EV Digest 2656
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: EV Sites
by "David Li" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Magnechargers and charging
by "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: EV Sites
by "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Heibao EVs (was: RE: EV Sites)
by "Chris Tromley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: EV Sites
by Lock Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Economically Justify an EV?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) EV FAQ
by David Brandt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
by "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Magnechargers and charging
by "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Heibao
by "Jon \"Sheer\" Pullen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) First and last battery in string?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Re: Magnechargers and charging
by "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: emi affetcs brains
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: Magnechargers and charging
by "Dave Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: emi affetcs brains
by "Thomas Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
by "Chris Tromley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Segway is the answer (what was the question?)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
21) RE: Magnechargers and charging
by Humphrey Timothy H Contr AFRL/IFEC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Heibao
by harsha godavari <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Electric Supra?
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Economically Justify an EV?
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Heibao
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Heibao
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) RE: Magnechargers and charging
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
28) RE: Magnechargers and charging
by "Dave Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,guys,
I represent a Chinese EV manufacturer,Heibao, we are looking for partners in
USA to market our new electric cars. Pls see the temporary website:
http://evcanada.tripod.com
Thanks,
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carmen Farruggia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 9:05 AM
Subject: EV Sites
>
> Hi, I am new to this list and new to EV research. Bruce posted recently
> about bogus sites. I have seen many of them. Many of them either are
or
> appear to be from our government. Too many of them are very out of date.
> I know that this question has probably been asked but why has CARB droped
> its ZEV mandates? I've asked them but they have not responded.
> As I was looking for different EV's for sale I noticed that all of the
major
> and some minor auto makers have canned the EV so fast you can hear the
hubs
> spinning.
>
> That's it for now.
>
> Carmen still looking for EV's in Sacramento
>
>
> Say, anyone have thoughts on t the small but may have potential Reva. I
> hear they are working on a LHD for us here in the states. Only $6000
>
> Also the Think???
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Part of Bruces post:
> Anyone trying to buy a new EV will find this site and get
> frustrated. Where's the EVs!?!
>
> Toyota released their www.toyota.com/html/shop/vehicles/prius/
> site to the search engines so that it can be found when
> looking for Electric Vehicle. hybrids are not EVs.
>
> And don't you love the domain squatters that hold domain
> names for ransom? www.myev.info
>
> More sites to fall into can be seen at:
> http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=%22electric+vehicle%22+information
>
> If you know of some, please POST the urls so we can see
> them.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of waiting
for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I* can do
about all this.
And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the cars?
Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD. Along
with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And doing the
same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a friend's house
in Clarksville MD.
Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow? If we can't
count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing it ourselves...
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hmmm,
Is it just me, or does anyone else get nervous when a "foreign distributer
of company xyz" points me to a tripod web page and lists a hotmail e-mail
address?
James
James F. Jarrett
Information Systems Associate
Charlotte Country Day School
(704)943-4562
Time cannot be influenced by mankind. It gives each of us a beginning an and
end. And this makes us question the significance of what comes between. But
if you can create something that time cannot erode, something which ignores
the eccentricities of a particular era or moments - something truley
timeless - this is the ultimate victory.-- Anon.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of David Li
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 10:11 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: EV Sites
Hi,guys,
I represent a Chinese EV manufacturer,Heibao, we are looking for partners in
USA to market our new electric cars. Pls see the temporary website:
http://evcanada.tripod.com
Thanks,
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carmen Farruggia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 9:05 AM
Subject: EV Sites
>
> Hi, I am new to this list and new to EV research. Bruce posted recently
> about bogus sites. I have seen many of them. Many of them either are
or
> appear to be from our government. Too many of them are very out of date.
> I know that this question has probably been asked but why has CARB droped
> its ZEV mandates? I've asked them but they have not responded.
> As I was looking for different EV's for sale I noticed that all of the
major
> and some minor auto makers have canned the EV so fast you can hear the
hubs
> spinning.
>
> That's it for now.
>
> Carmen still looking for EV's in Sacramento
>
>
> Say, anyone have thoughts on t the small but may have potential Reva. I
> hear they are working on a LHD for us here in the states. Only $6000
>
> Also the Think???
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Part of Bruces post:
> Anyone trying to buy a new EV will find this site and get
> frustrated. Where's the EVs!?!
>
> Toyota released their www.toyota.com/html/shop/vehicles/prius/
> site to the search engines so that it can be found when
> looking for Electric Vehicle. hybrids are not EVs.
>
> And don't you love the domain squatters that hold domain
> names for ransom? www.myev.info
>
> More sites to fall into can be seen at:
> http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=%22electric+vehicle%22+information
>
> If you know of some, please POST the urls so we can see
> them.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David Li wrote:
> Hi,guys,
> I represent a Chinese EV manufacturer,Heibao, we are looking
> for partners in USA to market our new electric cars. Pls see
> the temporary website: http://evcanada.tripod.com Thanks,
Hi David,
This is good news! I knew it was only a matter of time before Asian
manufacturers would move to fill the demand for EVs that American
companies are pretending does not exist.
I must assume that if you are planning to market a four-wheel vehicle in
the US that has a maximum speed of 120 kph (75 mph), it must have passed
all United States FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards).
Without such certification the cars may not be operated on public roads.
I have heard there are provisions to introduce a vehicle before testing
is complete, but those provisions are very restrictive. And taking this
approach can be very risky should the vehicles not pass all
requirements.
I bring this up because this group is possibly the best informed on EV
matters of any outside the auto industry, yet we have heard nothing of
any FMVSS testing in progress. The website lists Heibao's total assets
as ~$183M USD. That is rather small as car companies go, in fact there
are auto dealerships in the US larger than that. The FMVSS process is
expensive and time consuming. If Heibao has passed FMVSS with such
limited resources, they have my deepest respect. Please let us know the
status of Heibao's compliance with FMVSS.
The cars described on the website look very promising. What is the
proposed selling price? 120 kph top speed and 110 km (68 miles) range
would make these very useful vehicles. Be warned, however, that
American consumers have been disappointed by unfounded claims in the
past. Being overly optimistic in your claims will ultimately hurt your
progress, not help it. If these figures are in fact what the average
user can expect in daily use, you will do well.
Also be aware that American consumers of EVs will be very conscious of
environmental and social issues. Unfortunately, the Chinese are
perceived by many in this country as having little regard for a clean
environment or the rights of workers. Your success will be enhanced if
it can be verified that these cars are produced in an environmentally
responsible fashion and that your employees work in safety and with
dignity.
Please provide more information on your plans for establishing a sales
and service network in the US. What types of companies would you prefer
to represent Heibao? Do you plan to use only established dealers of
other brands of automobiles, or are you open to dealers with no previous
connection to the internal combustion status quo?
Please tell us more of this venture.
Best of luck,
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- James Jarrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hmmm,
> Is it just me, or does anyone else get nervous when a "foreign
> distributer of company xyz" points me to a tripod web page and lists
> a hotmail e-mail address?
> James
It's just you. I'm excited <grin>. These are early days. I don't mind
seeing a startup running lean and mean, steada throwing lots of money
about. I just hope it is good product. Wonder if any 2003 Tour de Sol
folks had a good look, as there was supposed to be a vehicle there...
Lock
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/TorontoEVA/
______________________________________________________________________
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am sure that as gasoline prices increase, many may be considering building
an EV. It is a difficult decision.
A $6000-$8000 expenditure in components and another $1000-$4000 in a vehicle,
can certainly buy a lot of gasoline. So our standard response is that you
cannot economically justify an EV. But we also state that you cannot
economically justify an Internal Combustion Engine (ICE) Vehicle either.
One individual talked about a new ICE which costing $20,000 loses 20 percent
of its value the day you become the owner. He assumed 4 years 50,000 miles
without any repairs; however, mufflers, tuneups, oil changes and other ICE
related activities are not part of the warranty. Neither is the higher
excise tax, sales tax, or insurance cost for a new ICE.
Although we state that you cannot economically justify an EV, you can break
even or in some cases make money. We have helped a number of people convert
their S-10 or other vehicle (used). The initial cost of these used vehicles
were $1000 - $4000. Our conversion package for trucks with everything is
less than $10,000. Most only spend about $6000 - $8000. After driving
their EVs for 2 years, these customers have sold their EV for $10,000 -
$12,000. So they essentially broke even and had lots of fun!
We also had a 1991 S-15 as a demo vehicle. We paid $6000 for this used
vehicle and made it a real nice conversion with aluminum wheels, etc. We
had it for 2-3 years and sold it for $20,000. The new owner has had it for
6 years and is extremely pleased - still on the original battery pack we sold
him.
Our customers invested about $12,000 and broke even after 2-3 years. In the
meantime that $20,000 new ICE Vehicle depreciated to $10,000; losing $10,000.
So which one do you think is more economical?
Free tech papers available by request to [EMAIL PROTECTED], including:
- "Safety First"
- "Selecting A Vehicle for Conversion"
- "Do It Right the First Time"
- "Battery Essentials"
- "DC Motors and Controllers"
Please do not send your request to the EV Digest.
We send our catalog with all technical paper requests.
"Anyone can build an EV - but building great EVs
requires experience and engineering."
Bob Batson P.E.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Free Offers at Home Page
www.EV-America.com
Electric Vehicles of America, Inc. (EVA)
Tel# 603-569-2100
Fax# 603-569-2900
11 Eagle Trace
P.O Box 2037
Wolfeboro, NH 03894
***********************************
Authorized Distributor for Advanced DC Motors,
Curtis and ALLTRAX Controllers,
Albright Contactors, and other EV component manufacturers.
Free catalog. Largest EV Component supplier in the East
Electric cars, trucks, motorcycles, boats, ski-dos, and more.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>> I would like to build a monitoring circuit so I can watch the
>> new batteries in action. Question: Does anyone make a small,
>> simple circult to read a battery's voltage and output it in
>> digital form?
Christopher Meier wrote:
> Yes; order up a couple of the relay boards and the control board
> from Lee's battery balancer and use it to monitor your pack.
Yes, indeed! I am collecting orders to see if we can afford to make
another run. Since you only want to monitor and not charge each battery,
you don't need the relay boards with their 30-amp relays. Use some much
smaller long-life signal relay, like a reed relay.
Also, make sure you do a little R&R on your batteries, once you can get
at them and test them individuall. It is amazing how well then can
sometimes return from the dead.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For those who are new to the list or unaware, evparts.com has an "EV FAQ"
section that is well worth perusing.
It is much more than the usual EV questions, although the standard questions
about range and such are addressed. There are over 6 pages of questions and
answers. The topics include subscription to the EV list, EV's and
pollution, links to informational sites, and basically everything from "what
kind of batteries should I use" to "what is power factor correction in a
charger and why is it desirable". Drop by and take a look.
By the way, if a question is not answered yet or you feel something needs
further discussion, e-mail the editor using the links on the page. Your
additions may be included for others to peruse. Also, if you find a dead
link in the FAQ's, send e-mail. They rely on comments from site visitors to
maintain current information.
David Brandt
IMPORTANT - THIS MESSAGE (INCLUDING ANY ATTACHMENTS) IS INTENDED ONLY FOR
THE USE OF THE INDIVIDUAL OR ENTITY TO WHICH IT IS ADDRESSED, AND MAY
CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, CONFIDENTIAL AND EXEMPT FROM
DISCLOSURE UNDER APPLICABLE LAW. IF YOU ARE NOT THE INTENDED RECIPIENT, YOU
SHOULD DELETE THIS MESSAGE IMMEDIATELY AND YOU ARE HEREBY NOTIFIED THAT ANY
READING, DISSEMINATION, DISTRIBUTION OR COPYING OF THIS MESSAGE, OR THE
TAKING OF ANY ACTION BASED ON IT IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED. THANK YOU.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ok, count me in for 50 :-) Seriously, that's a thought, but I might build
some sort of multiplexor on the input as I don't need to see all 50
batteries at once. Polling them might be a better idea.
As to saving the batteries... Sigh... I really would like to just do a swap
again, but the problem is the Prizm's pack is a pain to remove, and I've
tried that once. Weeded out about 10 batteries that were weak (10 volts to
dead open) it ran for a month then the same half of the pack failed again.
My guess is simply that 1/2 of the pack (it's 2 strings of 25) is weaker
than the other and under stress the weakest battery just goes. Looking at
the telemetry I got when I tested the batteries shows that there are good
ones in there, but there are just a lot of somewhat tired ones. Weakest link
breaks the chain.
The pack is 10 years old. Although it only has 3k miles on it, it sat for 5+
years without a charge, was treated pretty badly, and still ran for a year
with 25 miles of range. That's not bad.
A new pack is going to cost me $2,000+$450 shipping. Which actually isn't
bad, and it will finally allow me a chance to get some real range out of
this car (40 miles in theory without problem). That plus the MagneCharger
plus one at my parent's house could get me a 100 mile trip range including
runs to IKEA and Baltimore city.
And the 20 amps at 350 volt charge rate should keep the battery pack happy.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 2:34 PM
Subject: Re: Battery pack replacement and telemetry question
> >> I would like to build a monitoring circuit so I can watch the
> >> new batteries in action. Question: Does anyone make a small,
> >> simple circult to read a battery's voltage and output it in
> >> digital form?
>
> Christopher Meier wrote:
> > Yes; order up a couple of the relay boards and the control board
> > from Lee's battery balancer and use it to monitor your pack.
>
> Yes, indeed! I am collecting orders to see if we can afford to make
> another run. Since you only want to monitor and not charge each battery,
> you don't need the relay boards with their 30-amp relays. Use some much
> smaller long-life signal relay, like a reed relay.
>
> Also, make sure you do a little R&R on your batteries, once you can get
> at them and test them individuall. It is amazing how well then can
> sometimes return from the dead.
> --
> Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
> 814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
> Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
> leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Magnechargers and charging
>
>
> Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of waiting
> for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I* can do
> about all this.
>
> And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the cars?
> Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
>
> I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD. Along
> with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And doing the
> same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> friend's house
> in Clarksville MD.
>
> Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow?
> If we can't
> count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing it ourselves...
>
> Chris
>
Chris,
That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are gone,
we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
Ed Ang
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Not to mention a motor that looks like they got it off e-bay and a inverter
that claims to be water cooled but from the pictures obviously isn't? (Not
to mention, what truly lame engineer has to water cool a 12kW inverter?)
The cars are pretty, though.
S.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've got a string of 12 Optima YTs and have observed the #1 and #12 battery to be at
about 0.1 volt lower than the others. I've got modular chargers (Soneil 1212) so each
battery gets what it needs each night.
To correct the situation, I've been doing a finishing charge with a 15V charger that
puts out a max of 2 Amps, but quickly goes to less than one amp. I leave this on for
about 1 hr to try to bring these two batterries back up to "par" with the others.
Is there any reason why the batts on the ends of the string would do this?
Thanks
Chuck
93 Delectric Sol
________________________________________________________________
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
Only $9.95 per month!
Visit www.juno.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mmm.... True. That's what the 110 and the dryer outlet is for.
Are there any other cars besides the US Electricar Prizms, the S10's, and
the EV1's that used MagneCharge? Is it possible to put MC adapters into
other cars?
Or is this technology "lost"
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 1:25 PM
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Magnechargers and charging
> >
> >
> > Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of
waiting
> > for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I* can do
> > about all this.
> >
> > And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> > impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the
cars?
> > Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
> >
> > I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD.
Along
> > with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And doing
the
> > same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> > friend's house
> > in Clarksville MD.
> >
> > Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow?
> > If we can't
> > count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing it
ourselves...
> >
> > Chris
> >
>
> Chris,
>
> That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are
gone,
> we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
>
> Ed Ang
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Does the battery balancer provide real-time data on all the batteries?
As in could it be used to provide a controller cutback signal to keep a
battery from being puled too low? Or big 'get your foot outta the pedal'
warning light? I thought it selected one at a time (via the relays) and
every 10 minutes or so went through and checked again. Or... since it
will have picked out the weakest battery over time, it would already be
monitoring the "weakest link"?
> Christopher Zach wrote:
> >> I would like to build a monitoring circuit so I can watch the
> >> new batteries in action. Question: Does anyone make a small,
> >> simple circult to read a battery's voltage and output it in
> >> digital form?
>
> Christopher Meier wrote:
> > Yes; order up a couple of the relay boards and the control board
> > from Lee's battery balancer and use it to monitor your pack.
_________
Jim Coate
1992 Chevy S-10
1970s Elec-Trak E20
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 08:35 AM 3/18/03 -0500, you wrote:
I bought an emi meter "TriField" and found that in my EV that I am 500 times
the maximum allowable emi range. I've been driving EV's for 30 years and it
hasn't effected me a bit, although my wife might disagree.
What is your EV? AC or DC? Volts?
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ed,
Chris lives on the east coast, in Maryland. No public charging here at all.
Besides Chris's USE Prism, Charlie Garlow's S-10E is the only other
inductive charging vehicle I'm aware of in this area and it's also LPI.
Maybe a few of the surplus LPI's out there could find their way here. We
were never allowed a RAV4 EV, so no SPIs to contend with either.
With a couple of surplus chargers, Chris and Charlie could make them
"portable" to carry with them to plug into a 14-50 receptacle.
Dave Davidson
Laurel, Maryland
1993 Dodge TEVan
From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:25:54 -0800
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Magnechargers and charging
>
>
> Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of
waiting
> for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I* can do
> about all this.
>
> And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the
cars?
> Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
>
> I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD.
Along
> with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And doing
the
> same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> friend's house
> in Clarksville MD.
>
> Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow?
> If we can't
> count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing it
ourselves...
>
> Chris
>
Chris,
That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are
gone,
we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
Ed Ang
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You can find impressive magnetic fields near devices containing motors
or transformers. Try your emi meter around your microwave, fluorescent
lamp ballasts and electric motors.
How would one know if one were affected by driving electric cars for
30 years? I'm inclined to think not because people in occupations
with high exposures to electric and magnetic fields don't seem to be
adversely affected. But with examples like Wilde, Wayland and
Crabtree maybe I should reconsider that opinion <: )
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 5:35 AM
Subject: Re: emi affetcs brains
> I bought an emi meter "TriField" and found that in my EV that I am 500
times
> the maximum allowable emi range. I've been driving EV's for 30 years and
it
> hasn't effected me a bit, although my wife might disagree.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jim Coate wrote:
> Does the battery balancer provide real-time data on all the batteries?
> As in could it be used to provide a controller cutback signal to keep
> a battery from being puled too low? Or big 'get your foot outta the
> pedal' warning light? I thought it selected one at a time (via the
> relays) and every 10 minutes or so went through and checked again.
> Or... since it will have picked out the weakest battery over time,
> it would already be monitoring the "weakest link"?
You have it right. Since it uses relays to scan the batteries, I wanted
to minimize the number of times they cycle. So, once it finds the lowest
battery, it leaves it selected (and is charging it with the DC/DC
converter). If its voltage falls too low, you have an immediate warning.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jim Coate wrote:
> Does the battery balancer provide real-time data on all the
> batteries? As in could it be used to provide a controller
> cutback signal to keep a battery from being puled too low? Or
> big 'get your foot outta the pedal' warning light? I thought
> it selected one at a time (via the relays) and every 10
> minutes or so went through and checked again. Or... since it
> will have picked out the weakest battery over time, it would
> already be monitoring the "weakest link"?
Hi Jim,
Lee went to great lengths to make sure *only one* battery could be
read/charged at a time. You can program the balancer to step through
for readings as fast as you want, but it's one at a time. You can also
program it to find and watch the worst battery. But while it's doing
that, it's not balancing your pack. Of course if you have a balancer,
you're much less likely to have one battery much weaker than the rest.
Probably the next best thing to an individual battery monitor is Lee's
BattBridge. It lights if the two halves of your pack are out of balance
by two(?) volts. That and a low pack voltage reading would be an
indication to lift off the pedal.
On a whole-pack level, I'd use the Emeter's low battery alarm for your
warning light. Even better are Otmar's new Z1K and Z2K controllers.
They let you program your low battery voltage indication to light the
"battery" light on your dash. A separate programmed parameter is the
low battery limit, at which point the controller limits current to stay
above the limit. Pretty sweet!
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Segway should only be ridden with a CO2 fire extinguisher in one hand, a
sink plunger in the other, and a pair of orange flashing lights on your head.
Paul Compton
BVS technical officer www.bvs.org.uk
www.sciroccoev.co.uk
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No Rav 4 EV's "Yet". I have a co-worker who also works for the NY Power
Authority. He has stated that they (his site) have 4 RAV 4's. Sometime in
the future NYPA will be getting rid of these vehicles at auction. They will
eventually end up in "our" hands.
Unfortunately, he also stated that of the 4, none of their chargers were the
same and they are not interchangeable. (test bed maybe?)
I know that in the past, factory EV's have made it into the hands of private
citizens by way of the NY energy companies' auctions. I just hope I can be
prepared next time one happens.
Stay Charged!
Hump
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Davidson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 3:44 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
Ed,
Chris lives on the east coast, in Maryland. No public charging here at all.
Besides Chris's USE Prism, Charlie Garlow's S-10E is the only other
inductive charging vehicle I'm aware of in this area and it's also LPI.
Maybe a few of the surplus LPI's out there could find their way here. We
were never allowed a RAV4 EV, so no SPIs to contend with either.
With a couple of surplus chargers, Chris and Charlie could make them
"portable" to carry with them to plug into a 14-50 receptacle.
Dave Davidson
Laurel, Maryland
1993 Dodge TEVan
>From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
>Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:25:54 -0800
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Magnechargers and charging
> >
> >
> > Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of
>waiting
> > for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I*
> > can do about all this.
> >
> > And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> > impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the
>cars?
> > Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
> >
> > I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD.
>Along
> > with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And
> > doing
>the
> > same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> > friend's house in Clarksville MD.
> >
> > Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow? If
> > we can't count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing
> > it
>ourselves...
> >
> > Chris
> >
>
>Chris,
>
>That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are
>gone,
>we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
>
>Ed Ang
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"The cars need to be approved by FMVSS. It is not
available now. The price for AC motor and Inverter
is USD2,000.00." quoted from the Canadian Rep.
Regards
Harsha Godavari
Jon \"Sheer\" Pullen wrote:
>
> Not to mention a motor that looks like they got it off e-bay and a inverter
> that claims to be water cooled but from the pictures obviously isn't? (Not
> to mention, what truly lame engineer has to water cool a 12kW inverter?)
>
> The cars are pretty, though.
>
> S.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"Crabb, David" wrote:
>
> Ahh.. but it is ever so roomy in the cabin for the front occupants.
...
>
> perhaps if , inline, you had motor.. and a planetary reduction gear then
> into the rear ..differential
>
> all very compact.
A motor integrated into transaxle (differential) has been
developed and produced for quite a while.
Consider this (stitch the link together)
http://www.siemens.com/Daten/siecom/HQ/TS/Internet/Transportation_Systems/WORKAREA/reinhold/templatedata/English/file/binary/20779re_17_345_20779.pdf
Victor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> One individual talked about a new ICE which costing $20,000 loses 20 percent
> of its value the day you become the owner. He assumed 4 years 50,000 miles
> without any repairs; however, mufflers, tuneups, oil changes and other ICE
> related activities are not part of the warranty. Neither is the higher
> excise tax, sales tax, or insurance cost for a new ICE.
Just playing devils advocate here but...
I paid $14,000 for a new Nissan extended cab pickup. I paid the extra
$800 for the extended warranty. This warranty covers the truck bumper
to bumper for 60,000 miles. Dodge comes standard with 70,000 mile
bumper to bumper warranty as I recall.
My truck comes with free oil changes for life.
I'll have tocheck but I believe the first scheduled tuneup is at 100,000
miles (pretty common these days.)
EVs are more expensive to insure than ICEs, at least around here they
are. I can get liability insurance on three ICE vehicles here for what
I pay for my EV.
Sales tax is sales tax. I have to pay it on used vehicles and on EV
parts if I buy them locally.
>
> Although we state that you cannot economically justify an EV, you can break
> even or in some cases make money. We have helped a number of people convert
> their S-10 or other vehicle (used). The initial cost of these used vehicles
> were $1000 - $4000. Our conversion package for trucks with everything is
> less than $10,000. Most only spend about $6000 - $8000. After driving
> their EVs for 2 years, these customers have sold their EV for $10,000 -
> $12,000. So they essentially broke even and had lots of fun!
>
So $11,000 to $14,000 for a used EV or $14,000 for a brand new ICE.
I'll take your word for it that they sold them for $10,000, but I've
never seen one move at that price. They must have got lucky.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Tue, 2003-03-18 at 12:32, Jon "Sheer" Pullen wrote:
> Not to mention a motor that looks like they got it off e-bay and a inverter
> that claims to be water cooled but from the pictures obviously isn't? (Not
> to mention, what truly lame engineer has to water cool a 12kW inverter?)
>
That's easy to figure out, 35kw maximum input power to the inverter and
20 kw maximum input power to the motor means they are burning up 12kw in
the invert right? ;-)
What I want to know is where the extra 5 kw comes from since they list
250V as max input voltage and 120A as max battery current.
But the fun part is figuring out how slow these things accelerate. My
pickup would seem peppy next to one of these. But the do look nice.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
$2,000? Hmmm, a couple of those would make a nice low end drive for a
conversion.
On Tue, 2003-03-18 at 14:07, harsha godavari wrote:
> "The cars need to be approved by FMVSS. It is not
> available now. The price for AC motor and Inverter
> is USD2,000.00." quoted from the Canadian Rep.
>
> Regards
> Harsha Godavari
>
> Jon \"Sheer\" Pullen wrote:
> >
> > Not to mention a motor that looks like they got it off e-bay and a inverter
> > that claims to be water cooled but from the pictures obviously isn't? (Not
> > to mention, what truly lame engineer has to water cool a 12kW inverter?)
> >
> > The cars are pretty, though.
> >
> > S.
>
--
EVDL
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Careful Hump,
Virtually all fleets with Rav4 EVs are only lease only. The only Rav4 EVs
that have been available for purchase so far were released in 2002.
Everything before that was only lease.
-Ed Thorpe
Calfornia
-----Original Message-----
From: Humphrey Timothy H Contr AFRL/IFEC
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 1:08 PM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
No Rav 4 EV's "Yet". I have a co-worker who also works for the NY Power
Authority. He has stated that they (his site) have 4 RAV 4's. Sometime in
the future NYPA will be getting rid of these vehicles at auction. They will
eventually end up in "our" hands.
Unfortunately, he also stated that of the 4, none of their chargers were the
same and they are not interchangeable. (test bed maybe?)
I know that in the past, factory EV's have made it into the hands of private
citizens by way of the NY energy companies' auctions. I just hope I can be
prepared next time one happens.
Stay Charged!
Hump
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Davidson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 3:44 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
Ed,
Chris lives on the east coast, in Maryland. No public charging here at all.
Besides Chris's USE Prism, Charlie Garlow's S-10E is the only other
inductive charging vehicle I'm aware of in this area and it's also LPI.
Maybe a few of the surplus LPI's out there could find their way here. We
were never allowed a RAV4 EV, so no SPIs to contend with either.
With a couple of surplus chargers, Chris and Charlie could make them
"portable" to carry with them to plug into a 14-50 receptacle.
Dave Davidson
Laurel, Maryland
1993 Dodge TEVan
>From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
>Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:25:54 -0800
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Magnechargers and charging
> >
> >
> > Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of
>waiting
> > for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I*
> > can do about all this.
> >
> > And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> > impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the
>cars?
> > Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
> >
> > I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD.
>Along
> > with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And
> > doing
>the
> > same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> > friend's house in Clarksville MD.
> >
> > Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow? If
> > we can't count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing
> > it
>ourselves...
> >
> > Chris
> >
>
>Chris,
>
>That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are
>gone,
>we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
>
>Ed Ang
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Can you have him verify that? My understanding is that these were only
leased by Toyota and, once the lease is over, they have to go back to
Toyota.
Some of the early RAV4s used a Japanese conductive charger. I read that at
least one of the places in California with them made an avcon converter and
they work fine. I would rather have one of those than the SPI, but wouldn't
be picky.
I'm hoping that since Toyota did sell some of the later versions, they might
decide to sell the ones coming off lease. Not holding my breath, though.
Have given up and am planning a conversion.
Dave
From: Humphrey Timothy H Contr AFRL/IFEC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 21:07:49 -0000
No Rav 4 EV's "Yet". I have a co-worker who also works for the NY Power
Authority. He has stated that they (his site) have 4 RAV 4's. Sometime in
the future NYPA will be getting rid of these vehicles at auction. They will
eventually end up in "our" hands.
Unfortunately, he also stated that of the 4, none of their chargers were
the
same and they are not interchangeable. (test bed maybe?)
I know that in the past, factory EV's have made it into the hands of
private
citizens by way of the NY energy companies' auctions. I just hope I can be
prepared next time one happens.
Stay Charged!
Hump
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Davidson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 3:44 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
Ed,
Chris lives on the east coast, in Maryland. No public charging here at
all.
Besides Chris's USE Prism, Charlie Garlow's S-10E is the only other
inductive charging vehicle I'm aware of in this area and it's also LPI.
Maybe a few of the surplus LPI's out there could find their way here. We
were never allowed a RAV4 EV, so no SPIs to contend with either.
With a couple of surplus chargers, Chris and Charlie could make them
"portable" to carry with them to plug into a 14-50 receptacle.
Dave Davidson
Laurel, Maryland
1993 Dodge TEVan
>From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: RE: Magnechargers and charging
>Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:25:54 -0800
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Christopher Zach
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:19 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Magnechargers and charging
> >
> >
> > Well, after looking at the political climate, the hopelessness of
>waiting
> > for "someone" to do "something", I'm beginning to wonder what *I*
> > can do about all this.
> >
> > And I had a thought: Right now, about 2,000 EV-1's in CA are being
> > impounded. What is happening to the MagneChargers that went with the
>cars?
> > Are they being returned? Scrapped? Forgotten?
> >
> > I'm planning on installing my MC in the next few weeks in Relay MD.
>Along
> > with a 40amp dryer plug and a 110 volt plug on the driveway. And
> > doing
>the
> > same thing at the parent's house in Towson MD. And possibly a
> > friend's house in Clarksville MD.
> >
> > Any preceident for creating a private charging network somehow? If
> > we can't count on the Govt to do diddly, perhaps we can start doing
> > it
>ourselves...
> >
> > Chris
> >
>
>Chris,
>
>That is a good idea, except that most MCs are LPI. When all EV1's are
>gone,
>we will have hundreds of LPI that no EV could use!
>
>Ed Ang
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
_________________________________________________________________
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