At 04:24 AM 9/8/96 -0700, Betty wrote:
I am fascinated by this line of observation. In my circles, amongst educated
New Zealand women, we often pity men because our observation is that few of
them have same sex friends. 'We' believe that women are better at
networking, supporting each other, making friends etc. than men. Men 'do'
things together to impress each other and to be known as 'one of the boys'
because it affects their chances of promotion but do not 'talk'; do not know
how to express their emotions. Is this a real cultural difference between
our countries. Is the difference in our perceptions or in actual behaviour -
if that is a valid distinction.
Are any differences in behaviour gender differences or 'power
structure'/sociological differences? Could it be related to type of
employment, social expectations .... Or perhaps I am older than most of you
and that is why my perceptions are different? I am fifty-one.
I think it may be true that in New Zealand society is more accepting of
women who have sexual relationships and even children out of marriage and
perhaps has more generous state support for them where necessary - this
could make us less stressed about our competition for men. Perhaps, in spite
of the best efforts of our recent governments, in New Zealand we still have
a wider definition of 'success' than pure materialism. This may make
competition in 'getting ahead' in employment less stressful. My impression
is that women here are still more likely to be competing to demonstrate what
good 'carers' they are than to be competing for promotion.
Lots of scope for research!!!
>Jessica wrote:
>
>>On a daily basis I notice that there is a lack of "sisterhood" among
>>women. This lack of "sisterhood" makes it difficult for me to make
>>friends with other women, feel as an equal with other women or feel as
>>though I have support just by being a women. Maybe this is a rare
>>experience, but my intellect tells me that it is a general condition. Why
>>do women have this experience? Why, when I walk into a public place do I
>>feel disconnected and estranged from the women who surround me? Is it the
>>way they look me up and down and not in the eye. Is it their careful
>>consideration of my attractiveness and any perceived threat they
>>therefore attach to me. Is it this perceived threat that keeps women at a
>>distance from one another? Or is it that women find it hard to value
>>other women because of their own insecurities?
>
>I propose that its not either/or but both. I know lots of women and good
>friends among them. But I do know that women are very competitive for the
>attentions of men and bristle somewhat when other women approach in this
>context. This applies to the workplace where sexual competiton operates in
>addition for competition for position and perks. I saw two women at one
>office who squabbled for a year over an office chair. Some other women I've
>worked with resented anyone of us getting ahead or finding a boyfriend and
>bitched endlessly whenever it occured. I know that men do this too, but
>there is an especially vicious quality to the female brand. I think
>insecurties is the biggest reason for such behavior, but even normally
>confident woemn flip out when men enter the picture--dweebs and jerks
>exempted of coarse.
>
>Men seem to really like each other. There may be competition over on of us
>or a job, but it seldom takes on that meanness or state of anxiety that
>afflicts us. They team up. They support each other. A lot think joining the
>army is great, like my brother. They may get mad, but seem to soon put it
>aside. They play together win or lose. For hours. Maybe it's that ability
>to not take everything seriously in the heavy sense.
>
>>>From another dimension I have also viewed this phenomenon. Do men have
>>a similar experience and therefore could this phenomenon be a general
>>human condition? Do men feel disconnected, competitive or otherwise
>>estranged from one another? My suspicions tell me no.
>
>I agree. They don't feel disconected at all for the most part. I envy the
>way they make friends so easily.
>
>>Men have a great blessing in that they are "accepted" because of what they
>>are. This does
>>not mean that they are unfailable, it only means that men have a support
>>system, a "club" to belong to even if they are failures. Failure may make
>>someone socially less appealing but, men still belong to that "club".
>
>>Why do men have a club and women do not? Well, as you are all conscious and
>>educated, you know that we live in a masculine society. In a masculine
>>society, anything masculine is elevated. Anything not
>>masculine therefore exists somewhere beneath masculinity.
>
>I think its deeper than that. It's beyond "society". Maybe it's somethin to
>do with facing death or hardship together, even potentially. Look at the
>ones who join somethign and stick at for years or forever, like the
>Legion. There's something they share without even being aware of it.
>
>>Hurray for men they have created this network, this club where masculine is
>>superior.
>
>Do you really think they see it as superior? I think it just "is". Its us
>thats making the superior/inferior judgement. I don't think they are aware
>of it. Their in it for the camraderie even when they say its just to make
>contacts. It comes natural to them it seems. That's what makes it so
>robust.
>
>>And, what have women been doing in the mean time? With much
>>struggling women are beginning to reunite, build feminine
>>networks, and feel a great strength rising up. This strength is called
>>togetherness I see this growing strength in my peers and in my younger
>>sister's generation. I see >powerful new messages in movies and on T.V.
>>(created by women), messages that are
>>telling of strength and growth. We all need to take part in order to see
>>things through, we need
>>to make our women's network, believe in each other's talents and support
>>even the strangest of strangers. We are women.
>
>That would sure be nice, but I'm not holding my breath.
>
>Betty D.
>
>
>
>
Helen Marsh: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: +64 9 473 9760
PO Box 1304, Hamilton, New Zealand - (Browns Bay, Auckland North Shore)
http://www.iconz.co.nz/~iwgordon
UBINZ - Universal Basic Income - http://www.iconz.co.nz/~iwgordon/ubinz.htm
