Jay Pipes wrote: > Jim Starkey wrote: >> Jobin Augustine wrote: >>> it appears that you hard core hackers never uses IDEs. >>> anybody using them ? >>> >> >> It all depends on what you call hard core hackers. >> >> Originally, hard core hackers were the guys that trampled the cutting >> edge of technology with audacity. They pushed the limits and weren't >> afraid to experiment. They developed OSes like Tenex and Unix, >> eschewing assembler in favor of high level languages, even when they >> had to invent the language to so. These hard core hackers were >> willing to try anything that appeared on the scene -- objects, >> exception handling, formal interfaces, and, yes, IDEs. The the stuff >> that worked got used and the stuff that didn't got left behind >> (Objective C, anyone? Ada?). >> >> If you mean the contemporary definition of hard core hacker -- >> arrested development adolescents -- then no, they're content to use >> the first rock they picked up to bang on other rocks, and are content >> to use vi and line mode debuggers and are perfectly happy to reset the >> same damn breakpoints after every build. They also think that an 800 >> lines of nested flag testing is the very pinnacle of software >> engineering. These are the guys who can take three years and hundreds >> of man years to put out a maintenance release with more bugs than when >> it started without asking what went wrong... >> >> I can't fathom why some troglodytes are so proud of the ignorance of >> Windows that they're unwilling to even try a different development >> technology. >> >> Oh, well. At least it keeps these people from creating new products. > > I sincerely hope you weren't referring to me or anyone in the Drizzle > contributor community in the above statements. We try on this mailing > list to keep the humour above the belt. > > -jay > > p.s. For the record, I was a software developer using Windows platforms > for years before I began using and developing open source software. And, > yes, I used VisualStudio and other IDEs when I did so. That said, I am > more productive and efficient, not to mention more knowledgeable about > the underpinnings of software, now that I do not use an IDE and instead > use the tools of the GNU toolchain and vim. But, this is my own > personal opinion of my productivity. Everyone makes there own choices > about what tools make them most productive, and there's nothing wrong > with that at all.
I agree with what Jay has said above. Personal insults are not useful to anyone. I also agree with the underlying core of what Jim said - neither being a BOFH or a Luddite curmudgeon make one a hard core hacker. I, for one, would love it if there was an IDE for Linux that was as useful for C++ as Eclipse is for Java. Sadly there is not. I use Visual Studio on Windows when I'm doing C# dev there. I use Eclipse when I do Java. When I use either of them, I'm constantly amazed at some of the tools and benefits they provide for their respective languages. I continue to boggle that the state of C++ IDEs is so terrible. I enjoy the fact that when I program in Python, that the language itself gives me enough tools that an IDE does not provide a value add. (and yes, I have tried all of them) I'm continually amazed at just how inferior IDEs are at the task of text editing- which is surpassed by leaps and bounds by such ancient technology as vi and emacs. (and no, keybindings emulation does not a decent text editor make) However, IDE's are not text editors nor do they aim to be. So show me an IDE that can do proper assisted refactoring for C++, that doesn't churn up a 3G of RAM trying to parse my source tree, that can actually properly answer the question "where in this source tree is this method used", and that actually understands autotools and bzr and how they might interact and I will happily give it a test drive. Over the past year I have tried every single release of both NetBeans and Eclipse and made a few stabs at KDevelop. They've continually gotten better. They aren't yet helpful. _______________________________________________ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~drizzle-discuss Post to : [email protected] Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~drizzle-discuss More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
