Roberto and the Group, 

First, let's try to define the models, and then you will see the qualifications:

The Ercoupe 415 s/n 1, was first certified with the ERCO  IL-116,  65 hp 4 cyl, 
Inverted air cooled, engine,  and simply specified as Model 415.

Before any were sold, Continental made the  A-65-8 engine available at about a 
$500 saving per engine, thus making the 415C (for Continental). All Ercoupes 
have been sold with versions of the Continental engine.

When CAA made new specifications for aircraft  - (Normal and Utility Catagory), 
this allowed for a higher gross weight allowance......making the 415C elgible 
for a higher gross weight...... Thus, was born the 415D with a higher gross 
weight (1400lbs).

Initially, many folks were not satisfied with the higher weight aircraft, which 
required a higher approach speed than the 415C, due to the limited elevator up 
travel of 9 degrees (C and CD models have 13 deg up); to prevent the coupe from 
potentially achieving a stall attitude.

So, very shortly the factory incorporated the modification/improvements that 
were made in the D model (such as a stainless steel cover over the header tank, 
etc) but maintained the elevator up travel in the C model,  and certified the 
revised coupe at the C model GW of 1260 #. This model was called the CD model.

There is no such thing as a C/D model, tho many people call a C model thas been 
converted to D specs ( higher GW, etc.) a C/D model. The conversion requires 
inspection and approval by a FAA field inspector, and issuance of a new 
Airworthiness Certificate. There are over 100 415C models registered that have 
been modified to D specs. I think many have been inspected and approved, and 
many that have been modified with a 337, but actually still have a 415C 
Standard Airworthiness Certificate. (Some folks understand the Model of an 
Aircraft can only be changed by the manufacturer; but that an aircraft can be 
modified to the later specs, by simply following the Manufacture's Service 
Memorandums, with the use of a 337. I would call this change as a C model  
modified to D model Specs....

Here-in lies the problem:

The LSA rules specifically state that an aircraft that has been operated at a 
legal GW higher than the LSA GW specs of 1340 pounds, does not qualify  for 
certification as a LSA. 

Of course lots of discussion enters here ...just  what does the rule really 
say...... and lots of arguments.

There is NO Difference between the C/CD/ D model Ercoupes....except simple 
modifications to throttle, carb heat, and trim control operation, minor changes 
to the landing gear, Gross Weight difference, and *stainless /steel over the 
header tank in the D and CD models... 

*This regulatory safety requirement was missed in the original Certification of 
the C model with the Continental engine, because the IL-116 engine cowling 
stopped at the S/S firewall, and the change to the Continental engine required 
larger cowling that went past the firewall. 

The D model up elevator limit is set at 9 deg to supposedly prevent the heavier 
GW coupe from approaching a stall attitude at full throttle climb.. The 1260# 
GW of the C and the CD model  elevator travel is 13 deg up. 

There is now an STC for raising the C and CD model GW to 1340 # GW. 
Interestingly this STC requires limiting the elevator up travel to the D specs 
of 9 degrees..

I think we will eventually see the D model @ 1400 GW (maybe even 1450 GW, which 
would include the later Ercoupe models, Forney, Alon, ertc., all approved as 
LSA; ,,, tho the LSA industry will fight it to the end. Of course this would 
also lead to the Cessna 150, and other light aircraft to be approved as LSA.

As you probably know, the creation of the LSA aircraft designation was simply 
to encourage the development of light, low cost, new airplanes.....and were 
develped with specifications set by the manufactures with the use of ASTM 
consensus type development. 

Hopefully , we will  see the inclusion of the D, E, F, G, Ercoupes into the LSA 
catagory. Interestingly the H model qualifies, except those that now weigh more 
because the owners added Battery, Starter and Generator.

Just my opinion....

Fly Safe - Have Fun

Harry Francis
N93530



________________________________
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 11:35:03 AM
Subject: [ercoupe-tech] 415-C/D - When it is an LSA and when it is not?

  
As subject says.

I've seen ads for 415's C/D including lines such as:

"LSA",
"not an LSA",
"qualifies as LSA",
"light sport eligible",
"light sport status dubious",
"previous owner bought it as LSA, but it was not"
"its a 415-CD, selling as a D model" (??)

What are the criteria for determining if a C/D is a LSA or not?

Thanks,

Roberto Waltman.





      

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