Hi, I already told Denis that he can use Java 7 for his server stuff.
Regarding Java 6. I also had written that Eclipse 4.3 is still Java 6 compatible and the release was last year. Of course if you feel the urgent need to update to Eclipse 4.4 you can switch to Java 7. And just a simple rule, just wait a few years before using new technology. There are not any good improvements in Java 8, at least none we need. And you already said that about 25% still use Java 7. BR, Stefan On 14.09.2015 20:26, Zieris, Franz wrote: > Hi Stefan, > > What are the arguments in favor of supporting Java 6? > The last public update (6u45) was released in April 2013. > How long would you like to support Java 6? > > > Hi Denis, > > What are the arguments against Java 8? > Java 7 is available since July 2011, with 7u80 being the last public update, > released in April 2015. > Java 8 is available since March 2014. > > If we are going to break with older Java-versions, we should not go with > another already outdated platform. > I think we should have a last release with Java 6 (just like 10.6.25 was the > last one for Java 5 [1]), and then target the next release towards Java 8. > > > To back up this discussion by the best data we have, I looked into the > automatically transmitted user data. > * First, I only copied the files from this year, starting with 2015-01-01, > all into one folder. > * Then, I removed all files with a different year than 2015 in their name > (I'm not sure where they came from, maybe old data that was not uploaded > until 2015?). > * Then, I removed all files from sessions with ".DEVEL" or ".TESTING" version > suffixes. This left me with 1577 sessions. > * Then, I counted the Java versions: > > $ grep -h java.version * | sort | uniq -c | sort -r > 337 java.version=1.8.0_45 > 299 java.version=1.8.0_31 > 211 java.version=1.8.0_51 > 169 java.version=1.8.0_25 > 164 java.version=1.8.0_40 > 64 java.version=1.7.0_75 > 63 java.version=1.7.0_71 > 56 java.version=1.8.0_60 > 44 java.version=1.7.0_79 > 37 java.version=1.8.0_40-ea > 32 java.version=1.7.0_65 > 22 java.version=1.8.0_20 > 19 java.version=1.7.0_67 > 17 java.version=1.6.0_65 > 12 java.version=1.7.0_80-ea > 11 java.version=1.7.0_60 > 6 java.version=1.7.0_45 > 5 java.version=1.7.0_85 > 5 java.version=1.7.0_51 > 2 java.version=1.7.0_40 > 1 java.version=1.8.0_05 > 1 java.version=1.7.0_25 > > As you can see, there is Java 6 being used in 17 out of 1577 sessions > (roughly 1%). > (According to Wikipedia, Java 6u65 was the last version released through > Apple Update in October 2013). > > * Then, I wanted to know how many different users are behind this: At most > three. > Opposed to 47 Java-7 users, and 137 Java-8 users. > > $ grep -l java.version=1.6 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc > -l > 3 > $ grep -l java.version=1.7 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc > -l > 47 > $ grep -l java.version=1.8 * | xargs grep -h random.user.id | sort -u | wc > -l > 137 > > In other words: roughly 1.5% of the users in our data still use Java 6, a > quarter switched to Java 7, and the majority uses Java 8. > > Stefan, how do you feel now about leaving Java 6 behind? > > > I also looked at the Eclipse versions: > > $ grep -h eclipse.version * | sort | uniq -c | sort -r > 1153 eclipse.version=3.10.0.v20140318-2214 > 289 eclipse.version=3.11.0.v20150405-1723 > 81 eclipse.version=3.9.100.v20131218-1515 > 19 eclipse.version=3.8.0.v20120912-155025 > 15 eclipse.version=3.7.0.v20110110 > 13 eclipse.version=3.9.0.v20130326-1255 > 5 eclipse.version=3.8.0.v20120521-2346 > 1 eclipse.version=3.8.0.dist > 1 eclipse.version=3.10.0.v20140724-1132 > > These numbers refer to the version of the "org.eclipse.core.runtime" bundle > [2]: > - 3.7 = Eclipse 3.7 (from 2011) > - 3.8 = Eclipse 4.2 (from 2012) > - 3.9 = Eclipse 4.3 (from 2013) > - 3.10 = Eclipse 4.4 (from 2014) > - 3.11 = Eclipse 4.5 (from 2015) > > Again, only 1% still use Eclipse 3.x (although completely disjoint with the > Java-6-One-Percent mentioned above). > > Cheers, > Franz > > > [1] http://www.saros-project.org/installation#more%20information > [2] > https://github.com/saros-project/saros/blob/master/de.fu_berlin.inf.dpp/src/de/fu_berlin/inf/dpp/SarosEclipseContextFactory.java#L139 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Stefan Rossbach [mailto:srossb...@arcor.de] > Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2015 5:00 AM > To: Denis Washington <de...@denisw.de>; dpp-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > Subject: Re: [DPP-Devel] IntelliJ 15 for OS X will come with JDK 8 > > You can create your server parts in your own "plugin" and use Java 7 if > you like. I do not see any benefit to use Java 7 for the Eclipse plugin > for now. Eclipse 4.3 can still be run with Java 6 and Eclipse 4.4 is > only available since one year. > > On 09.09.2015 16:38, Denis Washington wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I looked at the changes in the upcoming version 15 of IntelliJ today and >> came across the following snippet [1]: >> >> "OS X users may notice that we don't offer the .dmg installer that requires >> Java 6 anymore. Now our .dmg installer comes with a patched JDK 8. It means >> two things: a) you don't need to have Java 6 installed to run the IDE; b) it >> is able to work with Java 6 or higher." >> >> This means that IntelliJ 15 will remove the last reason for us to stay on >> Java 6 for Saros. As most Eclipse packages already require Java 7 since >> version 4.4 [2], it might be finally the time to make use of Java 7 and its >> language and standard library improvements as soon as IntelliJ 15 is >> released (or even before then, given that the IntelliJ plugin has no stable >> release yet). >> >> I was thinking about this right now specifically because I am currently >> implementing our filesystem interfaces on top of the Java standard library >> for the Saros server. Implementing these with the help of the new Java 7 >> filesystem interfaces would be drastically simpler and less error prone. For >> instance, the IPath implementation could simply be a thin wrapper above >> java.nio.Path [3]. java.nio.Files [4] is equally useful. >> >> So If we could move to Java 7 very soon, I would be extremely happy. >> >> Regards, >> Denis >> >> [1] http://blog.jetbrains.com/idea/2015/06/intellij-idea-15-eap-is-open/ , >> section "OS X and Java Version" >> [2] http://wiki.eclipse.org/Eclipse/Installation >> [3] http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/nio/file/Path.html >> [4] http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/nio/file/Files.html >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Monitor Your Dynamic Infrastructure at Any Scale With Datadog! >> Get real-time metrics from all of your servers, apps and tools >> in one place. >> SourceForge users - Click here to start your Free Trial of Datadog now! >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=241902991&iu=/4140 >> _______________________________________________ >> DPP-Devel mailing list >> DPP-Devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dpp-devel > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Monitor Your Dynamic Infrastructure at Any Scale With Datadog! > Get real-time metrics from all of your servers, apps and tools > in one place. > SourceForge users - Click here to start your Free Trial of Datadog now! > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=241902991&iu=/4140 > _______________________________________________ > DPP-Devel mailing list > DPP-Devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dpp-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ DPP-Devel mailing list DPP-Devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/dpp-devel
