Richard, you bring up a very good point. There is there a difference between a law that states "You cannot sell a product unless it is Listed" and a law that states, "You cannot installed and use a product unless it is Listed." OSHA and NEC and their clones do not control the sale of products; rather, they only control the the installation and use of the product. Many localities do have laws that control the sale of products, however. The state of Maryland and the city of San Fransisco are two examples. In the latter case, the electrical inspectors do monitor the marketplace; but I am sure there are other cases where the electrical inspectors have no jurisdiction over the sale of equipment. Who does then?
There is another angle to this matter - insurance companies. I have not been able to verify this, but it appears to be "common knowledge" that insurance companies require business to install and use only Listed equipment for the fire and injury insurance covering that equipment to be valid. Can anyone verify this? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics [email protected] Views expressed by the author do not necessarily represent those of Sensormatic. > ---------- > From: > [email protected][SMTP:[email protected]] > Reply To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, September 17, 1998 9:38 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: US NRTL required ? > > > Well I think this has been a good discussion. I must confess first that > there have been so many contributions that I have not been able to read > them > all completely. But it seems that there is still a connection missing > (please correct me if I have missed something here), one which I Iooked > into > a bit a couple of years ago. > > The US National Electrical Code (NEC) requirements have been well and > accurately stated (Thanks, Rich N. et al). But from what I have seen, it > seems to me that the NEC never goes that final step and proclaims "YOU > MUST > LIST YOUR PRODUCT" in clear and absolute terms (LISTED being equivalent to > CERTIFIED for those not familiar with US terms). Actually, that is not the > role of the NEC itself. It is the responsibility of the Authorities Having > Jurisdiction (AHJ) to mandate that, or not. The NEC in fact acknowledges > that specoifically, though I can't seem to put my fnger on the exact > paragraph right now (maybe someone could help me with that). These > authorities must adopt the NEC for it to become a legal requirement in > their > jurisdiction. > > What this really means is that laws requiring approved products can be > passed at the federal level, or at the state level, or by any city, > county, > parish, township, village, commonwealth, or whatever, as long as they have > legal authority to make law within specified geographical boundaries. > > I called several local electrical building inspectors around the country > (about 2 years ago now). I asked them directly if they believed that it > was > necessary for a product to have a safety approval to be sold in their > jurisdiction. I spoke with a couple in Florida, a couple in Illinois, one > guy in Chicago, another at the State of Oregon, and the manager of the > building inspector's office at the City of Los Angeles. Chicago, Oregon > and > LA each have their own specific requirements that products be approved. > These are requiremetns beyond what the NEC has. > > For those inspectors who basically relied on the NEC and local adoption of > it or some variant, I asked them for their specific reference in the NEC. > They referred me to the same paragraphs that have already been covered > previously in this discussion. > > In every case, the inspectors believed that those paragraphs DID IN FACT > require approval of products, and that the NEC requirements did apply > within > their jurisdiction (I understood because the NEC had been at some point > officially adopted by that jurisdiction). > > In every case, they agreed that an NRTL Listing (to the appropriate > product > category) would almost always be acceptable. They never wanted to commit > absolutely, just to not rule out that one odd-ball situation. > > In some cases, they would also do their own evaluation to determine if a > product is acceptable as an alternative to an NRTL Listing (for a fee). > Others did not even want to attempt such a thing. They do not have the > resources to do it. They would refer me to an NRTL (usually UL was the > main > one they were familair with). > > When CSA applied to be accepted as an NRTL (at least this is the story > they > have told me) they not only went to OSHA for accreditation, they also went > almost every legal jurisdiction in the US. The number I have heard quoted > is > 40,000 jurisdictions. > > It seems to me that the practical answer for a business that wants to > market > its product across the US and feel reasonably confident that it meets the > legal requirements of all these local jurisdictions is to get an NRTL > approval. > > > Just my 2 cents worth, > > Richard Payne > Tektronix, Inc. > > > > > > > > > > > --------- > This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. > To cancel your subscription, send mail to [email protected] > with the single line: "unsubscribe emc-pstc" (without the > quotes). For help, send mail to [email protected], > [email protected], [email protected], or > [email protected] (the list administrators). > --------- This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to [email protected] with the single line: "unsubscribe emc-pstc" (without the quotes). For help, send mail to [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], or [email protected] (the list administrators).
