.v20120912-155025
15 eclipse.version=3.7.0.v20110110
13 eclipse.version=3.9.0.v20130326-1255
5 eclipse.version=3.8.0.v20120521-2346
1 eclipse.version=3.8.0.dist
1 eclipse.version=3.10.0.v20140724-1132
These numbers refer to the version of the "org.eclipse.core.runtime" bundle [2]:
- 3.7 = Eclipse 3.7 (from 2011)
- 3.8 = Eclipse 4.2 (from 2012)
- 3.9 = Eclipse 4.3 (from 2013)
- 3.10 = Eclipse 4.4 (from 2014)
- 3.11 = Eclipse 4.5 (from 2015)
Again, only 1% still use Eclipse 3.x (although completely disjoint with the
Java-6-One-Percent mentioned above).
Cheers,
Franz
[1] http://www.saros-project.org/installation#more%20information
[2]
https://github.com/saros-project/saros/blob/master/de.fu_berlin.inf.dpp/src/de/fu_berlin/inf/dpp/SarosEclipseContextFactory.java#L139
-----Original Message-----
From: Stefan Rossbach [mailto:srossb...@arcor.de]
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 5:00 AM
To: Denis Washington <de...@denisw.de>; dpp-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [DPP-Devel] IntelliJ 15 for OS X will come with JDK 8
You can create your server parts in your own "plugin" and use Java 7 if
you like. I do not see any benefit to use Java 7 for the Eclipse plugin
for now. Eclipse 4.3 can still be run with Java 6 and Eclipse 4.4 is
only available since one year.
On 09.09.2015 16:38, Denis Washington wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I looked at the changes in the upcoming version 15 of IntelliJ today and came
> across the following snippet [1]:
>
> "OS X users may notice that we don't offer the .dmg installer that requires
> Java 6 anymore. Now our .dmg installer comes with a patched JDK 8. It means
> two things: a) you don't need to have Java 6 installed to run the IDE; b) it
> is able to work with Java 6 or higher."
>
> This means that IntelliJ 15 will remove the last reason for us to stay on
> Java 6 for Saros. As most Eclipse packages already require Java 7 since
> version 4.4 [2], it might be finally the time to make use of Java 7 and its
> language and standard library improvements as soon as IntelliJ 15 is released
> (or even before then, given that the IntelliJ plugin has no stable release
> yet).
>
> I was thinking about this right now specifically because I am currently
> implementing our filesystem interfaces on top of the Java standard library
> for the Saros server. Implementing these with the help of the new Java 7
> filesystem interfaces would be drastically simpler and less error prone. For
> instance, the IPath implementation could simply be a thin wrapper above
> java.nio.Path [3]. java.nio.Files [4] is equally useful.
>
> So If we could move to Java 7 very soon, I would be extremely happy.
>
> Regards,
> Denis
>
> [1] http://blog.jetbrains.com/idea/2015/06/intellij-idea-15-eap-is-open/ ,
> section "OS X and Java Version"
> [2] http://wiki.eclipse.org/Eclipse/Installation
> [3] http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/nio/file/Path.html
> [4] http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/nio/file/Files.html
>
>
>
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