My comments on Tony Frediksson's post are indented among his words.

It is indeed the case that testing in one representative host meets the 
requirements.  But the statement, "...of the PWBA manufacturer's choice so as to
ensure compliance of the PWBA with the entire population of hosts in which it is
intended to be installed" is absurd.

     If the PWBA manufacturer is smart, he will indeed pick a representative    
     type of chassis.  Otherwise, people who want to use his board will         
     reject it as not passing in their implementation.  More on this later.
          
Often times, the host chosen by the PWBA manufacturer is the quietest device 
that the manufacturer can find that will allow the card to pass and is not 
representative of a typical host.  This may allow the PWBA manufacturer to 
eliminate reasonable port filtering, minimize pcb layers, use unshielded 
connectors, avoid fixing poor layout on the card, all in the interest of 
cost reduction and time to market.

     Too true -- but this is all taken care of when WE fail them. 

Then, when the PWBA is installed in a real typical host, the thing fails 
emissions limits by wide margins.  I can think of one video card that will 
remain nameless that is very popular.  I have tested the thing in a variety of 
host systems with a variety of video displays.  The card has an FCC Class B ID 
and CE Marking and is marketed as Class B.  I have never seen it pass Class B in
any combination of hosts, and have failed it for Class A on several.  I know of 
ethernet cards with single and multiple ethernet ports that have this problem 
too.

    We could swap horror stories!  But the bottom line is... if they don't      
    pass, we can't use them.  I've worked with more than a few vendors to       
    help them bring products they wish to sell up to a standard that would      
    allow my employer to use them.
          
Likewise with 15" video displays.  They are typically such a cheap commodity 
that most no longer use even a full shield on the video amp much less any 
enclosure shielding.  Tested on a variety of video cards and in a variety of 
systems, they often fail Class B limits.  I find two problems typically: poor 
video cable shield termination, and poor shielding of video emissions emanating 
from the cathode drivers in the displays.  It is obvious to me that the 15" 
color display manufacturers are choosing quiet video sources to qualify these 
products.  I conclude this assuming that they are staying within the law by 
manufacturing products that are typical of the original test sample.
          
    There are a number of dodges I've seen manufacturers use. One of the        
    slickest is software which created a page of fairly large "H's" on the      
    screen -- and kept the same size no matter what video resolution was        
    selected.  Need I tell that this was not the way I tested it?  I            
    remember, too,  one manufacturer produced equipment with extremely high     
    performance -- but certified it to a level less than it could achieve.      
    That's not the way I tested it, though, and I imagine a firm desiring a     
    high level of performance would insist on having the ability to make use    
    of it.

Then there are the keyboards and mouses that seem to display curious anomalies 
(to be kind under ESD, EFT, radiated immunity and conducted immunity testing 
that are CE marked.  They have essentially no enclosure shielding, little or no 
cable shielding and no common mode noise suppression, cheap PCB layout, and are 
CE marked.  Again, I have tested certain models on a variety of hosts to draw 
this conclusion.

     Pointing device tests are one of the areas for which the standard may      
     not be really adequate.  How do you exercise a mouse when you can't get    
     a conductive close to it?  The same is true for keyboards. It takes work.
          
>From a technical point of view, testing with a representative host/support 
device to show compliance with other hosts is a total "crock."  The standard 
should be ammended to remove this bogus claim.

     The question that needs to be asked here is, with what would it be         
     replaced? Would it be something we could actually _do_?  
          
>From a business and practical perspective, it makes perfect sense.  To do the 
right thing technically (test on a typical host) would be way too big of a 
burden for industry to bear since "typical" changes rapidly and would be 
impractical to prove.  Therefore, as much as I dislike it, the actual 
requirement in the standard should remain the same.

     This makes the point I brought out one paragraph ago.
          
Unfortunately, the burden falls on system integrators and importers trying to 
qualify the myriad combinations of components requested by their aggressive 
marketing/sales departments.  But, nobody said it was an easy job!

     Right!  And it gives us an excuse to beat up marketing types in dark       
     alleys!  (g)


    Cortland Richmond

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