EV Digest 2580
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: (re) introduction
by "Humphrey, Timothy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: Recipe for battricide?
by "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: DCP
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Motorcycle rolling chassis
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: OT: Terms (Was: (re) introduction)
by Lonnie Borntreger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: DCP
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: OT: Terms (Was: (re) introduction)
by "Humphrey, Timothy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) when is an engine a motor? was(RE: (re) introduction)
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: DCP
by Martin Jackson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: DCP
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Nedra in Vegas 2003
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: New EV trike, Personal Electric Vehicle on the road
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Tropica ADC motor specs
by "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Yamaha 48V Charger
by jon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by michael bearden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: (re) introduction
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) RE: Ebay Findings
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Nedra in Vegas 2003
by "a.k. howard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Nedra in Vegas 2003
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: Recipe for battricide?
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) General Battery Concensus
by Sam Harper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
> The 944S is a very nice car, but it's broken now. Something
> is wrong with
> the motor and I can't figure it out. I've thought about
> making it electric,
>
>
Please don't feel offended by this message!
But, stop calling engines motors, especially on THIS list.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sounds like it aught to have a 60 mile range. So that is 50% SOC. Better
to charge but for a short time it shouldn't be too bad. Lawrence
Rhodes........
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:41 AM
Subject: Recipe for battricide?
> Hi all,
>
> A potential fly in the ointment has arisen. I am in the process of
> purchasing my first electric car:
>
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/238.html
>
> Anyway, I have the blessings of my bosses and the maint. crew to have an
> outlet installed for my charging at school.
>
> The problem is they can't find a way to install a 220v (that's all this
car
> can handle currently) outlet near enough to a parking area without having
to
> do a lot of work (which I will have to pay for).
>
> They are looking into it, and hope to find a solution we can all deal
with,
> but in the meantime, I want to know if I am going to be killing my pack by
> driving to work, parking and driving home without any charging?
>
> The pack that is in it is not the same one listed on the EV album page. It
> has been upgraded to Optima Yellow tops and I think there are now thrity
of
> them.
>
> My morning/evening commute is about 14.5 miles, and it is mostly flat
except
> for one very substantial hill (about 300 feet of rise over about a mile of
> run) that is downhill in the morning and uphill coming home.
>
> So am I in trouble?
>
> James
>
>
> James F. Jarrett
> Information Systems Associate
> Charlotte Country Day School
> (704)943-4562
>
> BREAKFAST.COM halted... cereal port not responding!
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence,
By "for a short time" do you mean doing it for a few weeks/months or do you
mean parking it at work for a "little while" and then going home?
James
James F. Jarrett
Information Systems Associate
Charlotte Country Day School
(704)943-4562
Printed on 100% recyclable phosphor.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:27 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Recipe for battricide?
Sounds like it aught to have a 60 mile range. So that is 50% SOC. Better
to charge but for a short time it shouldn't be too bad. Lawrence
Rhodes........
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
1sclunn wrote:
>
> I added it at the end of a motor cycle tran post. Was to depressed to even
> give it a subject.
> Sounds like there may be some light braking through. Funny two days ago I
> was so up and the weather was fine, than the next day cold, rainy , Bush
> ready for war, My colds hanging on and then the call to DCP .
> What I need is to have that post man deliver a PFC-20 . The Doctor said
> take 2 , PFC-20 and I'll feel better in the morning.
> With a buck enhancer for a de con gestent.
> Steve Clunn
OK OK I will throw it together today. I have been doing 50s, repairs and
R&D, and of course waiting for parts.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have a feeling that with all the new batteries and controllers comming out
and the bunch of Lectra frames out there that can handle 250 pounds of
batteries and still stop somebody should have a smoking street bike out of
it. I hope to be the first. It is somewhat pokey with 48v. 5 Panasonic
will stand upright where the Optimas went and one fits where the old
controller went. Controller under the seat. Charger over the batteries.
Pfc would be a hard fit. Wonder if the A89 can take it. I figure 1000 amps
at 72v aught to be very fast 0 to 60 with the same weight in batteries.
Lawrence Rhodes....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Clevenger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:11 AM
Subject: Re: Motorcycle rolling chassis
> I dunno. For $5,500, I'd rather buy something more my style, where I can
> hide a lot of batteries and still have some trunk space...
>
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2402519257&cat
egory=6708
>
> Tim
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Lawrence Rhodes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:13 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Motorcycle rolling chassis
>
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=24
> 02191769n
> Lawrence Rhodes.......
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Width and length no problem I think my heatsink and controller are the same
as the Zilla in height. I still have 2 inches between the heatsink and
motor. What might work is putting the batteries lower and have the PFC
under the seat and controller above the batteries. A modified Lectra with a
Zilla, PFC-20 and a full fairing might be the best combo for a long range
EV. At 3 hp wonder how far 6 Panasonics would take you. Lawrence
Rhodes.....At this point I can only hope. Fresh out of money.....well some
for the small stuff.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Otmar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:46 AM
Subject: Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
> At 6:51 AM -0800 2/7/03, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> >Looks tiny. Couldn't find the specs. on size.
>
> Hi Lawrence, Thanks for the reminder. There are a few things I still
> need to put on the web site.
>
> Dimensions of the Zilla Z1K Controller:
> 7.00" Wide, 4.63" High, 9.00" Long, Weight 15.5 lb.
>
> >Will the beta price be
> >different than the retail price?
>
> I don't expect it to be. I also don't expect any real problems with
> the beta since it's based on a proven design. I just like to have a
> batch out and running well before I commit to building (and giving
> the warranty on) many. Call me conservative, you won't be the first.
>
> > Wonder what my 720 pounds of bike and
> >blubber would do at 72v with one. Wonder if the Panasonics pump out as
much
> >amps as Optimas.
>
> Someone must have a internal resistance number on the Panasonics.
> Sounds like it would be fun!
>
> >Would it still fit under the seat?
>
> Grab a tape measure, let's see!
>
> -Otmar-
> http://www.CafeElectric.com
> Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 14:10, Humphrey, Timothy wrote:
> > The 944S is a very nice car, but it's broken now. Something
> > is wrong with
> > the motor and I can't figure it out. I've thought about
> > making it electric,
> >
> >
>
> Please don't feel offended by this message!
>
> But, stop calling engines motors, especially on THIS list.
>From Websters:
mo*tor
n.
1 - Something, such as a machine or an engine, that produces or imparts
motion.
2 - A device that converts any form of energy into mechanical energy,
especially an internal-combustion engine or an arrangement of coils and
magnets that converts electric current into mechanical power.
en*gine
n.
1 - A machine that converts energy into mechanical force or motion.
Such a machine distinguished from an electric, spring-driven, or
hydraulic motor by its use of a fuel.
>From what I see here, an internal combustion engine is a motor, but an
electric motor is not an engine. So the use of terms was correct.
Lonnie
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Holy crap. I had no idea. Think I'll stick to small boards....Lawrence
Rhodes......
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: DCP
> Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> >
> > I don't think anybody would pay for the old License.
> > I also don't feel that I would have to... I just wouldn't.
> > There are assembly tricks that the faint of heart should best stay away
> > from, and these and some other assembly procedures make cloning DCP
> > controllers unlikely.
> >
> > But yes I could.
> >
> > --
> > Rich Rudman
> > Manzanita Micro
> > www.manzanitamicro.com
> > 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
> >
> > At the bottom level some people might pay something. What about plans
for
> > the do it your selfer. At a very low level I can repair broken traces
in
> > boards and solder components to a setup board. Any chance for a
controller
> > board project kit? Diagrams, boards etc... I have done shortwave
radios,
> > fixed Rudman regs and the like before. Maybe something based on the
old
> > DCP designs. Maybe something in the 48 to 72v range and another 72v +
model
> > or one that goes from 48v to wherever. I've got a couple of projects
that
> > could use more power or voltage or both. Lawrence Rhodes....
>
>
> Lawerence ... With all due respect....
>
> NO YOU COULDN'T!!
> Have you ever been inside a DCP controller??? The buss bars are 10
> inches long, and precision drilled, and are solder all at once with a 35
> lbs chunk of copper heated to 550 Deg F. You do this 3 times.... once
> for each buss Bar. The Bars are 10 inches of 1.000 by .250 cold rolled
> tight edge bar. We had boxes of screwed up bars, that we Biffed our
> selves. I started out as the Copper butcher and got renamed the Copper
> Bitch, I could mess up a LOT of copper on a bad day.
>
> So, lets just say, unless you want to do a Lot of practice assembly work
> before you get one right.... DCPs are going to be made by Damon's team,
> and that's NOT me anymore.
>
> If I do a DC controller it will be with Modules that are 2x more
> expensive than discretes, and about as easy as possible to assemble and
> service. With Otmars target numbers in mind... I doubt I could compete
> cost wise and feature wise.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Think it will. Might need to limit the spring movement. That controller
should make a two wheeled vehicle scoot. With some modification a PFC 20
would fit on a Lectra. Some custom work would have to be done. Lawrence
Rhodes.......
----- Original Message -----
From: "Otmar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:46 AM
Subject: Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
> At 6:51 AM -0800 2/7/03, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> >Looks tiny. Couldn't find the specs. on size.
>
> Hi Lawrence, Thanks for the reminder. There are a few things I still
> need to put on the web site.
>
> Dimensions of the Zilla Z1K Controller:
> 7.00" Wide, 4.63" High, 9.00" Long, Weight 15.5 lb.
>
> >Will the beta price be
> >different than the retail price?
>
> I don't expect it to be. I also don't expect any real problems with
> the beta since it's based on a proven design. I just like to have a
> batch out and running well before I commit to building (and giving
> the warranty on) many. Call me conservative, you won't be the first.
>
> > Wonder what my 720 pounds of bike and
> >blubber would do at 72v with one. Wonder if the Panasonics pump out as
much
> >amps as Optimas.
>
> Someone must have a internal resistance number on the Panasonics.
> Sounds like it would be fun!
>
> >Would it still fit under the seat?
>
> Grab a tape measure, let's see!
>
> -Otmar-
> http://www.CafeElectric.com
> Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For 4 miles it shouldn't be a problem to go 45 on the Freeway. I do it all
the time going to San Mateo or Berkeley. Thats more like 12 miles or more
of Freeway. I stay in the slow lane and never have a problem. The legal
minimum here in California is 45mph. Lawrence Rhodes......
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:05 AM
Subject: RE: Recipe for battricide?
> I intend to get a PFC-20 eventually, but it's not a matter of 220 or 110
in
> this case, there aren't ANY outlets near the parking areas, so no matter
> what I need, it's going to have to be run.
>
> If given the choice, I'll take 220 over 110.
>
> One thing I forgot to mention in my first post. The 14.5 miles is one
way,
> and about 4 miles of that is "highway" speed, the rest is 35-45 city "stop
&
> go" commuter type traffic.
>
> Thanks again.
>
> James
>
>
> James F. Jarrett
> Information Systems Associate
> Charlotte Country Day School
> (704)943-4562
>
> BREAKFAST.COM halted... cereal port not responding!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
> Behalf Of John Lussmyer
> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:51 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Recipe for battricide?
>
>
> At 11:41 AM 2/7/2003 -0500, James Jarrett stated:
> >The problem is they can't find a way to install a 220v (that's all this
car
> >can handle currently) outlet near enough to a parking area without having
> to
> >do a lot of work (which I will have to pay for).
>
> If the work is going to be expensive, you might want to invest in a better
> charger instead. Take a look at a PFC-20 which can charge from just about
> any outlet you can find.
>
> --
> John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
> http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
James Jarrett wrote:
> I am in the process of purchasing my first electric car...
Congratulations! It looks like a good one.
> I have the blessings of my bosses and the maint. crew to have an
> outlet installed for my charging at school.
> The problem is they can't find a way to install a 220v outlet...
> I want to know if I am going to be killing my pack by driving to
> work, parking, and driving home without any charging?
This will be just fine, unless doing so will discharge the pack too
deeply. That's not likely to happen with 30 Optimas and a 14.5 mile
commute.
However, if it were me, I'd have them install the 120vac outlet. Then,
set up the car so you can charge from 120vac or 240vac. There will
always be times when you'll want to be able to charge from 120vac.
One way to do this is with a 120/240v autotransformer. Since halving the
voltage doubles the current, this would lead to a big transformer and a
very high current at 120vac. However, you can turn down the Zivan's
current so it won't trip on a 120vac 15amp circuit.
If it were me, I'd build a separate 120vac "opportunity" charger. I'd
get an isolation transformer with multiple taps (like 200/220/240vac in,
120vac out. Use the 120vac winding as your input, and put a bridge
rectifier on the 200/220/240vac winding as your output. Adjust charging
current with a switch that selects the tap. Include a timer and ammeter.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, color me stupid!
I'll shut up now.
-----Original Message-----
From: Lonnie Borntreger
To: Evlist
Sent: 2/7/03 4:10 PM
Subject: RE: OT: Terms (Was: (re) introduction)
On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 14:10, Humphrey, Timothy wrote:
> > The 944S is a very nice car, but it's broken now. Something
> > is wrong with
> > the motor and I can't figure it out. I've thought about
> > making it electric,
> >
> >
>
> Please don't feel offended by this message!
>
> But, stop calling engines motors, especially on THIS list.
>From Websters:
mo*tor
n.
1 - Something, such as a machine or an engine, that produces or imparts
motion.
2 - A device that converts any form of energy into mechanical energy,
especially an internal-combustion engine or an arrangement of coils and
magnets that converts electric current into mechanical power.
en*gine
n.
1 - A machine that converts energy into mechanical force or motion.
Such a machine distinguished from an electric, spring-driven, or
hydraulic motor by its use of a fuel.
>From what I see here, an internal combustion engine is a motor, but an
electric motor is not an engine. So the use of terms was correct.
Lonnie
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I saw a funny piece about this on TLC one night. They asked the question of
when it is proper to use the term engine and when is it proper to use the
term motor. They asked a bunch of Engineering types. Every time that they
got an answer they were able to give the engineer or professor a real world
example that contradicted the answer. I'm not sure there is a concrete
answer to this question, so I wouldn't get my feathers ruffled to much.
On this list we do usually stick with Electrics being motors and ICE's being
engines, but I do believe the two terms are quite swapable.
damon
Please don't feel offended by this message!
But, stop calling engines motors, especially on THIS list.
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Why scary? All the rice rockets seem to do fine untill some idiot gets
their hands on them. I would just like to experience some normal
performance in an EV for once. I figure I can get very fast 0 to 60, long
range and good handling with 250 pounds of batteries. Anybody done this
yet? All the examples I have seen just had moderate performance and range.
Lawrence Rhodes......
----- Original Message -----
From: "Otmar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: New Controllers from Cafe Electric
> >Interesting. Small enough to fit on a motorcycle. Scary.
> >
> >Are those liquid cooling tubes attached to it? I just noticed the
> >same connections on the Z2K, after seeing the hoses on the Z1K. I
> >guess you need it with that much power coursing through such a small
> >box.
>
> Hi Gordon,
>
> Yes my controllers are all liquid cooled.
>
> Liquid cooling helps for high power applications and will make any
> controller have a longer lifetime, but it is not always required. One
> of the advantages of liquid cooling is that it makes it easier to
> keep the controller dry by keeping it out of the air stream. Moisture
> is one of the leading causes of controller failure. I haven't had any
> trouble with it myself, probably because I warn so strongly about it
> and conformal coat all the high voltage boards, but I've seen many
> Curtii die due to water in the case.
>
> My controllers can also be run with air cooling if it is dry air. I'm
> sure you could just run a fan on it's base plate for a motorcycle
> since the continuous load is so light. I have yet to determine the
> vehicle weight, gearing and climate limit for air cooling them. As
> an example I often drive my 3000 lb single ratio car with the cooling
> turned off for testing and it takes surprisingly long to overheat. Be
> warned though, running a controller into overheat on a daily basis is
> just not a good idea if you want to see many years of service.
>
> -Otmar-
>
> http://www.CafeElectric.com/ New Zilla controllers, now available.
> http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"Silly question time -- do you think Damon would (or should) license his
controllers to someone else to build? This produces some revenue stream
to him, without requiring him to actually build them."
I spoke to Damon two years ago about selling kits. He had thought
about doing them and agreed that those who built a kit would be better
owner/customers. He was too busy to work out the details from his
(business) point of view.
The kit is about the same for a hobby customer and a commercial
assembly effort. The tricky part of the assembly mentioned by Rich
should be done for the kit. The purchase of parts and instructions for
assembly are close to the same for both customer types.
"George Tylinski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"Too bad, DCP put Auburn out of business (or so it appeared to me) then
had to bow out anyway..."
I think Auburn was getting out before Damon came along. They had a
good product for the basic DC EV and could/should have consigned the
rights to another builder. Neither Auburn or DCP are 'companies' with
strong 'financials' that can weather a bad patch.
Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"The fact that the "tricks" in it are now dated and wouldn't be used in a
new design is actually a *good* thing. It means there is little reason
to keep them a secret any more."
The product or the kit parts assembly and proven circuit is so much of
an advantage that the 10 % of people who want to design their own
controller don't count economically. Reputation alone is a real asset.
Bob Rice wrote:
> The fellow at DCP I spoke with, wasn't Damon, [said] that they had Sep
> Ex'es on the drawing boards
When a real side by side comparison of the good sep-ex and series road
Cars are done, the result will make the sep-ex look awfully good. The
combination of 10% + range and somewhat increased battery cycles will
have a compounding effect.
"Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"At the bottom level some people might pay something. What about plans for
the do it your selfer."
We competent spastics can't do as good a job of getting the parts all
purchased without spending many 10's of hours compared to DCP.
______________________________________________________________________
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich Rudman wrote:
> Have you ever been inside a DCP controller? The buss bars are 10
> inches long, and precision drilled, and are soldered all at once
> with a 35 lbs chunk of copper heated to 550 Deg F. You do this 3
> times.... once for each buss Bar.
Yes, I've seen it. I've always wondered why Damon did it this way. Yes,
it produces the lowest possible electrical and thermal resistance. But
it also makes it very hard to build, and impossible to repair!
But, this part of the construction could be considerably simplified with
only a small loss in performance.
Better still, use modules or Isotops. They cost more, but boy, do they
make assembly easy!
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Who is going (besides Richard Furniss)?
I was thinking of flying out to check out the action.
Also, will there be a Woodburn event in 2003?
Seth
--
vze3v25q@verizondotnet
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Steve and All,
--- 1sclunn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I've been thinking about your project since you
> first posted as I have 2 old
> golf carts and want to do the same.
> > Fla has some new Personal Electric Vehicle
> > laws that let you go 20mph without tags, reg, only
> DL
> > needed.
> I though only people form out of state needed a DL
> (joke)
You mean people who drive cars in Fla need DL's!
I'd bet 1 out of 5 don't.
They didn't mean for people to have to have a DL
for these vehicles but only 1/2 the law got passed.
Our great Fla gov at work.
>
>
> So does this mean you can drive golf carts on the
> road now, do you need (I
> would hope) Brake lights, ect ?
It's debateable about golf carts as they are
slow and wide, making more of a road problem. Also
golf carts are taken seperately by Fla laws with their
own vehicle class.
So do what I'm doing.
What I'm going for is 32" width as little wheel
as I can find that runs closest to the frame rails
without touching. With the taller wheels, 12" less
rear track, centered seating with passenger tandem
with twice the speed puts it in a different class than
a golf cart, the bicycle class! You'll need a small
motorcycle front end for the brakes at higher speeds.
The only light you are required is a flashlight
that a bike would need at night as these run on bike
road rules. I use good head and tail lights as I drive
to work at any hour, day or night. It pays to be well
lit. Reflectors too.
I've ridden my cycle chair for months without a
problem like this, unlike when I had a car and was
stopped all the time for nothing.
Talked to the local police and those in charge
says it's okay though pushing the line.
> I'll be having Fort Pierce's 4ht EV rally the end
> of April and would Like
> to see you there (maybe I can hook you up a ride )
Sounds like fun, I'll see if I can make it.
jerry dycus
> Steve Clunn
>
>
> > So to make it narrower than the 40" it is
> now
> > at the wheels some offset, smaller compact spares
> will
> > be fitted probably if I can find light ones. Many
> of
> > them weigh as much as a regular, full size tire.
> Maybe
> > some reg tires, rims from an early Civic, other
> front
> > drive cars, as they were alum, small and well
> offset.
> > I did it for reliability to get to work
> > pumping 1/400's of the US's oil supply which I'm
> > trying not to use any of.
> > Before on my other trike, it had 2 chain
> > reduction drive and the other night, 12am going
> to
> > work the chains started flying off the sprockets.
> It
> > took 15 mins to get back together, fixed, arrived
> to
> > work late, greasy. Not good, so the reliability of
> > gear drive will be welcomed.
> > If my commute wasn't 12 miles each way the
> chain
> > system could work but I wanted a 50 mile range and
> > higher speeds 23 vs 16mph. I live 15 miles outside
> of
> > Tampa so longer range is needed and the higher
> speed,
> > suspension will make it safer, more comfortable.
> > To extend it's daily range there is a 30 amp
> > charger for bulk charging.
> > All in all, a good EV grin Day!
> > jerry dycus
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'd Love to do this. Problem is money and skill. I don't have either. My wife
is pregnant with our first child, she's due in early may. We just purchased new
carpet for the entire house (my allergies required it) and now we are purchasing
the car.
I just can't afford it. I thought about including the cost of a pfc-20 in the
loan for the car, and while the bank would loan me the money, I don't think I
would be comfortable with the size of the payment (I already don't like the size
if it).
James
Quoting Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
<STUFF DELETED>
> If it were me, I'd build a separate 120vac "opportunity" charger. I'd
> get an isolation transformer with multiple taps (like 200/220/240vac
> in,
> 120vac out. Use the 120vac winding as your input, and put a bridge
> rectifier on the 200/220/240vac winding as your output. Adjust charging
> current with a switch that selects the tap. Include a timer and
> ammeter.
> --
> Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
> 814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
> Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
> leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have an Advanced DC motor ( AC4-4002 ) --- ie. one of the Tropica
6.75inch, 7HP, 75v motors----that's about all I know of it...
I'm adapting it to a 25Hp outboard boat motor with power head removed.
I know nothing more of the ADC motor than above, plus the fact that it
appears to require about 11amps to overcome its friction. I haven't
measured the torque constant or motor constant.
If anyone out there has characterized these, I'd really like to know what
the results were. If not, I'll certainly post what I end up measuring.
Thanks in advance.
-Myles Twete, Portland, Or.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I just acquired a Yamaha 48 Volt charger to charge my comutacar. (Yeah, I
know, go with a higher voltage battery pack in the car, blah blah blah) It
looks like a fairly nice unit, with microprocessor control, etc. Does
anyone have any experience with these units? A schematic perhaps? They
were meant for the Yamaha 48 V "Golf Cars".
Have not connected it yet. It has a 17 Amp output, with a Nabson #
Connector. Since the charger is going to be mounted in the car, I'm going
to cut off the connector and wire it direct. Also am looking for a DC-DC
converter, so I can save some weight by ditching the 12V battery.
Comments?
Jon
--
Jon Kenneke, General Manager
Kenneke Communications - http://www.kenneke.com
PO Box 3126 - Albany, OR 97321-0702
Radio Takena KTK - http://www.radiotakena.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I guess I should reply to the list on this one, and not just to James (since I
already owe him an e-mail regarding "warts"...James, I will explain the delay
when I e-mail you.)
The NG5 is very picky about its input voltage- even trying to fool it with two
legs of a 208
3-phase will cause it blow a fuse on the input side...so I have a boost
transformer (which I will include with the Zivan) that I keep at work where
this happened. However, with honest to goodness 120v single phase, I have made
an adaptor to take two discrete circuits and power the Zivan, and it seems to
accept that just fine, as long as the voltage is correct.
As to the range and pack, it is 16 buddy pairs of Optima yellow tops, and this
EV loves the 50-60mph band better than any other; that seems to be the perfect
cruising speed for it. What eats into range is too many stops (from that speed)
and then accelerating back up to that speed (which is what my daily commute is
like-16 traffic lights or stop signs, and the need for speed pretty quickly
coming off of them. I estimate the usable range of the vehicle now from 50-60
miles depending on 1)number of those stops and starts and 2)driver behavior at
them (!!)
Michael B.
James Jarrett wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> A potential fly in the ointment has arisen. I am in the process of
> purchasing my first electric car:
>
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/238.html
>
> Anyway, I have the blessings of my bosses and the maint. crew to have an
> outlet installed for my charging at school.
>
> The problem is they can't find a way to install a 220v (that's all this car
> can handle currently) outlet near enough to a parking area without having to
> do a lot of work (which I will have to pay for).
>
> They are looking into it, and hope to find a solution we can all deal with,
> but in the meantime, I want to know if I am going to be killing my pack by
> driving to work, parking and driving home without any charging?
>
> The pack that is in it is not the same one listed on the EV album page. It
> has been upgraded to Optima Yellow tops and I think there are now thrity of
> them.
>
> My morning/evening commute is about 14.5 miles, and it is mostly flat except
> for one very substantial hill (about 300 feet of rise over about a mile of
> run) that is downhill in the morning and uphill coming home.
>
> So am I in trouble?
>
> James
>
> James F. Jarrett
> Information Systems Associate
> Charlotte Country Day School
> (704)943-4562
>
> BREAKFAST.COM halted... cereal port not responding!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> >
> >
>
> Please don't feel offended by this message!
>
> But, stop calling engines motors, especially on THIS list.
>
So replacing a broken gas motor with an electric engine is out (joke)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 6 Feb 2003 at 5:46, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Probably someone interested could email the seller to arrange direct
> purchase, but in light of the resent NiCad problems it might be risky.
One EV hobbyist recently had a problem with a different type of module, and
AFAIK the cause isn't yet fully known. This is only one case, so it's
hardly statistically useful.
Nicad cells and modules are used in many thousands of industrial, railroad,
and other commercial installations worldwide. Also, IIRC, there are about
6,000 nicad-fitted EVs in use in Europe.
Nicads are pretty sturdy, significantly more resistant to abuse than lead
batteries. If you're interested in these modules and have a use for them,
don't let a single failure in an EV here stop you. On the other hand, make
sure they're what you need before writing a check!
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation, or
switch to digest mode? See http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 7 Feb 2003 at 19:49, michael bearden wrote:
> I have made an adaptor to take two discrete
> circuits and power the Zivan, and it seems to accept that just fine, as long
> as the voltage is correct.
Time for a note from the AESN (annoying electrical safety nag).
There are some significant hazards in using these adapters. Please install
a proper 240 volt receptacle for your charger and destroy the adapter.
If you feel you must use it, please don't use it in public, and definitely
don't ever use it when small children are around. If a kid should pull one
of the 120 volt plugs out, either accidentally or out of curiosity,
dangerous voltage (120 volts to ground) would be present on one of its pins.
You'd feel pretty bad if that happened -- especially if it were your kid.
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation, or
switch to digest mode? See http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ev <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Nedra in Vegas 2003
Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 20:06:12 -0500
Who is going (besides Richard Furniss)?
I was thinking of flying out to check out the action.
Also, will there be a Woodburn event in 2003?
Seth
--
I will be there. Regards, A.K. Howard, Las Vegas NV. Board Member Las Vegas
EV Association.
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 02:18 PM 2/7/03, you wrote:
Why scary? All the rice rockets seem to do fine untill some idiot gets
their hands on them. I would just like to experience some normal
performance in an EV for once. I figure I can get very fast 0 to 60, long
range and good handling with 250 pounds of batteries. Anybody done this
yet? All the examples I have seen just had moderate performance and range.
Lawrence Rhodes......
Well, my bike has just over 300 pounds of batteries. It gets
reasonable performance, but, to be honest, I wish it were a little better.
_ /| Bill "Wisenheimer" Dube'
\'o.O' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
=(___)=
U
Check out the bike -> http://www.KillaCycle.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 06:06 PM 2/7/03, you wrote:
Who is going (besides Richard Furniss)?
I plan to be there with the bike.
I was thinking of flying out to check out the action.
Also, will there be a Woodburn event in 2003?
It may, or may not, be at Woodburn, but there will be a NEDRA
event at that time of year and on the West coast. Nothing is firm quite
yet. It will be shortly. We're working on it.
_ /| Bill "Wisenheimer" Dube'
\'o.O' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
=(___)=
U
Check out the bike -> http://www.KillaCycle.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> get an isolation transformer with multiple taps (like 200/220/240vac
>> in, 120vac out. Use the 120vac winding as your input, and put a
>> bridge rectifier on the 200/220/240vac winding as your output.
>> Adjust charging current with a switch that selects the tap. Include
>> a timer and ammeter.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'd Love to do this. Problem is money and skill. I don't have either.
If 120vac is all you can get at work, then you need a 120vac charger.
You want to charge at work, because reducing your depth of discharge
will extend the life of your batteries. Optimas are expensive, so if you
don't pay now, you'll pay more later!
On the skill side, this type of charger is very simple. We can help you
work through it. I can supply an exact circuit diagram telling where
every wire goes.
On the cost side, buying surplus or used parts will help. For example,
The Surplus Center, 1-800-488-3407 lists a 1000 watt 230/115vac
isolation transformer, item #15-1069, for $49.95. Jameco Electronics
1-800-831-4242 <www.jameco.com> has an 800v 35amp bridge rectifier, part
#178431, for $2.95. They also have switches, wire, and other misc.
parts. Home Depot or Menards will have the GFCI and timer. The entire
charger won't cost over $100.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'd like to get everyones feedback and corrections to my views on the
current state of battery technology, including (but not limited to) the
following categories:
-Lead Acid : A good staple battery. Proven to provide adequate
service, though it does not have a high capacity
-Optima Yellow Top : A step up from the lead acid. Providing more
reliable, easier to care for service, though also lacking in the
capacity.
-Ni-Cad : A step up from the Yellow Top offering a higher-capacity but
less environmentally friendly, harder to dispose of, and harder to
charge. Not widely available, and may require special watering systems.
-NiMH : Another step up from Ni-Cad, offering easier to maintain packs,
but not available. Higher capacity.
-Evercell : I am unsure of its capacity in relation to Ni-Cad, and
NiMH, but I believe it is higher than the Yellow Top. No proven
track-record, but could be a good Lead Acid replacement. More
expensive.
-Li-Ion : Just recently available in a size needed by EVs (one example
being Thunder Sky). No proven track record. Has the highest capacity.
VERY Expensive.
Please add, modify, and delete from this list. Thanks! I appreciate
the help as I learn more about this field.
-Sam
--- End Message ---
