EV Digest 3951
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) serious power
by Aaron NMLUG-EV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) reduce a cars electric-power usage by 70 percent
by Lee Dekker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: serious power
by Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: A89 vs. ETEK
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) fw: attack on clean air requirements [Incident: 041209-000062]
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Mystery Machine
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Rav4 EV Response From Toyota
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Information about Matt Van Leeuwen's Sylph (aka: A89 vs Etek, 3 Wheeled EV)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: Information about Matt Van Leeuwen's Sylph (aka: A89 vs Etek, 3
Wheeled EV)
by Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: serious power
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) Re: zap-wavecrest-electrocharger
by "Charles Whalen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Richard and All,
--- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> i have one and am building a emotorcycle with it
> it's currently in a test rig
It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle motor,
it's not powerful enough at start-up for anything over
800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if top
speed is less.
It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't gear
it more without lowering your top speed for good
starting power.
Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
superior for starting on hills and can be made to turn
5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru gearing
or higher top speed.
BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
than 50 mph or your range will be quite short because
of aero drag unless you do a good half or full body
fairing. If you do that ,long range and top speed will
be much better like x2 or x3 for range from lower drag
at a given speed if done right!!!
Though the E-tek at top speed will pull stronger
with more torque.
In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded and
geared for 50 mph top speed, use an E-controller to
limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly like
mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
HTH's,
jerry dycus
>
> Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It seems to me with my limited testing is the ETEK
> is better at 48v than the
> A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit peppier
> than the ETEK is what I
> am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to my
> house that I can just pull
> at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could pull in
> the middle of the hill
> from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would be
> stuck with no acceleration.
> I am even feeling a bit of difference in the 30
> pounds I lost from the
> change of motors too. So more power. Very little
> modification. More
> efficient. I also have the A89 for another project
> if I desire. Lawrence
> Rhodes.......
>
>
>
> Regards
> Richard
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> Messenger
__________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
hi jerry
thats useful information
thank you
my bike will be around 300lbs and I weigh 200 lbs
it will be geared for 50mph flat out
i'm only going 5 miles each way to work so i could loose another 50lbs off the
weight in batteries if the thing rides like a slug
i have no gear box it's direct drive
controller is a 4QD 300 with regen
any one out there have any more good advice ?
all the electrics have been tested in my trike test rig which is too fast for
it's stability
jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Richard and All,
--- richard ball wrote:
> what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> i have one and am building a emotorcycle with it
> it's currently in a test rig
It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle motor,
it's not powerful enough at start-up for anything over
800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if top
speed is less.
It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't gear
it more without lowering your top speed for good
starting power.
Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
superior for starting on hills and can be made to turn
5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru gearing
or higher top speed.
BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
than 50 mph or your range will be quite short because
of aero drag unless you do a good half or full body
fairing. If you do that ,long range and top speed will
be much better like x2 or x3 for range from lower drag
at a given speed if done right!!!
Though the E-tek at top speed will pull stronger
with more torque.
In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded and
geared for 50 mph top speed, use an E-controller to
limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly like
mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
HTH's,
jerry dycus
>
> Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> It seems to me with my limited testing is the ETEK
> is better at 48v than the
> A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit peppier
> than the ETEK is what I
> am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to my
> house that I can just pull
> at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could pull in
> the middle of the hill
> from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would be
> stuck with no acceleration.
> I am even feeling a bit of difference in the 30
> pounds I lost from the
> change of motors too. So more power. Very little
> modification. More
> efficient. I also have the A89 for another project
> if I desire. Lawrence
> Rhodes.......
>
>
>
> Regards
> Richard
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> Messenger
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search.
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
Regards
Richard
---------------------------------
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Want to see some SERIOUS electrical power?
http://www.sandia.gov/news-center/news-releases/2004/images/jpg/z-machine.jpg
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Richard,
I am interested in the trike. I am designing a low
speed trike about 30 mph max based on a recumbent
tadpole type trike, (greenspeed) I am thinking of
using the etek with li-ion bats and keeping the
pedals. total weight of bike, motor,electronics, batts
and me and gear of just under 400 lbs. I will be
using it for long distance touring (150-200 miles per
day) I just want some assist up long hills or when i
get tired. do you think this is too big a motor for
that application?
thanks
keith
--- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> hi jerry
> thats useful information
> thank you
> my bike will be around 300lbs and I weigh 200 lbs
> it will be geared for 50mph flat out
> i'm only going 5 miles each way to work so i could
> loose another 50lbs off the weight in batteries if
> the thing rides like a slug
> i have no gear box it's direct drive
> controller is a 4QD 300 with regen
> any one out there have any more good advice ?
> all the electrics have been tested in my trike test
> rig which is too fast for it's stability
>
>
> jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Richard and All,
> --- richard ball wrote:
>
> > what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> > i have one and am building a emotorcycle with it
> > it's currently in a test rig
>
> It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
> While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle motor,
> it's not powerful enough at start-up for anything
> over
> 800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if top
> speed is less.
> It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't gear
> it more without lowering your top speed for good
> starting power.
> Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
> superior for starting on hills and can be made to
> turn
> 5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru
> gearing
> or higher top speed.
> BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
> than 50 mph or your range will be quite short
> because
> of aero drag unless you do a good half or full body
> fairing. If you do that ,long range and top speed
> will
> be much better like x2 or x3 for range from lower
> drag
> at a given speed if done right!!!
> Though the E-tek at top speed will pull stronger
> with more torque.
> In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded and
> geared for 50 mph top speed, use an E-controller to
> limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly like
> mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
> I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
> HTH's,
> jerry dycus
> >
> > Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> > It seems to me with my limited testing is the ETEK
> > is better at 48v than the
> > A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit peppier
> > than the ETEK is what I
> > am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to my
> > house that I can just pull
> > at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could pull
> in
> > the middle of the hill
> > from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would be
> > stuck with no acceleration.
> > I am even feeling a bit of difference in the 30
> > pounds I lost from the
> > change of motors too. So more power. Very little
> > modification. More
> > efficient. I also have the A89 for another project
> > if I desire. Lawrence
> > Rhodes.......
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards
> > Richard
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> > Messenger
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced
> search.
> http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
>
>
>
> Regards
> Richard
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> Messenger
__________________________________
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The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free!
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hi keith
way too big a motor
my trike has stupid performance for a low weight
vehicle - when we tested it last week it wheelied on
the throttle and spat me off
i've just re hashed the frame to lower the centre of
gravity to make it stable
for your needs you want a hub motor
heinzman do a 2kw 36V kit running on nicads with a
top speed of 13mph in a 20" wheel
that would pull you up everest at 400lbs
crystalite do all sorts of motor kits up to two speed
delta 72v unitstell me what country you live in and i
can point out the people to speak to
i've done a good deal of looking into this lightweight
electric bike lark
regards
reb
--- keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> Richard,
> I am interested in the trike. I am designing a low
> speed trike about 30 mph max based on a recumbent
> tadpole type trike, (greenspeed) I am thinking of
> using the etek with li-ion bats and keeping the
> pedals. total weight of bike, motor,electronics,
> batts
> and me and gear of just under 400 lbs. I will be
> using it for long distance touring (150-200 miles
> per
> day) I just want some assist up long hills or when i
> get tired. do you think this is too big a motor for
> that application?
>
> thanks
> keith
> --- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > hi jerry
> > thats useful information
> > thank you
> > my bike will be around 300lbs and I weigh 200 lbs
> > it will be geared for 50mph flat out
> > i'm only going 5 miles each way to work so i could
> > loose another 50lbs off the weight in batteries if
> > the thing rides like a slug
> > i have no gear box it's direct drive
> > controller is a 4QD 300 with regen
> > any one out there have any more good advice ?
> > all the electrics have been tested in my trike
> test
> > rig which is too fast for it's stability
> >
> >
> > jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi Richard and All,
> > --- richard ball wrote:
> >
> > > what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> > > i have one and am building a emotorcycle with it
> > > it's currently in a test rig
> >
> > It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
> > While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle motor,
> > it's not powerful enough at start-up for anything
> > over
> > 800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if top
> > speed is less.
> > It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't gear
> > it more without lowering your top speed for good
> > starting power.
> > Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
> > superior for starting on hills and can be made to
> > turn
> > 5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru
> > gearing
> > or higher top speed.
> > BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
> > than 50 mph or your range will be quite short
> > because
> > of aero drag unless you do a good half or full
> body
> > fairing. If you do that ,long range and top speed
> > will
> > be much better like x2 or x3 for range from lower
> > drag
> > at a given speed if done right!!!
> > Though the E-tek at top speed will pull stronger
> > with more torque.
> > In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded and
> > geared for 50 mph top speed, use an E-controller
> to
> > limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly like
> > mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
> > I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
> > HTH's,
> > jerry dycus
> > >
> > > Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> > > It seems to me with my limited testing is the
> ETEK
> > > is better at 48v than the
> > > A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit
> peppier
> > > than the ETEK is what I
> > > am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to my
> > > house that I can just pull
> > > at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could pull
> > in
> > > the middle of the hill
> > > from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would be
> > > stuck with no acceleration.
> > > I am even feeling a bit of difference in the 30
> > > pounds I lost from the
> > > change of motors too. So more power. Very little
> > > modification. More
> > > efficient. I also have the A89 for another
> project
> > > if I desire. Lawrence
> > > Rhodes.......
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Richard
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> > > Messenger
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced
> > search.
> > http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards
> > Richard
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> > Messenger
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free!
> http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>
=====
Regards
Richard
___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.technologyreview.com/articles/04/12/prototype81204.asp?trk=nl
New software from Siemens VDO Automotive in Schwalbach am Taunus, Germany,
could boost
cars’ fuel efficiency by regulating their electricity usage.
__________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
If you delete the "/2004/images/jpg/z-machine.jpg " there are alot of
interesting articles including using Stirling engine generators to produce
power. Here in the SouthWest I don't understand why this hasn't happened yet
except as a experiment.
Aaron NMLUG-EV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:Want to see some SERIOUS electrical
power?
http://www.sandia.gov/news-center/news-releases/2004/images/jpg/z-machine.jpg
---------------------------------
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Dress up your holiday email, Hollywood style. Learn more.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
wow,
I live in so cal.
what i am trying to do is knockoff a greenspeed solar
trike similar to the ones on their website whout the
extreem expense. any help will be appreciated
thanks
keith
--- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> hi keith
> way too big a motor
> my trike has stupid performance for a low weight
> vehicle - when we tested it last week it wheelied on
> the throttle and spat me off
> i've just re hashed the frame to lower the centre of
> gravity to make it stable
> for your needs you want a hub motor
> heinzman do a 2kw 36V kit running on nicads with a
> top speed of 13mph in a 20" wheel
> that would pull you up everest at 400lbs
> crystalite do all sorts of motor kits up to two
> speed
> delta 72v unitstell me what country you live in and
> i
> can point out the people to speak to
> i've done a good deal of looking into this
> lightweight
> electric bike lark
> regards
> reb
>
> --- keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > Richard,
> > I am interested in the trike. I am designing a
> low
> > speed trike about 30 mph max based on a recumbent
> > tadpole type trike, (greenspeed) I am thinking of
> > using the etek with li-ion bats and keeping the
> > pedals. total weight of bike, motor,electronics,
> > batts
> > and me and gear of just under 400 lbs. I will be
> > using it for long distance touring (150-200 miles
> > per
> > day) I just want some assist up long hills or when
> i
> > get tired. do you think this is too big a motor
> for
> > that application?
> >
> > thanks
> > keith
> > --- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > hi jerry
> > > thats useful information
> > > thank you
> > > my bike will be around 300lbs and I weigh 200
> lbs
> > > it will be geared for 50mph flat out
> > > i'm only going 5 miles each way to work so i
> could
> > > loose another 50lbs off the weight in batteries
> if
> > > the thing rides like a slug
> > > i have no gear box it's direct drive
> > > controller is a 4QD 300 with regen
> > > any one out there have any more good advice ?
> > > all the electrics have been tested in my trike
> > test
> > > rig which is too fast for it's stability
> > >
> > >
> > > jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > Hi Richard and All,
> > > --- richard ball wrote:
> > >
> > > > what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> > > > i have one and am building a emotorcycle with
> it
> > > > it's currently in a test rig
> > >
> > > It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
> > > While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle motor,
> > > it's not powerful enough at start-up for
> anything
> > > over
> > > 800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if
> top
> > > speed is less.
> > > It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't gear
> > > it more without lowering your top speed for good
> > > starting power.
> > > Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
> > > superior for starting on hills and can be made
> to
> > > turn
> > > 5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru
> > > gearing
> > > or higher top speed.
> > > BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
> > > than 50 mph or your range will be quite short
> > > because
> > > of aero drag unless you do a good half or full
> > body
> > > fairing. If you do that ,long range and top
> speed
> > > will
> > > be much better like x2 or x3 for range from
> lower
> > > drag
> > > at a given speed if done right!!!
> > > Though the E-tek at top speed will pull stronger
> > > with more torque.
> > > In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded and
> > > geared for 50 mph top speed, use an E-controller
> > to
> > > limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly
> like
> > > mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
> > > I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
> > > HTH's,
> > > jerry dycus
> > > >
> > > > Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> > > > It seems to me with my limited testing is the
> > ETEK
> > > > is better at 48v than the
> > > > A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit
> > peppier
> > > > than the ETEK is what I
> > > > am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to
> my
> > > > house that I can just pull
> > > > at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could
> pull
> > > in
> > > > the middle of the hill
> > > > from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would
> be
> > > > stuck with no acceleration.
> > > > I am even feeling a bit of difference in the
> 30
> > > > pounds I lost from the
> > > > change of motors too. So more power. Very
> little
> > > > modification. More
> > > > efficient. I also have the A89 for another
> > project
> > > > if I desire. Lawrence
> > > > Rhodes.......
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > > Richard
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------
> > > > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and
> Yahoo!
> > > > Messenger
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new
> enhanced
> > > search.
> > > http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Richard
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> > > Messenger
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free!
> > http://my.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
>
> =====
> Regards
> Richard
>
>
>
>
>
___________________________________________________________
>
> Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo!
> Messenger
> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>
>
__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
take a look at these web sites for good info
kinetics.org.uk - heinzman systems explained
evsolutions.net - all about crystalite systems
joshua at evsolutions is also a trike fanatic and
really helpful - he's probably your best bet for
expert advice
--- keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> wow,
>
> I live in so cal.
>
> what i am trying to do is knockoff a greenspeed
> solar
> trike similar to the ones on their website whout the
> extreem expense. any help will be appreciated
> thanks
> keith
> --- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > hi keith
> > way too big a motor
> > my trike has stupid performance for a low weight
> > vehicle - when we tested it last week it wheelied
> on
> > the throttle and spat me off
> > i've just re hashed the frame to lower the centre
> of
> > gravity to make it stable
> > for your needs you want a hub motor
> > heinzman do a 2kw 36V kit running on nicads with
> a
> > top speed of 13mph in a 20" wheel
> > that would pull you up everest at 400lbs
> > crystalite do all sorts of motor kits up to two
> > speed
> > delta 72v unitstell me what country you live in
> and
> > i
> > can point out the people to speak to
> > i've done a good deal of looking into this
> > lightweight
> > electric bike lark
> > regards
> > reb
> >
> > --- keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > wrote:
> > > Richard,
> > > I am interested in the trike. I am designing a
> > low
> > > speed trike about 30 mph max based on a
> recumbent
> > > tadpole type trike, (greenspeed) I am thinking
> of
> > > using the etek with li-ion bats and keeping the
> > > pedals. total weight of bike, motor,electronics,
> > > batts
> > > and me and gear of just under 400 lbs. I will
> be
> > > using it for long distance touring (150-200
> miles
> > > per
> > > day) I just want some assist up long hills or
> when
> > i
> > > get tired. do you think this is too big a motor
> > for
> > > that application?
> > >
> > > thanks
> > > keith
> > > --- richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > hi jerry
> > > > thats useful information
> > > > thank you
> > > > my bike will be around 300lbs and I weigh 200
> > lbs
> > > > it will be geared for 50mph flat out
> > > > i'm only going 5 miles each way to work so i
> > could
> > > > loose another 50lbs off the weight in
> batteries
> > if
> > > > the thing rides like a slug
> > > > i have no gear box it's direct drive
> > > > controller is a 4QD 300 with regen
> > > > any one out there have any more good advice ?
> > > > all the electrics have been tested in my trike
> > > test
> > > > rig which is too fast for it's stability
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Hi Richard and All,
> > > > --- richard ball wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > what vehicle are you using the etek in?
> > > > > i have one and am building a emotorcycle
> with
> > it
> > > > > it's currently in a test rig
> > > >
> > > > It's in a Lectra motorcycle I believe.
> > > > While the PM E-tek is a great motorcycle
> motor,
> > > > it's not powerful enough at start-up for
> > anything
> > > > over
> > > > 800lbs loaded weight and well geared. More if
> > top
> > > > speed is less.
> > > > It's limited to about 4,000rpm so you can't
> gear
> > > > it more without lowering your top speed for
> good
> > > > starting power.
> > > > Once you get over that weight, the A89 is
> > > > superior for starting on hills and can be made
> > to
> > > > turn
> > > > 5-6,000 rpm for even more start-up torque thru
> > > > gearing
> > > > or higher top speed.
> > > > BTW on motorcycles it's best not to go faster
> > > > than 50 mph or your range will be quite short
> > > > because
> > > > of aero drag unless you do a good half or full
> > > body
> > > > fairing. If you do that ,long range and top
> > speed
> > > > will
> > > > be much better like x2 or x3 for range from
> > lower
> > > > drag
> > > > at a given speed if done right!!!
> > > > Though the E-tek at top speed will pull
> stronger
> > > > with more torque.
> > > > In heavier EV's like more the 600lbs loaded
> and
> > > > geared for 50 mph top speed, use an
> E-controller
> > > to
> > > > limit the E-tek's current or it may die badly
> > like
> > > > mine did on my 1,000lb EV.
> > > > I'd use it again if building a motorcycle.
> > > > HTH's,
> > > > jerry dycus
> > > > >
> > > > > Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> > > > > It seems to me with my limited testing is
> the
> > > ETEK
> > > > > is better at 48v than the
> > > > > A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit
> > > peppier
> > > > > than the ETEK is what I
> > > > > am guessing. My test is a steep hill going
> to
> > my
> > > > > house that I can just pull
> > > > > at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could
> > pull
> > > > in
> > > > > the middle of the hill
> > > > > from 20mph and accelerate where the A89
> would
> > be
> > > > > stuck with no acceleration.
> > > > > I am even feeling a bit of difference in the
> > 30
> > > > > pounds I lost from the
> > > > > change of motors too. So more power. Very
> > little
> > > > > modification. More
> > > > > efficient. I also have the A89 for another
> > > project
> > > > > if I desire. Lawrence
> > > > > Rhodes.......
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Regards
> > > > > Richard
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------
> > > > > Win a castle for NYE with your mates and
> > Yahoo!
> > > > > Messenger
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________
> > > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > > Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new
> > enhanced
> > > > search.
> > > > http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Regards
>
=== message truncated ===
=====
Regards
Richard
___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It's on an old Lectra before they changed the fork angle. I was first there
when they offered the give away. I have all stock parts glider wise. I
even have a couple of extra wheels. The extra seats I sold. It pulls up
hills real well with a 16 tooth to a 54 tooth with the stock wheels & tires.
It's a little sluggish off the line but once it gets going it pulls real
well. Haven't tried top speed yet. This is with a total weight running
around 700 pounds,,, maybe a few under. LR.......
----- Original Message -----
From: "richard ball" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2004 1:34 AM
Subject: Re: A89 vs. ETEK
what vehicle are you using the etek in?
i have one and am building a emotorcycle with it
it's currently in a test rig
Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
It seems to me with my limited testing is the ETEK is better at 48v than
the
A89. At 72v however the A89 would be a bit peppier than the ETEK is what I
am guessing. My test is a steep hill going to my house that I can just
pull
at 25 with the A89 geared up the ETEK could pull in the middle of the hill
from 20mph and accelerate where the A89 would be stuck with no
acceleration.
I am even feeling a bit of difference in the 30 pounds I lost from the
change of motors too. So more power. Very little modification. More
efficient. I also have the A89 for another project if I desire. Lawrence
Rhodes.......
Regards
Richard
---------------------------------
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
FWIW, here's the reply I received from Toyota (my original comment is at the
bottom).
The usual hot air. I'm too depressed to bother with a rebuttal.
Jeff Yoder
-----Original Message-----
From: Ask Toyota [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2004 8:54 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: attack on clean air requirements [Incident: 041209-000062]
Recently you contacted Toyota. Below is a summary of your contact message
and our response.
Thank you for allowing us to be of service to you.
[===> Please enter your reply below this line <===]
[===> Please enter your reply above this line <===]
Subject
attack on clean air requirements
Discussion Thread
Response (Eli)12/10/2004 07:53 AM
Thank you for contacting Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc.
We share your concern about greenhouse gases, which is why we've been a
leader in hybrid technology and have been selling the Toyota Prius in the
United States since 2000 and will soon bring out the Lexus RX 400h and the
Toyota Highlander Hybrid.
However when it comes to California's attempt to establish new regulations
to reduce greenhouse gas emissions through changes in motor-vehicle fuel
economy, we have serious concerns.
The increased fuel economy requirements are drastic even for Toyota, which
has one of the best environmental records in the industry. For consumers,
this would lead to higher priced vehicles and fewer model choices. The added
cost to consumers, by some estimates, may average as much as $3,000 per
vehicle. As for choice, the only vehicles we currently make that would meet
the ultimate rules are our Prius and our manual transmission ECHO. We
recognize that a large number of our customers need different vehicles for
their lifestyles and we would like to continue to meet those needs.
Global warming is a genuine concern for our society, and Toyota vows to be
part of the solution. The California rule has an admirable goal, but we feel
takes the wrong approach. Any solution must take at least a national
approach, or it may threaten economic growth while having little impact on
the problem.
Toyota will continue to work with others, including California and federal
regulators, government representatives, academic leaders, the industry, and
environmentalists to seek innovative solutions to the problem of global
warming. And we will continue developing and expanding pioneer technology
that will lead the way to future environmental advancements.
Please know that we value your input, and have documented your comments at
our National Headquarters under file #200412100154. We appreciate your
feedback and the time you have taken to email us.
Toyota Customer Experience
Customer (Jeff Yoder)12/09/2004 09:08 AM
Why are you joining the attack on clean air requirements? (Conspicuously,
Honda and Nissan are not.) This IS a safety issue because your cars are
making the air unsafe for me to breath.
Bottom line, I want to drive an EV!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Whose buggy is this?
That's Suck Amps EV Racing's "Silver Bullet"
Owner: Tom True
NEDRA World Record Holder at 120V and 156V
http://tinyurl.com/6lby7
http://tinyurl.com/6w93s
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Megasite
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX - 801-749-7807
message - 866-872-8901
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I too sent a note to Toyota requesting information about how to purchase a
Rav4 EV. My theory is that the squeaky wheel get the grease. I encourage others
on this list to send a reasonable information request to Toyota on the
subject of your request. Let's provide pressure on corporate America in a
professional manner. Here is my request and their response.
>>>
Recently you contacted Toyota. Below is a summary of your contact message
and our response.
Thank you for allowing us to be of service to you.
[===> Please enter your reply below this line <===]
[===> Please enter your reply above this line <===]
(http://toyota.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/toyota.cfg/php/enduser/[EMAIL
PROTECTED]&p_next_page=myq_upd.php&p_refno=041209-000041&p_create
d=1102608536)
Subject Rav4 EV Discussion Thread Response (Michael) 12/09/2004 08:43
AM Thank you for contacting Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc.
We appreciate your interest in the RAV4 Electric Vehicle (EV).
We discontinued sales of the RAV4 EV due to low sales levels. As a result,
no business case could be made for continuing sales of the RAV4 EV at these
volumes. We believe that advances in hybrid technology and other advanced
systems have a much greater potential for the environment and Toyota.
You may wish to review the _RAV4 EV (Electric Vehicle) â Retail Program
Stoppage_
(http://toyota.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/toyota.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=667&p_created=001041949948)
, _RAV4 EV (Electric Vehicle) â Retail
Demand_
(http://toyota.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/toyota.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=673&p_created=001041952433)
and _RAV4 EV (Electric Vehicle) â Toyotaâs
Environmental Commitment_
(http://toyota.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/toyota.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=673&p_created=001041952433)
Frequently Asked
Questions (FAQs) for more information.
Your email has been documented at our National Headquarters under file
#200412090184. If we can be of further assistance, please feel free to contact
us
via _email_
(http://toyota.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/toyota.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=164)
or by calling 800-331-4331. We are available from 6 AM to
6 PM, Pacific Time, Monday through Friday.
Toyota Customer Experience Customer (Mike Bachand) 12/09/2004 08:08 AM
Dear Toyota,
I would very much like to purchase a Toyota Rav4 Electric Vehicle. You have
proven that you have the capability to manufacture a high quality product
that meets my need for an EV.
I have a car that I need to replace and have the money in the bank to
complete this purchase in 1 week. Where can I place a $1,000 deposit to get
this
vehicle?
Please contact me and tell me how I can complete this transaction.
PS: I already own 2 Toyota's.
Mike Bachand
2509 E. Wynterbrook Drive
Highlands Ranch, CO 80126
303-791-8880
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In Michael Hackleman's excellent 1996 book "The New Electric Vehicles: A
clean Quiet Revolution" he profiles a 3 wheeled vehicle (2 front, 1 rear)
called
the Sylph designed by Matt Van Leeuwen. This vehicle has captured my
imagination. Although the initial prototype is not an EV (it was originally
powered
by a Honda Goldwing motor and drivetrain) it appears well done and quite
aerodynamic. Most of this work and testing appears to have taken place in
California in the mid 1990 time period.
I have been unable to find out any more about Matt or this vehicle in my
browsing the web. Can anyone on this list provide more information on Matt, his
current geographic location or this vehicle? Ideally I'd like to contact Matt
directly, but will take anything information I can get.
Thanks,
P.S. I received The New Electric Vehicles book as a Christmas present from
my wife last year and the pages are now dog eared. Look for a copy of this book
and similar ones on _www.megawattmotorworks.com/_
(http://www.megawattmotorworks.com/) Great site, good service, no hassles.
Drop a few not too subtle
hints now or live with that new brightly colored sweater again this year.
Mike Bachand - EV Enthusiast
DEVC Denver Electric Vehicle Council
Newsletter Editor and Website Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])
_http://www.devc.org_ (http://www.devc.org)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I found an image in Google. Looked up Sylph in images. Don't know anything else
other than a minor discussion loop about Matt being a Hughs Aircraft engineer
and inventor also found under google.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.plugitin.co.uk/images/gallerypics/sylph.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.plugitin.co.uk/gallery_evs.htm&h=256&w=400&sz=15&tbnid=TPF6oJTf3p8J:&tbnh=76&tbnw=118&start=15&prev=/images%3Fq%3DSylph%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26sa%3DN
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
In Michael Hackleman's excellent 1996 book "The New Electric Vehicles: A
clean Quiet Revolution" he profiles a 3 wheeled vehicle (2 front, 1 rear)
called
the Sylph designed by Matt Van Leeuwen. This vehicle has captured my
imagination. Although the initial prototype is not an EV (it was originally
powered
by a Honda Goldwing motor and drivetrain) it appears well done and quite
aerodynamic. Most of this work and testing appears to have taken place in
California in the mid 1990 time period.
I have been unable to find out any more about Matt or this vehicle in my
browsing the web. Can anyone on this list provide more information on Matt, his
current geographic location or this vehicle? Ideally I'd like to contact Matt
directly, but will take anything information I can get.
Thanks,
P.S. I received The New Electric Vehicles book as a Christmas present from
my wife last year and the pages are now dog eared. Look for a copy of this book
and similar ones on _www.megawattmotorworks.com/_
(http://www.megawattmotorworks.com/) Great site, good service, no hassles. Drop
a few not too subtle
hints now or live with that new brightly colored sweater again this year.
Mike Bachand - EV Enthusiast
DEVC Denver Electric Vehicle Council
Newsletter Editor and Website Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])
_http://www.devc.org_ (http://www.devc.org)
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<< Want to see some SERIOUS electrical power?
http://www.sandia.gov/news-center/news-releases/2004/images/jpg/z-machine.jpg >>
It looks like the mother of all plasma balls. That Z-machine is definitely the
opposite of "cold" fusion!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Ken,
I wonder why WaveCrest is still stuck on the older, inferior NiMH battery
technology and trying to eke out marginal improvements in that when many
other e-bike/scooter makers have already moved to the more energy dense
li-ions. Thunder-Sky now has a 100-mile range li-ion scooter, which I just
read about in that MSNBC article a few weeks ago on the recent Challenge
Bibendum in Shanghai; Evader has a 100-mile range li-ion scooter; that guy
over in Finland (I forget his name) also has a 100-mile range li-ion
scooter; and even Honda now has long-range li-ion scooter prototypes.
Correct me if I'm wrong (it's been a long time since I looked at the specs
on the WaveCrest e-bike), but as I recall, WaveCrest's bike has a range of
only about 12 miles at top speed. I would think they should be able to
possibly double that range by swapping out the NiMH pack for a li-ion pack.
One of the major concerns with li-ions seems to be their lower power density
(at least for some lithium chemistries, although apparently not for some of
the LiP chemistries like Kokam), but that should not be a problem with a
bicycle as it does not require high amperage draw due to its extremely light
weight. So I would think that high-energy/low-power li-ions would be the
perfect solution for an e-bike to give it longer range at the same top
speed. If available power for very quick acceleration were an issue, then
the amperage draw could be limited by the controller and the human could
make up the difference by pedaling (if for some reason he really wanted to
accelerate extremely fast), which is good exercise and only takes a few
seconds anyway to get up to top speed. I wonder why WaveCrest doesn't see
it that way. Or have they not been able to master charging & balancing
issues with li-ions?
Do you happen to know if WaveCrest's upcoming "self contained powered
bicycle wheel" will have a NiMH pack or a li-ion pack?
Thanks for any additional info, as you seem to have a lot of insight into
WaveCrest's future plans.
Hey, speaking of Kokam, I wonder if Victor or Cliff would care to comment on
EaglePicher's acquisition of Kokam, which was just announced a few days ago.
More specifically, I'm wondering if that is going to have any possible
ramifications for bringing down Kokam's exhorbitant prices -- currently
around $1,700/kWh, as I recall from a previous post. I just had to laugh
when I read in EaglePicher's press release the part about Kokam's
innovations in developing high-volume manufacturing technology. There is
certainly a paradox there as "high-volume manufacturing" implies economies
of scale which in turn implies low prices. So when you compare Kokam's
$1,700/kWh price with Thunder-Sky's $300/kWh price for "volume" purchases,
that kind of seems like a joke.
Thanks,
Charles
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Trough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 5:38 PM
Subject: Re: zap-wavecrest-electrocharger
Just wondering if Wavecrest is an all hype no substance company
Wavecrest is real. They have products for sale in the mass market and a
significant amount of money backing the company.
Beyond their well known high tech electric bicycle (that is currently both
being sold in Costco, and being used/evaluated by U.S. special forces),
Wavecrest has a number of real products and technology in the pipeline:
Wavecrest has developed a high amperage spiral wound NiMH cell that solves
the weak interconnect problem with a VERY novel approach. The cells
actually screw together and the interconnects consist of a significant
portion of the cell external structure making for a truly massive current
path for high performance applications and very fast charging. Last I
heard, these cells were slated for imminent release.
Wavecrest has also developed a self contained powered bicycle wheel that
contains both a direct drive, brushless hub motor and battery pack within
a single wheel. They combine this with wireless controls and wireless dash
readout. Just replace the front wheel on your bicycle of choice with this
one and you have a high tech electric bicycle with a super clean looking
install with no unsightly batteries clamped to the frame and no unsightly
wiring running all over the place. Last I heard, this product was also
slated for imminent release.
--- End Message ---
