Re: Web Forms
The only time I've used web forms is as an interim solution. Either my 3rd
party EDI software provider didn't have a template for purchase, or it wasn't
in compliance with the customers requirements.
I believe my successor has chosen a web form for some major customers, poor
chap. Can you imagine using an interface such as that for a "by-store" customer
like JC Penney ? You'd need an army of data entry clerks......
Art Douglas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Ken,
I had to deal with this kind of malarkey (that's a technical term for a
phrase that has the same initials as Barbra Streisand.) from a company
called Sysco. Yes, I'm naming names. I can because I no longer work for
the supplier. Sysco wanted an exorbitant amount of ca$h to do EDI, and too
much, but less, if we as supplier used their web form. Our sales department
opted to use the web form when I told them I refused to pay the
mid-five-figure-per-year charge to do EDI with one customer with
less-than-stellar volume. Sysco had spun their EDI off to a separate
company, and I guess they provided a valuable service to small suppliers and
customers of theirs. But it seems they wanted to fund the enterprise by
charging people for value add, even when it actually was value subtract. I
predict this will eventually bite them in the rump. (That's a technical term
for a cut of meat.)
Art Douglas
Chief Consultant
Blackwater Network
877-464-8915
-----Original Message-----
From: KenCox(EDI) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 1:41 PM
To: Art Douglas; 'Brian Lehrhoff'; 'knsanjose'
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
Hi Art,
Nope, same WEB EDI, just not implemented in the right context. WEB-EDI
should only be used when one partner is not EDI capable. In this case the
customer is requiring their vendors to access their WEB EDI page, even if
their vendor is EDI capable. They have it interfaced, as you mention, so
that it is like traditional EDI on their end. This makes them happy
campers, and removes their incentive to proceed with implementing real EDI
with the vendor. In this case our business decision is to implement real
EDI, but the trading partner is delaying this.
I believe WEB EDI should not be used in this way. If both parties are EDI
capable, then EDI should be implemented straightaway, even if one partner
does happen to also support WEB EDI for their non-EDI capable trading
partners.
We also have a variation of this happening with a second trading partner,
where they are implementing all of their EDI through a third party service
that is also the provider for a whole list of similar companies. The
choices here are a very low cost WEB EDI solution, versus a prohibitively
expensive EDI connection. So the business decision is to use the WEB EDI
because of the costs to us of implementing EDI.
And I know a lot of you will say "what do you mean pay to do EDI, it's
supposed to be a partnership of shared costs. Just tell them you won't do
it". Again, this is a firm requirement for doing business with the
customer, and the business decision is to keep doing business with the
customer. I fault the third party group who sold them on this
implementation of a solution.
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: Art Douglas <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'KenCox(EDI)' <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; 'Brian
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Lehrhoff' ; 'knsanjose'
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 7:25 PM
Subject: RE: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
Ken,
I believe your understanding of Web EDI and mine must be different. The Web
EDI system I recommend to my customers is Web EDI only for them, traditional
EDI for me.
They go online to their provider, enter a PO on their web page, click send
and it shows up in my traditional EDI VAN mailbox. I process it normally.
When I invoice them, the web image shows up on their Web mailbox.
Softshare provides the service known as Athena which accomplishes this.
Their entry level traditional EDI product, Vista, provides the look and feel
of Athena (rip-n-read), but on your desktop. It can be combined with their
Delta translator for real any-to-any EDI, creating a logical upgrade path.
The maps created for Vista + Delta also work with Delta and ECS, their
Enterprise solution, however you lose the automatic rip-n-read capability.
If you need hard copies, you can write an any-to-formatted-email map to
create the hard copy for yourself.
So a customer who needs EDI for a single supplier can jump in with Web EDI
and the supplier doesn't even need to know how unsophisticated he is.
Art Douglas
Chief Consultant
Blackwater Network
877-464-8915
-----Original Message-----
From: KenCox(EDI) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:jkcedi%40triad.rr.com>
rr.com]
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 3:20 PM
To: Brian Lehrhoff; Art Douglas; knsanjose
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
The problem of "WEB EDI" is when you have a mature EDI program and want to
do "real" EDI, but a customer requires you to do WEB EDI as a first step
(thus gaining the benefits of EDI for them while sticking your company with
all the manual effort to do these turnarounds), and then never wants to talk
to you again about proceeding to EDI (they don't call, i.e. they ignore
voice mail, they don't write, i.e. they don't reply to emails although
delivery report says their mail system accepted the message).
Funny how communication from them was very regular while they were demanding
that we sign up for the WEB EDI program or pay $225 per paper document.
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lehrhoff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:blehrhof%40cybernex.net>
net>
To: "Art Douglas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:acd%40ix.netcom.com> com>;
"knsanjose" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:knorton%40atmel.com> com>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
> And, for those of you on the hub side of things, you can go 100% edi by
using an outside vendor
> that will take 850s and put them on the web, and allow creation of
turn-around 810, 856 and UCC128s. At no cost to you - the vendor pays a
small monthly change. And it's cheaper to him than buying translator
software, integrating into his back-end system (if he has one), and all
those other costs.
>
> In the spirit of the season I won't hang a sales pitch here, just a
concept. Contact me off list for further interest.
>
> Brian Lehrhoff
> EDI Consultant
> 201-913-4506
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Art Douglas <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:acd%40ix.netcom.com> com>
> To: knsanjose <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:knorton%40atmel.com> com>
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 12:52:21 PM
> Subject: RE: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
>
> Karen,
>
> I worked on a committee for a year to create a survey something like you
> need. We didn't use words like "EDI-capable," because they don't really
> answer the question you want answered, which is, will you do EDI with us?
>
> Why not ask a multiple choice?
> (1)Is EDI used in your operation?
> (a) Yes
> (b) No - we plan to implement it in the next year
> (c) No - we are considering implementing EDI
> (d) No - We are not considering EDI at this time.
> (e) Not familiar with EDI
>
> If they answer yes, direct them to the next question - Please send me the
> contact information for your EDI crew.
>
> If they answer no, put them in a stack to contact at a later time, or send
> the contacts to me and I'll work the list for you.
>
> For the "yes" crowd, you may want them to say what standards/versions they
> support, what communications avenues they utilize, what transactions they
> trade. But most important is the contact information.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Art Douglas
> Chief Consultant
> Blackwater Network
> 877-464-8915
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
> knsanjose
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 8:31 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> com
> Subject: [EDI-L] Need Sample EDI Survey
>
> Does anyone have an example of an EDI survey they'd be willing to
> share? I need an idea to get started. We have a bunch of customers
> overseas and I need to find out if they're EDI-capable, which
> transactions they currently trade, how experienced they are, etc.
>
> I started with an Excel spreadsheet, then switched to a Word document,
> then couldn't decide on the wording ("If you are EDI-capable, which
> transactions... But if you're not EDI-capable, do you plan..."), then
> dumped it all 'cause it was a hodge-podge mess.
>
> Once I get it together, I'd be happy to post it in the files area for
> others to adapt.
>
> Thanks,
> Karen Norton.
> EDI Analyst, Atmel Corp.
>
>
>
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