I don’t think the price of an ESD would double, and even it it did, that is better than wasting tens of millions of dollars every year borne by all the manufacturers in unnecessary redesign and delay to market. There is no excuse for poor test equipment design.
It would not be hard for me, working with Jon Barth of Barth Electronics, to design an ESD simulator that would meet both the letter and intent (I was helping represent the US to the IEC committee on this for years) of IEC 61000-4-2. And the simulator would be less expensive to use, have a longer life, and be useful for ESD troubleshooting as well (no gun currently on the market is good for troubleshooting, testing maybe, but not troubleshooting). I do not want to elaborate on this as it may compromise future IP and make it less likely that the design will come to be. Such a simulator would just wipe out all other current ESD simulators on the market, they would be obsolete immediately after introduction of this new simulator. Doug Sent from my iPhone IPhone: 408-858-4528 Office: 702-570-6108 Email: [email protected] Website: http://dsmith.org ________________________________ From: John Merrill <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 5:44:45 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PSES] Any Different Results in ESD Testing when Changing Brands of ESD Simulator (IEC 61000-4-2) At a previous employer ran into the issue as Doug describes, using different ESD Guns at different labs. Cal reports showed the ESD Guns with the worst correlation issues were at opposite ends of the permissible di/dt. Other than correlation issues and potential embarrassment of not having adequate margin to account for the variability. Not sure how big an issue it really is. Really depends upon how much it would end up costing to make the correlation better. Doubling the price of an ESD Gun wouldn't be worth it IMHO, however 10% increase would IMO be money well spent. YMMV. On Mon, Oct 14, 2019 at 2:19 PM Monrad Monsen <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Hi! Does anyone have any stories that can be shared of a product getting a different ESD test result when changing the brand/model of ESD simulator? I am a member of the US Technical Advisory Group (TAG) for CISPR/I international standards committee (Electromagnetic compatibility of information technology equipment, multimedia equipment and receivers). There is a proposal that SC77B begin work on changes to IEC 61000-4-2 (ESD) to improve the ESD waveform verification (some call this “calibration”) because under today’s rules different simulators create different levels of high frequency signal content which some believe is the primary reason for different test results. Some believe that the IEC 61000-4-2 waveform requirement fails to include any evaluation of the slope (dV/dt or dI/dt) of the impulse, and that uncontrolled parameter directly affects spectral content. I would like to know if anyone has experienced any actual ESD test result consistency when using different Brand/model ESD simulators even though they are all calibrated simulators under today’s rules. I admit that our company uses the same brand & model ESD simulator as local labs, so I have never observed this issue myself. My initial preference is to not add cost to testing and avoid forcing labs to buy new ESD simulators, but perhaps this cost is warranted if there are actual wide variations in ESD test results depending on the brand of ESD simulator. Thanks. Monrad Monsen | Hardware Compliance Strategist Phone: +1.303.272.9612 Oracle Market Access & Hardware Compliance Strategy 500 Eldorado Blvd | Broomfield, CO 80021 - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)<http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> David Heald <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> -- John Merrill Compliance Manager Hayward Industries, Inc North Kingstown, RI 02851 ********************DISCLAIMER******************** The information contained in this e-mail message, and any attached file, may be CONFIDENTIAL and is for the intended addressee only. 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To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)<http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> David Heald <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <[email protected]> David Heald: <[email protected]>
