EV Digest 3933
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) makeing 240
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Modular Charger
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Impressive NiMH conversion on the Web
by Carlton Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Passing on the EV grin
by Seth Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Passing on the EV grin
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Passing on the EV grin
by Seth Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Motor Amps, Battery Amps ?
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: High current draw from floodies, was RE: Motor Amps, Battery
Amps ?
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Death of EV author
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: High current draw from floodies, was RE: Motor Amps, BatteryAmps ?
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) EVLN(World's First Electric Powered Roller Skates)
by Danny Ames <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: EVLN(World's First Electric Powered Roller Skates)
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Th!nk City & NiCds
by Nick Carter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: eMeter temp sensor
by Michael Hoskinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Making 240VAC out of 2 x 120VAC
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Making 240VAC out of 2 x 120VAC
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Making 240VAC out of 2 x 120VAC
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Breakthrough in producing pure hydrogen
by Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Breakthrough in producing pure hydrogen
by Sam Thurber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Modular Charger
by Martin K <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Breakthrough in producing pure hydrogen
by Lee Dekker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Slash: New way to get hydrogen (vs using the energy in an EV)
by Alan Batie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: eMeter temp sensor
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Breakthrough in producing pure hydrogen
by Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Breakthrough in producing pure hydrogen
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
26) Fwd: Re: Electric vehicles in Japan
by Sherry Boschert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Electric vehicles in Japan
by "Markus L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I use a 240/120 equipment transformer, originally for dropping line down
on AC units, backwards as a step up transformer to run 240 monitors and
such on my workbench, AC is easy.
I know current is halved, and you still can't parallel the inverters
inless they run off of line reference but...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
More properley
About a Dozzen To-220 Mosfets, or a one darn big module. Or 4 TO264s
A 600 volt Igbt, single device is able to boost 240 to 400. With ease... and
over %90 eff. No need for the 900 V IGs.
PFC 30s can do this.... They are $2K. When you boost only(240 to 400) the
stress is a Lot less on the single device
> $2000? You must be speaking of a PFC-50 or some such?
> 400 amps at 20 volts could be done, it's practicality and efficiency is
> a different matter. To beat a dead horse once again: 400 amps takes a
> big wire.
>
> >By going to a lower bus voltage, the input converter becomes much larger,
> >the wiring much becomes larger (harder to manage) and has little effect
on
> >the size (and cost) of the isolated converter on each battery. That is a
> >huge penalty to pay for a personal scare factor.
> >
> >
> >
> To split hairs, running a converter from 20v is much easier than 400v
> because you don't need a boot-strapping supply, but that's irrelevant.
> The real cost difference is between a 48v MOSFET or a 900v IGBT, but
> again it's not enough to justify cables measured in multiple 0-gauge.
>
> --
> Martin K
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For those of you interested in my electric Birkin S3 project featured
at http://www.electric7.com, here are a few answers to the questions I
have seen...
The chassis was selected for its minimalist design, light weight, and
narrow passenger compartment. The nature of the car leaves no need for
weight-adding and power-using extras like power steering, power brakes,
air conditioning, or even a radio. The narrow passenger compartment is
important for a second second phase of the project, should it
materialize...I agree that the Cd is pretty high with the Lotus 7-style
shape. Despite its small size, it will have more usable energy on
board than my lead-acid powered Solectria Force, while weighing almost
1,000 pounds less.
The charger is a Brusa NLG513. It does have dV/dt detection, and it
uses Brusa's ChargeStar software for charge profile configuration. If
the photos on the web site do not load, I recommend trying again later.
The server is pretty old and slow.
There were enough Prius batteries in salvage yards in January of 2002.
They were popular for use in FutureTruck vehicles, also.
The LRR tires? Try calling a Saturn dealer in California. They might
be able to sell you a replacement set designed for an EV1. You will
want 14 x 5.5 or 14 x 6 inch wheels.
Thanks for the interest! We hope to get this car on the road in the
next couple of months.
Regards,
Carl
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, I sold the EV Rabbit to someone in Maine who was very excited to
give it a new home and he had a better use for it than I did (14 miles
round trip on secondary roads). He needs to fix a few things, but he
should have it on the road soon. Looks like I will stick to EV boats
and such for the moment. There is a big BLDC motor waiting for a car
but I have no garage space or car worthy of the effort yet.
Seth
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Seth,
You have my interest now, what kind of big BLDC motor
do you have? My 'medium size' BLDC motors and
controls are finally starting to move forward. Most
are going on full size bus heating/cooling
applicattions, spares are going on go-carts.
When production ramps up other spares will go on
scooters!
Rod
--- Seth Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well, I sold the EV Rabbit to someone in Maine who
> was very excited to
> give it a new home and he had a better use for it
> than I did (14 miles
> round trip on secondary roads). He needs to fix a
> few things, but he
> should have it on the road soon. Looks like I will
> stick to EV boats
> and such for the moment. There is a big BLDC motor
> waiting for a car
> but I have no garage space or car worthy of the
> effort yet.
>
> Seth
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Not that big I guess, but 70+ lbs and an outrunner radial flux machine.
Low speed high voltage, high Kt, like 1 Nm/A or thereabouts. Never run
it though. Figuing then that Kv is roughly a volt per rad/sec or volt
per 10(ish) RPM, then a 200-300V battery is the minimum ante. And I
have no idea what the explosion speed of the rotor is, but I bet it is
slow, like 200-300 rad/sec.
Seth
On Nov 27, 2004, at 9:41 PM, Rod Hower wrote:
Seth,
You have my interest now, what kind of big BLDC motor
do you have? My 'medium size' BLDC motors and
controls are finally starting to move forward. Most
are going on full size bus heating/cooling
applicattions, spares are going on go-carts.
When production ramps up other spares will go on
scooters!
Rod
--- Seth Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Well, I sold the EV Rabbit to someone in Maine who
was very excited to
give it a new home and he had a better use for it
than I did (14 miles
round trip on secondary roads). He needs to fix a
few things, but he
should have it on the road soon. Looks like I will
stick to EV boats
and such for the moment. There is a big BLDC motor
waiting for a car
but I have no garage space or car worthy of the
effort yet.
Seth
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
> better is to start in first or second, at which point the motor quickly
> spins up and generates back EMF, but you don't want EMF to go so high
> that it keeps you from drawing the full 600A. Kind of a delicate
> balance.
I always start out in first. The only time I could start in second is on
a flat surface, but it is slower to get up to speed and takes full
power. I'll have to get an ammeter for the motor side, that'd probably
help me know when to shift to get max current through the controller.
> Anyway, I believe the solution to your problem is to buy a Zilla, or
> deal with slow acceleration. Sorry :/
I'd love it if I could get a Zilla right now. But until then, I am
working on the smaller, more affordable things which might help my
energy consumption go down.
> Okay, so I'm a bit late in responding, but I don't think anyone else
> gave you a clear answer
Thank you. I do understand it better now :-)
-Nick
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
--------------------------------------------------
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 22:08, Ben Apollonio wrote:
> Okay, so I'm a bit late in responding, but I don't think anyone else
> gave you a clear answer. It's due to the fact that your Raptor limits
> output *current,* not *power.*
>
> If you start out in 4th gear, you are no doubt going to be sourcing the
> full 600A motor side, which means the Raptor is going into current
> limit. However, since the motor's not spinning at full speed yet,
> there's no back EMF and the output voltage is very low. Say, for
> example, the output voltage is 10V -- this is 10V * 600A = 6kW output
> from the controller. Now since power out = power in, if you have a
> 120V pack, that means you're only drawing 6000/120 = 50A battery-side.
> Thus your Raptor's doing its job at 600A, but if you're not delivering
> maximum power to the motor. 6kW will get you nowhere fast. Much
> better is to start in first or second, at which point the motor quickly
> spins up and generates back EMF, but you don't want EMF to go so high
> that it keeps you from drawing the full 600A. Kind of a delicate
> balance.
>
> Anyway, I believe the solution to your problem is to buy a Zilla, or
> deal with slow acceleration. Sorry :/
>
> -Ben
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > Here's something which I've wondered about for a while:
> >
> > I have a Raptor 600 controller, on which I have the potentiometer for
> > current limit turned all the way up (max current). I have a 0-400 amp
> > ammeter on the battery side of the controller, with the shunt inserted
> > between the controller/motor (-) buss bar and the (-) contactor.
> >
> > Watching the ammeter while driving around, I notice that the higher the
> > gear I'm in, the less battery amps I can pull. For example, I can get
> > the ammeter to read 400 amps (peg) if I floor it in 1st gear. However,
> > if I shift to 2nd gear, I can't seem to pull more than about 350 amps
> > with the accelerator floored. 3rd gear starts to get bad, as I can't
> > get
> > more than about 280 amps, and 4th gear is practically unusable as I
> > can't seem to pull more than about 210 amps, no matter what. And I do
> > have to start out in 1st gear because I can't get going in any
> > reasonable amount of time from 2nd (3rd is impossible).
> >
> > I realize that there is a difference in battery and motor amps, but I
> > don't fully understand why. Is it because of a difference in input vs.
> > output voltage of the controller, or what?
> >
> > My biggest problem is that my acceleration in the higher gears is
> > horrible because I can't seem to pull enough current from the
> > batteries.
> > I realize that this is probably because the Raptor is hitting it's max
> > output of 600 motor amps and is going into current limit as the LEDs
> > indicate (In fact, according to the LEDs, my controller is always in
> > current limit when I floor it, no matter what gear). What I don't
> > understand is this: why does it hit current limit so much sooner in the
> > higher gears (and less battery amps get drawn)? I'm guessing it is
> > related to torque and the transmission?
> >
> > Thanks for any insight on this.
> > -Nick
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
> The system you've got there is more suitable for a small pickup or
> even something like a Civic - so don't be too surprised by the poor
> performance.
Yes, I now understand that the system is a bit undersized. Of course,
the EV parts distributor who sold me the system (think east coast) gave
me really LOUSY advice when I knew basically nothing about EVs. I've
learned my lesson. I'm just lucky that I found AustinEV several months
into the project, as they've been an invaluable resource to say the
least :-)
> "1.86V per cell off-load (you said you were stopped and measuring
> with a meter?) means you've probably reversed a few cells." ---
> you're letting the voltage sag as low as 115V, well, that's what's
> done the damage.
But you've never really explained how to determine if a battery has
reversed cells. I've been under the impression that reversed cells would
significantly reduce range and performance. I haven't noticed this. The
range and performance have been pretty much the same since day one. And
yes, I now have a dash mounted digital volt meter, and I have seen the
voltage sag pretty low for very short amounts of time during hard
acceleration. 115 volts happened once, but that's it. I've not done this
intentionally. These batteries have a lot of voltage sag under large
current draws.
> Measure each battery voltage just after you've been for a drive,
> you'll find the dead ones.
Here's the voltages after a recent short trip:
8.52v - Battery #3
8.51v - Battery #5
8.50v - Battery #15
8.49v - Battery #6,8,9,10,12,13,14,16,17
8.48v - Battery #2,4,7,11,18,20
8.47v - Battery #1
8.46v - Battery #19
I also took the voltages while the Jeep was charging (near the end of
the charge) today, they were:
9.58v - Battery #19
9.59v - Battery #1
9.63v - Battery #2,6,7,8
9.64v - Battery #4
9.65v - Battery #17
9.67v - Battery #9,16
9.71v - Battery #11
9.73v - Battery #3
9.75v - Battery #14
9.76v - Battery #10,13,18
9.77v - Battery #5
9.82v - Battery #12,20
9.84v - Battery #15
So it appears that #19 and #1 are the weakest batteries. Based on the
voltages, should I do an equalization charge on the pack? Is it possible
that #19 or #1 are damaged and should be replaced? Or is the voltage
difference among the pack nothing to worry about?
Thanks
-Nick
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
---------------------------------------------
On Tue, 2004-11-23 at 05:56, Evan Tuer wrote:
> Hi Nick,
>
> > Yes, I've got 20 T-875s. The current draws of up to ~395 amps happen
> > most anytime I take off from 1st gear (and I'm usually close to flooring
> > it). Especially on inclines, I *have* to pull that much power in 1st
> > gear to accelerate up them. I also pull a lot of current in 2nd gear as
> > I'm getting up to speed. Third gear, no, I never pull more than ~280
> > amps because I *can't* seem to pull any more current. This is why my
> > acceleration at speeds greater than 55mph is incredibly lousy (at times
> > almost nonexistent).
>
> A jeep is a very heavy and non-aerodynamic vehicle. The system you've
> got there is more suitable for a small pickup or even something like a
> Civic - so don't be too surprised by the poor performance.
>
> Not being able to pull more current from the batteries in the higher
> gears is because your motor controller is in current limit all the
> time, again due to the heavy and brick-like nature of the vehicle.
>
> > > and if you're keeping the pack voltage well above 1.75 volts per cell?
> > > For better cycle life, I'm trying to keep my current at or below 200 amps
> > > with my T-145 floodies, which is hard with a lead sled
> >
> > Well, 1.75v per cell would be 140 volts in my case. So no, I'm not
> > keeping it above this because during acceleration the pack voltage sags
> > so much, even when the pack is full (~172 volts) it can sag as low as
> > 155 volts under hard acceleration (such as from a stop in 1st). When the
> > pack is low, I've seen it briefly sag as low as 115 volts under heavy
> > draws. This worries me, but I haven't been able to find anyway to better
> > this, and I still haven't been able to figure out if I may have a weak
> > battery or two in the pack. BTW, the pack has never dropped/been below
> > 140 volts when not pulling power from it (i.e. foot off the accelerator
> > or Jeep parked).
>
> As I said when you first mentioned this: "1.86V per cell off-load
> (you said you were stopped and measuring with a meter?) means you've
> probably reversed a few cells."
>
> I guess you've got your dash mounted volt meter hooked up now, and if
> you're letting the voltage sag as low as 115V, well, that's what's
> done the damage.
>
> Measure each battery voltage just after you've been for a drive,
> you'll find the dead ones.
>
> >
> > As a side note, I am switching the 80W90 gear oil in my differentials to
> > Redline 75W90 synthetic gear oil. Low-resistance tires are still on my
> > list, and a Zilla if I could afford one. Other than that I'm at a loss
> > for how I can make the Jeep work well at highway speeds.
>
> Replace the flooded batteries with Exide Orbitals. It'll then
> probably go about 5 miles at highway speeds.
>
> Sorry, this is probably not what you wanted to hear, but this is a
> good illustration of why big cars have poor gas milage, and that's why
> most people choose a smaller car for conversion, or accept that
> they'll have very poor range or very poor performance or possibly
> both!
>
> Regards
> Evan
>
> > > >
> > > <snip>
> > > >Watching the ammeter while driving around, I notice that the higher the
> > > >gear I'm in, the less battery amps I can pull. For example, I can get
> > > >the ammeter to read 400 amps (peg) if I floor it in 1st gear. However,
> > > >if I shift to 2nd gear, I can't seem to pull more than about 350 amps
> > > >with the accelerator floored. 3rd gear starts to get bad, as I can't get
> > > >more than about 280 amps, and 4th gear is practically unusable as I
> > > >can't seem to pull more than about 210 amps, no matter what. And I do
> > > >have to start out in 1st gear because I can't get going in any
> > > >reasonable amount of time from 2nd (3rd is impossible).
> > > <snip>
> > > >Thanks for any insight on this.
> > > >-Nick
> > > >1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
> > > >http://Go.DriveEV.com/
> > > >
> >
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
>He wrote (among other books) "Solo: Life With an Electric Car" in 1992 about a
>cross
>country trip that apparently involved little driving and abundant towing.
John Westlund wrote:
> Having read Solo, I must comment...He and the car were inseperable during the
> novel.
> Although it is disappointing that he didn't make the trip
> completely by EV, it was an enjoyable read.
I loved this book! At first as I began to read it, I was frustrated at the
author's lack
of EV knowledge and how he was merely an environmentalist
wishing do drive what his heart knew was correct. The fact that he chose such a
poor
example of an EV conversion to attempt such a journey in, only
compounded my frustration. But his wonderful writing style and the way the
story unfolded
quickly won me over, at times, with me howling in laughter
over the EV failure modes I could relate to.
> Along the way through his trip from Cali, he encountered a few EV
> enthusiasts, a very
> close-minded prick in Utah who made the comment that he'd like to see an
> electric car
> towing a gas car some day (I think Wayland can comment on that one, towing an
> electric
> car with an electric truck and all. lol)
Yes, I can and will comment. I have indeed, towed out-of-gas gas powered rigs
with my EVs,
and have saved stranded gasser motorists, gas cans in hand, by giving them a
lift in my EV
to the gas station. One of the most memorable though, was when I used Red
Beastie to pull
a full sized, 454 cid powered Chevy Suburban tethered to a 16 ft. trailer
loaded with my
EV drag car and the Heavy Metal Garden Tractor, that ran out of gas on the way
to the
Woodburn drag races. The combined weight of the 5500 lb. Suburban, the 1200 lb.
trailer,
the then 2000 lb. race car, and the 500 lb. tractor, was 9200 lbs.! Add the
bulk of the
Beastie at 5300 lbs. and the extra 700 lbs. weight of three big guys, and this
represented
15,200 lbs.....seven and a half tons of weight, that the single ADC 9 inch
electric motor
had to pull! It did so easily, I might add, towing the gassless rig and its
payload about
1/2 mile after having already traveled about 44 miles on the freeway from my
home to
Woodburn!
> It's sad to see him pass on. I guess if there is a heaven(or
> hell or whatever), he's with Dick Finley discussing EV
> technology and its implications.
>
Thanks for remembering my good friend, Dick 'Hotrod' Finley. For those who may
not know,
Dick was the 77 year old youngster that I teamed up with to design and build
Red Beastie,
the lead acid powered Toyota pickup that had a real 120 mile range per charge
and ran off
40, Trojan 6V wet cells batteries.
I had the pleasure of speaking with Noel Perrin when I called him after reading
his book.
He and I had a wonderfully long conversation, where we shared EV experiences.
He was very
intrigued with what we were doing on the West Coast in terms of EV drag racing.
I loaned my only copy of 'Solo, Life with an Electric Car' to someone along the
way,
unfortunately can't remember who it was, and I never got it back. I
enthusiastically
recommend it as a very entertaining book that will have you at once rooting for
him, the
car, and the EV the cause, while at the same time, you'll be shaking your head
in
disbelief over how uninformed about EVs and their capabilities, this wonderful
man was.
See Ya.......John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Nick;
Do you have an electric heater in your car? If you do, use it to load the
batteries at the end of the drive to measure the batteries under load.
If you can run the heater for a couple hours at the end of a drive and
measure the battery voltages every 10 minutes, it should show up the
stinkers if there are any.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nick Viera" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: High current draw from floodies, was RE: Motor Amps,
BatteryAmps ?
> Here's the voltages after a recent short trip:
> 8.52v - Battery #3
> 8.51v - Battery #5
> 8.50v - Battery #15
> 8.49v - Battery #6,8,9,10,12,13,14,16,17
> 8.48v - Battery #2,4,7,11,18,20
> 8.47v - Battery #1
> 8.46v - Battery #19
>
> I also took the voltages while the Jeep was charging (near the end of
> the charge) today, they were:
> 9.58v - Battery #19
> 9.59v - Battery #1
> 9.63v - Battery #2,6,7,8
> 9.64v - Battery #4
> 9.65v - Battery #17
> 9.67v - Battery #9,16
> 9.71v - Battery #11
> 9.73v - Battery #3
> 9.75v - Battery #14
> 9.76v - Battery #10,13,18
> 9.77v - Battery #5
> 9.82v - Battery #12,20
> 9.84v - Battery #15
>
> So it appears that #19 and #1 are the weakest batteries. Based on the
> voltages, should I do an equalization charge on the pack? Is it possible
> that #19 or #1 are damaged and should be replaced? Or is the voltage
> difference among the pack nothing to worry about?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(World's First Electric Powered Roller Skates)
Publish Date : 11/28/2004 3:16:00 PM Source : Sports News
Onlypunjab.com
Aircoast, an innovative company that has pioneered the roller skates
sneaker, will once again be in the forefront of introducing the first
commercial electrical powered assisted roller skates.
Light weighted, and shod with a rechargeable battery, the roller skates
sneaker also comes with completely detachable wheels. The motor
assembly, weighing about 600 grams together with its rechargeable
battery is easily attached to the shoe and also removable when not
required.
When not required for skating, the shoe can be worn like ordinary
sneakers.
This set up will enable the wearer to change into various modes with
ease and will go a long way to make everyone totally mobile. It will
free you from the clutches of ever increasing gasoline prices,
especially for short errands around the neighborhood, or in highly
traffic congested urbane areas. Wearing the powered aircoaster is like
having a small automobile under your feet!
Aircoast has spent two years developing its new product, and is now able
to offer it as one of the most unique, and wearable powered skates in
the market. Its unique concept is towards portability, whereby the motor
assembly is easily stowed away in the wearer's pocket when not in use.
The sneaker is like the ordinary shoe that everyone wears as a casual
outfit, at work or just strolling along parkways. This powered roller
skates will come in most useful when no other transport is available,
and also when there is a big traffic jam. The powered sneaker will also
give added boost when skating up slopes, and will give new added meaning
to leisure coasting along the parkways and beach fronts. Effortless
skating will be the order of the day.
Continuing developments will be carried out to extend the range of the
roller skates as its single charge battery will only operate for twenty
minutes at a leisurely 5 mph. Additional battery packs can however be
worn on other parts of the body and connected likewise for an extended
fun time with the skates.
Additional information about Aircoast is available on the Web at
http://www.aircoast.com/
SOURCE Notes:
http://www.onlypunjab.com/fullstory1104-insight-World+First+Electric+Powered+Roller+Skates-status-26-newsID-7384.html
EVDL subscriber Danny Ames...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"Wearing the powered aircoaster is like having a small automobile under
your feet!"
Yeah, a small automobile that will only operate for a maximum of twenty
minutes at a maximum of 5 mph on level ground with kick assist and no
throttle control. 8^)
I've been working on some designs in this area for the past three years
as well. I don't think a friction feed is any kind of solution, although
the ability to remove the electric drive system is a definite plus. The
skates they are mounting these on are strictly for kids or super
lightweight riders anyway as they have no internal metal
stiffening/stability plate for the axles to attach to.
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Megasite
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX - 801-749-7807
message - 866-872-8901
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619)
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>From: Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: Re: Impressive NiMH conversion on the Web
>Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 10:21:19 -0800
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>I don't know about the PIVCOs, but the Ford Th!nk City had NiCads that
>worked very well. I don't know what charger was in the car, but it was
>probably European. Saft Nicads.
The charger in the Th!nk City was from Actia of France
and, as Marc said, it did a great job.
I copied down the following from our last car...
Input Voltage 230V AC +1-%, -15%
Input current 16A RMS
Output voltage 180V DC
Output current 25A max.
Batteries were from SAFT (also France) 19 x 6V flooded NiCds
Motor was from Siemens (Germany)
1 LH 5116 4AA99 Z
10,000 rpm
S2 60 min 17 kW/150A/3500rpm
S2 1.5 min 108 Nm/280A/1000rpm
rated battery voltage 120V
Hope that's of interest.
Nick
Dr Nick Carter,
Owner, npc Imaging, 2228 Magowan Drive, Santa Rosa, CA 95405 USA
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel/fax: +1 (707) 573 9361
http://www.npcimaging.com
ex-Th!nk City EV driver
President, North Bay Electric Auto Association
"Spare the air every day - drive electric!"
***************************************************************
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** CD-ROM versions of Ted Ross and Stiller Handbook **
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** Dover miniature & full-size orchestral scores in stock **
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Please excuse my ignorance. I'd like to include temp monitoring on my
emeter. What do I do with the V+ lead of the LM35? Is it powered from
the auxiliary battery?
Mike Hoskinson
Lee Hart wrote:
fred whitridge wrote:
Hello: any idea what the eMeter uses as a temp sensor? Is this just a
thermistor?
It's a National Semiconductor LM35. The circuit is figure 5 on their
data sheet.
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Still trying to accomplish this.
I have succesfully tested outlets and identified the difference with the
multimeter when I get out of phase circuits. Now I am trying to find two
out of phase sockets that combine to add up to 240V. So far I get
outlets reading 120V - 124V but when I put them in the 2 into 1 box it
is coming out 208V at what should be the 240V socket. We are concerned
because the electronics can fry under sagging voltage and 208V may just
be too little.
Depending on the 120V feeds we combine, we see either no voltage, or
208V on the output socket. Nothing else.
Any ideas?
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Megasite
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX - 801-749-7807
message - 866-872-8901
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You are fed from a three phase feed. Not a single phase 240 feed. You will
need a transformer doubler to raise a 120 VAC feed to 240 VAC.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Trough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: Making 240VAC out of 2 x 120VAC
> Still trying to accomplish this.
>
> I have succesfully tested outlets and identified the difference with the
> multimeter when I get out of phase circuits. Now I am trying to find two
> out of phase sockets that combine to add up to 240V. So far I get
> outlets reading 120V - 124V but when I put them in the 2 into 1 box it
> is coming out 208V at what should be the 240V socket. We are concerned
> because the electronics can fry under sagging voltage and 208V may just
> be too little.
>
> Depending on the 120V feeds we combine, we see either no voltage, or
> 208V on the output socket. Nothing else.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> -Ken Trough
> Admin - V is for Voltage Megasite
> http://visforvoltage.com
> AIM - ktrough
> FAX - 801-749-7807
> message - 866-872-8901
>
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Yup your place is fed with 208 three phase. Phase to nuetral gives 120.
This is the same as my Big shop has.
Yea 208 can really mess with a constant current design that compensates for
line sag. This is why we have the Buck current sensor on the line feeds of
most of our agressive chargers.
50 amps of 240 is stable on 208 the limits go up to the silicon limits..read
Vsats... the line current sensor just keeps the line current at 50 amps, and
won't let it try for 75 to 80.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Trough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: Making 240VAC out of 2 x 120VAC
> Still trying to accomplish this.
>
> I have succesfully tested outlets and identified the difference with the
> multimeter when I get out of phase circuits. Now I am trying to find two
> out of phase sockets that combine to add up to 240V. So far I get
> outlets reading 120V - 124V but when I put them in the 2 into 1 box it
> is coming out 208V at what should be the 240V socket. We are concerned
> because the electronics can fry under sagging voltage and 208V may just
> be too little.
>
> Depending on the 120V feeds we combine, we see either no voltage, or
> 208V on the output socket. Nothing else.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> -Ken Trough
> Admin - V is for Voltage Megasite
> http://visforvoltage.com
> AIM - ktrough
> FAX - 801-749-7807
> message - 866-872-8901
>
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Still hard to store it and transport it, but looks like there may be a way
to make is more efficiently now.
http://www.indystar.com/articles/7/198067-9767-010.html
BTW, does anybody here know of any EV conversions looking at using
lithium polymer sulfur batteries? Or if they are ready for
testing or real world usage?
Thanks!
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
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Anyone know more about this?
This article is very short on specifics. I'm guessing
the efficiency is higher than room-temperature
electrolysis but wonder if it's an "incremental
improvement with a press release" or really a major
improvement.
The article implies that it needs to be done in a
nuclear reactor but doesn't really say why. Does it
need radiation or something else found only in nuclear
reactors? Maybe it all boils down to a way to improve
the efficiency of nuclear reactors by capturing some
of the waste heat energy and calling it improved
electrolysis efficiency. Sounds like it could be a
good news if we don't have to build brand new fissile
nuclear reactors to do it.
-Sam
> Still hard to store it and transport it, but looks
> like there may be a way
> to make is more efficiently now.
>
> http://www.indystar.com/articles/7/198067-9767-010.html
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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--- Begin Message ---
Rich Rudman wrote:
More properley
About a Dozzen To-220 Mosfets, or a one darn big module. Or 4 TO264s
A 600 volt Igbt, single device is able to boost 240 to 400. With ease... and
over %90 eff. No need for the 900 V IGs.
PFC 30s can do this.... They are $2K. When you boost only(240 to 400) the
stress is a Lot less on the single device
To split hairs, running a converter from 20v is much easier than 400v
because you don't need a boot-strapping supply, but that's irrelevant.
The real cost difference is between a 48v MOSFET or a 900v IGBT, but
again it's not enough to justify cables measured in multiple 0-gauge.
--
Martin K
Hi Rich,
I was talking about running a flyback converter from a 400v DC bus
versus a low voltage bus (20v).
The flyback has twice the source voltage stress on the switch when off,
giving a CE voltage of 800, requiring a 900v IGBT. Sorry for the confusion.
--
Martin K
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�using nuclear power to indirectly wean the transportation system from its
dependence on
oil.�
Reminds me of �modern science� coming up with Heroin to help wean people off of
Morphine.
--- Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Still hard to store it and transport it, but looks like there may be a way
> to make is more efficiently now.
>
> http://www.indystar.com/articles/7/198067-9767-010.html
>
> BTW, does anybody here know of any EV conversions looking at using
> lithium polymer sulfur batteries? Or if they are ready for
> testing or real world usage?
>
> Thanks!
> > * LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
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--- Begin Message ---
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
http://www.indystar.com/articles/7/198067-9767-010.html
The goal is to create a reactor that could produce about 300
megawatts of electricity for the grid, enough to run about
300,000 window air conditioners or produce about 2.5 kilos of
hydrogen per second. When burned, a kilo of hydrogen has about
the same energy as a gallon of regular gasoline.
120MW-seconds per gallon of gasoline equivalent does not sound particularly
efficient to me... that works out to 33KWh/gal... if an EV typically uses
in the range of 250-500 Wh/mile, that works out to 66-132 mpg equivalent.
So you'd probably get double the mileage out of an EV as a hydrogen
vehicle for the same energy...
- --
Alan Batie ______ alan.batie.org Me
alan at batie.org \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle
PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers
27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ spamassassin.taint.org NO SPAM!
The voters have spoken. Let's hope we survive the result.
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I don't know what an LM35 is without looking but I can say for sure that
the temperature input on an E-meter expects a 10kohm thermistor. This
just happens to be the same device used on most of the el-cheapo digital
indoor/outdoor thermometers. Conveniently, just whack off the external
probe at the thermometer and you have a ready-made sensor and lead.
John
On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 12:42:33 -0700, Michael Hoskinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>Please excuse my ignorance. I'd like to include temp monitoring on my
>emeter. What do I do with the V+ lead of the LM35? Is it powered from
>the auxiliary battery?
>
>Mike Hoskinson
>
>Lee Hart wrote:
>
>>fred whitridge wrote:
>>
>>>Hello: any idea what the eMeter uses as a temp sensor? Is this just a
>>>thermistor?
>>>
>>
>>It's a National Semiconductor LM35. The circuit is figure 5 on their
>>data sheet.
>>
>
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://bellsouthpwp.net/j/o/johngd/
Cleveland, Occupied TN
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--- Begin Message ---
From: "Markus L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'SFEAA'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Electric vehicles in Japan
Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 21:17:15 -0500
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sherry,
maybe the website of the Prius+ initiative may answer some of
your questions. http://www.calcars.org/priusplus.html
It was there where I read that the Japanese/European Prius has
an EV-only button which forces it to leave the ICE off (until
the battery depletes).
Markus
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sherry Boschert
> Sent: Sonntag, 28. November 2004 21:03
> To: SFEAA; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Fwd: Re: Electric vehicles in Japan
>
>
> I've made contact with the Japan EV Club. Initially, I
> asked 2 questions:
>
> 1) Does Toyota still sell the RAV4 EV in Japan?
> (Answer: No.)
>
> 2) Rumor here in the U.S. has it that the Toyota Prius
> hybrid sold in Japan has plug-in capability and a
> button or switch that allows electric-only driving for
> the first 20 miles or so, then the driver can switch
> to hybrid mode for longer distances (a feature not
> included in the models sold in the U.S.). Is this
> true? (Answer again was, No. Can be driven
> electric-only for about 1 km.)
>
> So I'm wondering, where did talk come from about the
> Prius's electric-only capability? Was that just a
> rumor? Is it possible that the language barrier
> created a misunderstanding in that question or answer?
>
> Sherry
>
> --- Japan EV Club <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 22:06:12 +0900
> > Subject: Re: Electric vehicles in Japan
> > From: Japan EV Club <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: Sherry Boschert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > To Mr.Sherry Boschert
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > Toyota RAV4-EV is already a production end in March
> > 2003 in Japan.
> >
> > The Toyota Prius hybrid car in Japan can be driven
> > in all-electric mode for
> > about 1km.
> >
> > I asked the public relations section of Toyota.
> >
> > Please check following site
> >
> http://toyota.jp/Showroom/All_toyota_lineup/prius/index.html
> > http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/index.html
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > K. Ishikawa
> > Japan Electric Vehicle Club
> > http://www.jevc.gr.jp
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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