EV Digest 4671
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) EVLN(City of Boca Raton picks on and hassling Sparrow EV driver)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) EVLN(It's strictly electric that's saving a fortune)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) EVLN(Westphal's sky-blue 1985 Nissan Sentra EV)-long
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) EVLN(Four Internet ZAP EV sales "sight unseen")
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Montreal Gazette article today, Sept. 6
by Stefano Landi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: EV Feeding Frenzy
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Some pics of my motor online
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) unsubscribe
by "Ian McKay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Marc Kohler's Doran EV on eBay
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Siemens EV Motors
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: alternator regen -- Re: Shunt motor regen setup
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: EV Feeding Frenzy
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Shunt motor regen setup
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Shunt motor regen setup
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Alternator for psuedo-regen (was "Re: Shunt motor regen setup")
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) cheap, simple EV's Re: EV Feeding Frenzy
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: IT'S ALL GOOD / Siamese up-date
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: IT'S ALL GOOD / Siamese up-date
by "Ray Brooks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(City of Boca Raton picks on and hassling Sparrow EV driver)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.bocaratonnews.com/index.php?src=news&prid=12567&PHPSESSID=0a79a8d80d1bf3a6784a31fb8aea40b8
Boca may charge electric car owner for operating a commercial
vehicle
Published Monday, September 5, 2005 1:00 am by By Dale M. King
Richard Newman has a gold-colored electric car in his driveway.
But its not the car thats sparked a controversy between him and
the City of Boca Raton. Its the Web site on the side of the
car.
Newman, a local philanthropist, long-time science buff, collector
and owner of a vast collection of scientific artifacts, has
posted a free, informational Web site called
www.hightechscience.org. on the side of the one-seat,
all-electric vehicle.
City officials have a problem with that. In a letter to Newman,
Code Enforcement Supervisor Ken Massalone cryptically comments
that the car might be deemed a commercial vehicle because of
the lettering.
City code defines commercial lettering as letters, numbers,
symbols or combinations thereof, which advertise a trade,
business, industry or other activity for profit, or a product,
commodity or service. The ordinance does not apply to bumper
stickers.
Newman has already emailed the city, saying the car does not fit
into any of the categories that Mr. Massalone has spelled out.
But the furor apparently continues.
He says his Web site is strictly informational; it costs nothing
to visit and anything there is available to anyone who wants to
use it.
I talked to the city, and it appears they are going to fight me,
Newman told a Boca Raton News reporter as he sat in his home just
outside Old Floresta. On a table next to him was a model of
Robbie, the Robot from TVs Lost in Space series.
Ive been bombarded with phone calls and emails from people who
say the city is way off base. I have tried to work this out
amicably. Let the mayor come over and shake my hand, because I
have made Boca famous for having the most famous car.
In his driveway is a 2000 Corbin Sparrow, a single-seat,
three-wheel car powered by 13 12-volt batteries. Its normal
cruising speed is 35 to 45 mph, but it tops out at 75 to 85.
Its more an electric motorcycle than a car, he said.
California-based Corbin Motors made 355 of them between 2000 and
2002, he said. A year later, it went bankrupt. But Myers Motors
resurrected the company in June 2004.
Newman said he has the only two Corbin Sparrows on the East
Coast. His other one is on display at the South Florida Science
Museum.
There are a variety of remedies for this situation, said
Development Services Director Jorge Camejo. He said Newman could
cover the lettering or put the Web site on the bumper.
Allowing Newman to have his Web site on the car could
potentially erode the protection offered by the ordinance,
Camejo said.
Newman said he loans many of his collectables to schools and
museums for educational purposes. I have a display at West Boca
Community High School, he said. Theres no charge. I loan it
free of charge.
Newman does have a business that puts bread on the table. Nearly
30 years ago, he founded High-Tech Productions, a videotape and
disc duplication company. He also distributes videotape, boxes
and labels to government agencies, school systems, the military
and police departments coast-to-coast. The business Web site is
www.hightechscience.com.
He said his electric car is a definite draw. One man who saw it
was a retiring archeologist. He saw my car and donated a
400,000-piece fossil collection. My wife and I spent a year
categorizing it.
Earlier in life, he spent 13 years organizing stage shows in the
Catskills and worked with the likes of Milton Berle, Henny
Youngman, Florence Henderson and Kathy Lee Gifford.
But the car gets him more notice. I cant drive down the block
without people honking their horns at me. He said he puts the
Web site on the side to give information. Im not selling
anything.
Charles Cagney e-mailed the Boca Raton News to say that the city
was hassling Newman.
HighTechScience has donated numerous science and technology
centers around the country, mostly in low income areas, Cagney
said. He has even opened one at an Indian reservation in Montana
within a school that didn't even have any computers.
His organization arranged for them to receive a truckload of
brand new computers (for free) and created a science center on
the reservation.
Mr. Newman has donated over a million dollars worth of his own
money and tons of equipment to schools and should be commended
for what he has done, Cagney added. Doesn't the city have more
important things to do than to pick on an individual [who] has
single-handedly done more for educating our youth than anyone
else?
In this time of outrageous gasoline prices, Cagney added, his
electric vehicle should be a model for others. I wish I could
find one instead of paying $3 per gallon for my car.
Dale M. King can be reached at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Copyright 2004 - Boca Raton News
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
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. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(It's strictly electric that's saving a fortune)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=100962
Drivers plugged into big savings
By Thomas Caywood Sunday, September 4, 2005
Dave Robie of Weymouth doesn't want to hear your tales of woe
about highway robbery at the gas pump.
``Don't complain about the price of gas, because it's your choice
of vehicle that determines how much you're going to spend,''
Robie said. ``Instead of complaining, why don't you stop
burning as much?''
Robie drives a 1981 Ford Courier pickup that runs on 20 golf cart
batteries. This isn't one of those trendy hybrids. It's strictly
electric. He's one of a handful of local electric-vehicle
enthusiasts saving a fortune as post-hurricane gas prices soar
past $3 a gallon.
Tony Ascrizzi of Worcester goes to the gas station only about
once a month, to fill up his mother's hybrid Toyota Prius. He
drives a 1981 Volkswagen Rabbit and a 1995 Toyota Tacoma truck,
both of which he converted to electric. The truck runs on 40 golf
cart batteries stored in the bed and has a range of about 150
miles.
``It drives just like it did when it had a four-cylinder engine
in it,'' Ascrizzi said. ``It's not great performance, but it
certainly has more than enough power to get around.''
Robie's truck is one of 35 the manufacturer converted to electric
as a test after the 1973 energy crisis. He can drive roughly 50
miles before he has to recharge the batteries. That takes about
four hours and adds about $15 a month to his electric bill, Robie
said.
``If you've got a Hummer, it's getting around 10 miles a gallon
and only about five on short trips before it warms up.''
Five miles for close to $4. ``Isn't that nice?'' he said with a
smirk.
Even so, pure electric vehicles, or EVs, have never caught on the
way hybrids are beginning to.
Azure Dynamics Inc. of Woburn gave up on building electric cars a
few years ago and has since switched to hybrid technology.
``The market we thought was there, wasn't really there,''
customer service manager Chuck Connor said. ``We only made 400
of the pure EVs. But there is a niche out there.''
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
______________________________________________________
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Westphal's sky-blue 1985 Nissan Sentra EV)-long
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/02/automobiles/02convert.html
Farewell, Octane. Hello, Volt!
By RICH BEATTIE Published: September 2, 2005
GEORGE WESTPHAL'S sky-blue 1985 Nissan Sentra has braved two
decades of harsh winters in Pearl River, N.Y. - and looks it.
Spots of rust litter the hood. Door hinges creak. A thick stripe
of duct tape holds a cracked dashboard together.
[image] Rick Friedman for The New York Times
ELECTRIC CONVERTS Ken Wells who teaches high school physics, and
his students converted this Ford into an electric truck and
entered a competition for vehicles with near-zero emissions.
[image] John Marshall Mantell for The New York Times
George Westphal's 1985 Sentra uses 12-volt lead-acid batteries.
But inside, this unassuming old car holds some hidden surprises.
Behind the fuel door, where a thirsty black hole used to be, is a
three-pronged plug. Pop the trunk, and eight lead-acid batteries
reveal themselves, aligned neatly in two rows. Where the engine
used to be are two more batteries, along with a platform of wires
and electronic casings. Sit behind the wheel to find an amp meter
and a battery indicator in place of fuel and oil-pressure gauges.
Mr. Westphal's ex-gasoline drinker has taken on a new identity.
It's a purely electric car - and he did the conversion himself.
With gasoline prices soaring - in the aftermath of Hurricane
Katrina, they went well above $4 in some states this week -
drivers are taking a new interest in electric cars. Many have
already turned to hybrid gasoline-and-electric models like the
popular Toyota Prius, though the wait can be overwhelming. In the
discussion forum hybridcars.com, most hybrid buyers said they had
waited several weeks for their cars - 64 weeks in one case.
But anyone interested in buying an all-electric car from a major
carmaker is essentially out of luck.
Manufacturers have canceled work on vehicles like the Toyota
RAV4-EV, the General Motors EV-1 and the Honda EV+. (According to
Toyota's Web site, it discontinued its vehicle because of a lack
of demand and technical problems. For now, converting a
gasoline-powered car is the best - and for most, the only - way
to get an all-electric car.
Any car can be converted, from a Hummer to a Geo Metro, and parts
are available from several suppliers. Most components can go in
most cars, and only about a dozen or so main parts - including an
electric motor and an adapter to connect it to the transmission -
are necessary for the conversion.
The needed parts are available from several suppliers and are
sometimes even sold as a kit - typically for $5,000 to $15,000.
(Optional parts provide for power brakes and steering,
air-conditioning and heat.) You could hire a mechanic or pay a
specialty company to convert a gas-burning car to electric. Or
you could buy one of the kits and dive in to do it yourself.
"Converting a car is the sort of thing that any determined
individual could do," said Ken Wells, a physics teacher at St.
Mark's, a boarding school in Southborough, Mass.
"The mechanics aren't that complicated because there aren't that
many parts," agreed Carole Lemos-Wade, a senior who helped
convert a bright yellow 1994 Ford Ranger pickup in a class
project Mr. Wells ran for several years. "There's little
maintenance," she added, "and there's an insane amount of
pollution eliminated."
Of course, it does help to be someone who likes to tinker and to
have a good basic knowledge of cars. Mr. Westphal, for instance,
is a retired engineer who was still working full time when he
converted his Nissan in his spare time. "I just thought it would
be a fun project," he said.
He had been looking to convert a car to electric when the engine
died on his wife's Sentra in 1998. The vehicle, which was bought
new in 1985, gave him ready raw material.
In a search online, Mr. Westphal found his parts supplier,
Electric Vehicles of America in Wolfeboro, N.H. Over a couple of
years, he bought about $5,000 in spare parts and did the work
gradually - eventually achieving a conversion so complete that he
even scribbled over the warning, "Unleaded fuel only" from the
area on the dashboard where the fuel gauge used to be.
The biggest surprise for an interested guest invited to take a
spin in Mr. Westphal's car came with the turning of the key.
There was no gunning, no revving - just the strange sound of
silence. (Even after years of driving the car, Mr. Westphal has
to double check to make sure the car is turned on before backing
out of the driveway.) There was no exhaust, no danger of flooding
the engine - it was easy to see how a driver can be captivated by
the experience.
Since the 1960's, a small but devoted community of electric
enthusiasts has sold conversion components, worked to increase
the public's awareness of electric cars and organized clubs and
events. Ron Freund, chairman of the Electric Auto Association,
which has more than 30 chapters in North America, estimates that
today there are around 8,500 converted vehicles in the United
States, about half in California.
Most of the enthusiasts see the cars as nonpolluting, though
skeptics point out that the electricity used to charge the
batteries may come from the burning of fossil fuels.
For Electro Automotive, based in Felton, Calif., which has been
supplying conversion parts since 1979, Volkswagen Rabbits and
Porsche 914's are the most popular models for conversion.
According to Shari Prange, who owns the company with her husband,
Mike Brown, the Rabbit's boxy shape lends itself to placing
rectangular batteries inside. And the Porsche? "It just has a
cult following," said Ms. Prange, "and the fairly lightweight
chassis is good for supporting an electric motor and a bunch of
batteries."
E.V.A., Mr. Westphal's supplier, most often has requests for
components for Chevy S-10 pickups. "You can put the batteries
under the bed and still use the bed," said Bob Batson, the
company's president.
BEFORE those components can go in, though, some things have to
come out: the engine, fuel tank, exhaust system, radiator and
cooling systems. They're replaced with a motor, an adapter to
mount the motor to the transmission, a speed controller to
translate accelerator pressure to power, a charger and a
converter to power the lights and horn.
Then, of course, there are the batteries. Most people use 6-volt,
8-volt or 12-volt lead-acid batteries. Nickel metal hydride
batteries are more powerful and efficient, but these systems can
run as high as $30,000. Mr. Westphal bought ten 12-volt lead-acid
batteries for around $85 each.
A little ingenuity helped the project along. Mr. Westphal did
some machine work to fashion his own motor-to-transmission
adapter plate. He built an ironing board-shape platform out of
plywood for all the electronics. And he molded the battery
casings out of PVC.
In Southborough, Ms. Lemos-Wade and Mr. Wells's other students
followed more standard methods in converting the pickup truck.
When they were finished, they entered it in the Tour de Sol, a
competition for vehicles that approach zero emissions and use
renewable fuels. It's not a race; cars are judged on technical
attributes.
There are also other competitions. For the last 10 years, high
school teams have entered an electric vehicle conversion
competition in North Carolina called the EV Challenge. The two
dozen or so converted cars involved each year are judged on
factors like speed and range. The 2005 winner in the range
category lasted 137 miles on a single charge - pretty good,
considering that the typical electric conversion vehicle,
depending on size, weight and efficiency, gets around 30 to 60
miles per charge.
That limited range is an electric car's biggest drawback, keeping
it squarely in the realm of neighborhood vehicle. For some
people, that's sufficient. For years, Mr. Westphal used his
Sentra to commute to work. Getting back, however, was dependent
on his employer's agreeing to install a dedicated outlet for
him.
Another drawback: electric cars don't always work well in cold
weather. Mr. Westphal's Sentra becomes less efficient when the
temperature dips below 40 degrees; more than once it just stopped
running, and his wife had to rescue him.
But for conversion enthusiasts, these are mild inconveniences.
They like not having to worry about oil changes, engine problems
or the rising price of gasoline. All Mr. Westphal does for
maintenance is occasionally refill the batteries with water and
make sure the cables are connected.
The batteries are the only real expense; they must be replaced
every 1,000 or so charges (for Mr. Westphal, around 30,000
miles). And the conversion system will last; it's just the body's
falling apart that dictates when this car dies.
Mr. Westphal said that charging his car costs only around 75
cents (though it takes around six hours) and one charge propels
him about 30 miles. The same distance on a gallon of gasoline
costs perhaps three times that figure. While other conversion
owners get different ranges, they cite the same statistic:
basically, just a few pennies a mile.
Of course, for many car enthusiasts, the bottom line is
performance. On a gorgeous summer day, as Mr. Westphal tooled
around the tree-lined streets near his home, his Sentra exhibited
all the gusto of a gasoline-powered car, yet with the quiet hum
of a golf cart. Highway driving? "No problem," he said, as he
took the Interstate ramp and inched the speedometer up to 65
m.p.h.
The only quirk, he said, was that because his car is an automatic
transmission, he has to press the accelerator just a bit at a
dead stop, building up pressure in the transmission for half a
second before engaging the motor. "Hear that?" he asked as he
lightly tapped the pedal and a slight whining noise indicated
that the transmission was primed.
"Now we're ready to go," he said, as the light he was stopped at
turned green. "Now we can drag race."
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Four Internet ZAP EV sales "sight unseen")
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/050902/25457.html?.v=1 Hurricane Katrina,
Record Gas Prices Spark ZAP Electric Car Sales
Friday September 2, 3:44 pm ET
SANTA ROSA, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Sept. 2,
2005--Transportation pioneer ZAP announced today that sales for
its electric cars have picked up recently due to concerns over
record oil, gas prices.
Hurricane Katrina has been blamed for an abrupt spike in oil and
gas prices with prices rising over $3 in many parts of the
country. Media reports say that the recent hurricane has
disrupted oil production along the Gulf Coast, halting business
operations for a number of oil suppliers to the region. This
morning's edition of USA Today reported that some gas stations
have closed while others are charging more than $6 per gallon for
gas. Consumers across the country are feeling the affects as
well.
ZAP says it has sold four electric cars "sight unseen" over the
Internet on Thursday and thousands of people have already joined
a list of prospective electric car buyers.
"We have had thousands of people calling and emailing us in the
past few months," said ZAP CEO Steve Schneider. "The economics of
oil is becoming an issue for average consumers and when you look
at the cost of plugging in versus pumping gas, it makes a lot of
sense."
Gas cars use about 12 cents worth of fuel for every mile, whereas
electric cars use only 3 cents worth. That means an electric car
can travel four times as far as a gasoline car for the same
money. Other ZAP vehicles, like its electric bicycles, use about
a penny's worth of energy for every five miles and achieve an
average fuel efficiency of more than 1,000 miles per gallon.
ZAP says that driving an electric car is different from
conventional cars, an experience you have to try it to
understand. Once people add an electric car to their family, he
says that most people prefer to use the electric car over their
other cars. ZAP cited a recent study of electric car use in
California that shows when given the choice between an electric
car and a conventional automobile, owners chose the electric 90
percent of the time for their trips. The cars can be plugged into
any regular 110-volt outlet to be recharged.
Electric vehicles are available directly from ZAP and start as
low as $300 for an electric bike or scooter and $5,000 for an
electric car. Furthermore, ZAP has offered free shipping on its
electric cars when purchased during the month of September. ZAP
is also recruiting auto dealers who are interested in catering to
fuel-efficient car buyers. For more information, go to
www.zapworld.com or call ZAP Sales at (707) 525-8658.
About ZAP
ZAP, Zero Air Pollution®, has been a leader in advanced
transportation technologies since 1994, delivering over 90,000
vehicles to consumers in more than 75 countries. For more
information, visit http://www.zapworld.com.
Cautionary Statement This press release contains forward-looking
statements.[...] ZAP Alex Campbell, 707-525-8658 ext. 241 (Media
Relations) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Steven Kim, 707-525-8658 ext.
298 (Investor Relations) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Source: ZAP
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
______________________________________________________
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nice write up Doug.
best regards,
Stefano
On 9/7/05, Noel P. Luneau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Way to go Doug!
>
> For those of you Windows or Mac based PC's that can view pictures, video
> and even that new-fangled .html here is Doug's article:
> http://www.canada.com/montreal/montrealgazette/news/montreal/story.html?
> id=023c0dc6-e42c-4094-b125-c38bddb71575
>
> For those with *nix - oh well... :)
>
> Go Canada!
>
> Noel
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Doug Hartley
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 8:59 PM
> > To: Alain St-Yves
> > Cc: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> > Subject: Montreal Gazette article today, Sept. 6
> >
> > Hi Alain,
> >
> > A man walking his dog flagged me down on Lakeshore road
> > Thursday morning while I was on my way to work in the Skoda
> > hatchback. It turns out he was David Yates who writes for
> > the Gazette. He wanted to do a story related to my electric
> > car and the high price of gasoline (which was about to reach
> > a high of $1.47/liter that day). He came to the house Friday
> > night, just after the Gazette photographer, Gordon, who
> > arrived in a Smart car. The article appeared in this
> > morning's Gazette and it prompted a call from CJAD radio for
> > a live interview over the phone.
> >
> > The article was headlined "Motorist gets a charge out of
> > ignoring gas pumps" The well composed picture included my 8
> > year-old daughter Melissa on her electric 3-wheel scooter as
> > well as me beside the open hood of the hatchback, with the
> > nose of the Prius and the Skoda pickup behind. The article
> > (unfortunately not online on the Gazette site) starts:
> > "Douglas Hartley is the envy of a lot of motorists these
> > days. His daily commute to work - a round trip of 25
> > kilometers - costs him a paltry 50 cents, thanks to the
> > electric car he bought three years ago." The article
> > finished with many of the links I had provided:
> > www.evworld.com <http://www.evworld.com>, video documentary: The End of
> Suburbia
> > available from www.globaloutlook.ca <http://www.globaloutlook.ca>,
> www.after-oil.co.uk <http://www.after-oil.co.uk>,
> > www.vehiclevert.org <http://www.vehiclevert.org>, and the EVDL.
> >
> > Overall, I think it was some good exposure for EVs at a time
> > when many people are receptive.
> >
> > Best Regards,
> >
> > Doug
> >
> >
>
>
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At 12:09 PM 9/7/2005, Lee Hart wrote:
But I was thinking of something much smaller. A CitiCar done right. Not
"luxurious", but good by today's standards. Try to avoid high-priced
automotive parts, and look at trailers, golf carts, and other more
economical vehicles for parts sources.
i.e. more like a Geo Metro?
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Rush (and all)
At 07:20 AM 7/09/05 -0700, Rush wrote:
I was wondering if you thought of using PVC piping? It would be much
easier to fabricate, for the dia of the motor you could use a large dia
tube and heat it to fit.
As someone who has a MIG welder and has practice at using it, the thoughts
of plastic lasted about 5 seconds. If I had made the brush band and blower
ports from PVC or other plastic piping it would have ended up heavier by
the time I would have been satisfied it would be unlikely to break. It is
fairly heavy, but I am comfortable in using the ports as handles to pick up
the motor with....
Just a thought from the land of right side up, and where we drive on the
'right' side of the road.... ;-)
Aah, but you drive the car from the other side to the 'right' side :'P
Regards
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
unsubscribe
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jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Mark is a long time EVer and probably selling it because he has too many EV's.
If one wants a good 3 wheel EV, this is an excellent way to get one
without all the work. Hell, in 2-3 yrs you would probably save enough gas to
pay for it.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
That's EV3PO!
the EV3PO site - http://home.austin.rr.com/ev3po/ -
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED],
> A Doran three wheeler listed on ebay at
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/3-Wheel-Doran-Electric-Car-Vehicle-
> Automobile_W0QQitemZ4573675429QQcategoryZ6472QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
>
> worth a look see.
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don Cameron wrote:
>> He also said the whole lot is going to be sold today or tomorrow...
David Roden wrote:
> Actually, these motors will probably go to waste, which is a real
> shame. If there were a proven market for these motors, and if
> there were enough of them, it might be possible to design or adapt
> an inverter for them. But I suspect the quantity is too small and
> the market too specialized to make that worthwhile.
That's the drawback of "the auto company way" of doing things. You can
wind up with parts that are so specialized that they are nearly useless
for any other applications. It doesn't help that full specifications
aren't available, either. Lack of specs makes it even harder for someone
to engineer a way to use them.
The sad fact is that there is no real reason why an AC motor "has" to be
matched to its inverter, any more than a series DC motor has to be
matched to its PWM controller. First, the inverters are programmable;
they could be reprogrammed for a different motor if you had the specs
and the necessary software. Second, the inverters are smart enough that
they could learn the motor's characteristics and adapt to it themselves
(I have an Aerovironment inverter that does this). Third, even if you
don't match them precisely, the inverter should be designed to still
work with only a slight loss of efficiency and performamce.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Brian Staffanson wrote:
> So any alternator will deliver the rated current at other voltages?
Yes!
> What is the maximum voltage you can get from an alternator, and
> still have the rated current? Does it depend only on how fast it
> is spinning?
The output current is defined (and limited) by the wire size it is wound
with, and the current rating of the diodes. Exceed the current rating,
and it gets very hot -- hot enough to die soon. (Even rated current is
optimistic; it assumes really good airflow and a low ambient air
temperature -- neither of these true under the hood of an ICE).
Volts = K x rpm x FieldCurrent where K is some constant for any given
alternator. Thus to double the voltage, you have to either double the
rpm or double the field current.
You can only increase the field current to whatver you get with a full
12v applied to it. Increasing it beyond this point does raise the
voltage further, but will also overheat the field winding and burn it
out. So you can only do this briefly.
RPM: Alternators are built to work at speeds in excess of 12,000 rpm.
With 12v on the field, this will easily produce 100-200 volts output.
The risk is that the diodes or some other weak spot in the insulation
will fail. They only build and test it for about 50 volts. So anything
over 50 volts depends on luck or installing better diodes and extra
insulation.
> Would it be better to get a zener diode to regulate the voltage?
The regulators do use a zener diode. But it is used with a power
transistor to control the field current.
> Doesnt the alternator just produce AC, and there is a regulator
> that changes it to DC?
Correct. It's a "rectifier" that converts AC into DC. There are six
diodes inside the alternator to do this.
> does the speed affect frequency? Or amplitude?
Yes, and yes. Doubling the speed doubles the voltage *and* frequency.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nick Austin wrote:
> I would say that a factory EV with a NiMH pack is really the only
> way to buy an EV that will go 100+ miles. I'm not sure if I've
> ever seen a conversion that will get even close to this kind of
> range for sale.
Doing it with a conversion is hard, because conventional cars weren't
designed to be EVs. But there are lots of examples of vehicles designed
to be EVs from the ground up that can do it -- even with plain old
lead-acid batteries.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dave Cover wrote:
> So, I have one of the standard ADC motors with the external
> connection between field and armature. Could I remove the
> external jumper and hook up a sepex controller to get regen?
>
> Is it that simple or are there other design considerations for the motor?
Yes, but you would need a sepex control that can drive 100s of amps into
the series field. Normal sepex controllers can't do that; they are
limited to 10 amps or so of field current. With only 10 amps, the
armature voltage would be too low to charge anything more than a
low-voltage pack.
A better way would be to have the field rewound as a shunt instead of
series winding. That means lots of turns of smaller wire, to fill the
space formerly occupied by the series field (a few turns of heavy wire).
If you did this, then a sepex controller would work.
However, the motor still has no interpoles or compensating windings.
This will limit the max voltage you get during regen before arcing gets
too bad.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark Hanson wrote:
> Do you get the same regen on a shunt motor down to low speeds with
> a PWM control on the armature and a constant voltage on the field?
You probably know this already. ArmatureVoltage = K x RPM x
FieldStrength (where K is a constant for any given motor). As the rpm
drops, the armature voltage drops, so you need more field current. At
some point, you can't get the field current any higher without burning
it up or running out of voltage to drive the field.
> I have a 72V shunt motor and was going to hook up the field directly
> and PWM the arm.
That works. You just have a fixed field current, so it will behave like
a PM motor. ArmatureVoltage = K x rpm
> I assume this is how the Curtis shunt control does it but I'll put
> a scope on it and see if they're PWMing the field also.
I'm not sure, but I think the Curtis 1221R uses the PWM to drive just
the field, and routes the armature to the battery thru a diode.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tim wrote:
> What would an ~90% efficient Etek/Lemco style, direct drive, PM motor
> do during regen for % efficiency?
The efficiency is basically the same whether used as a motor or a
generator.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Lee and All,
Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Andrea Bachus Kohler wrote:
> Great idea, Lee. What would your target selling price be?
I'm just an engineer. I can design it; but have no idea how it would be
sold or for how much. But materials-wise, it's going to be *lot* less
than any normal car; more like the cost of a golfcar / NEV.
What I'm thinking of is a wood/composite body and frame, very much like
Jerry Dycus is doing with his Freedom EV, but in a 4-wheel version. The
If wanting a quick, inexpensive, my E woody would be a better model.
trick to get around the regulatory hassles for a new automobile is to
buy a Citicar to get your title, and "restore" it so essentially nothing
is left but the title :-)
Getting it titled built from scratch isn't that hard most areas, you
just need ALL the reciepts for ALL the parts then have lights, horn, brakes and
go 40-45mph to be a car. Call your local DOT for your local regs but in most
states, it's not that hard for an EV.
Though I could see a body kit that you just put say a GC transaxle
and a bug or other front end on gets around all the regs too. Or for more
power, use any live axle from a rear drive small car, truck and DD or belt a
surplus, used forklift or other motor to it.
My latest trike with a GC motor uses the stock GC contact controller
for speed shifting and a contactor for go with reverse for backup power off
along with the GC controller wiper switch.
Or make up a series/parallel, resistor contactor controller..
> Would you use flooded golf cart batteries?
Yes, for economy. This won't be a high-speed, high-current vehicle, so
they are fine.
> Would you use a boat anchor Lester charger or a new high frequency one?
If it's a 36v or 48v system, there are lots of options. It opens the
door to a wide range of golf cart and telecom chargers and products.
They are mass produced, widely available, and cheap.
There is no reason EV's must be expensive. I built the E woody
including new GC batts for about $800. Thanks to it's lightweight and with a
better aero body shape, you could do quite well at a very low cost. As GC
transaxle go for about $100 it shouldn't cost any more than my 3wheeler to go 4
wheels.
While not a freeway EV, it would be great around town at 45mph or so.
With a 3.5hp transaxle or another GC hop up motor now available, no reason it
wouldn't hit 60 mph with good range.
KIS,
Jerry Dycus
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
---------------------------------
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks Rod, After 24 years of building these motors, you guys have brought back
in me a zeal that I have not felt for years. Even after opening my own shop it
just became the same old thing in short time. Matt has a fire so big under him
to get a car going it's funny. Since meeting Mr. Wayland we have been keeping
our eyes out for a light car to convert. As it happened we ran into a 1972
Datson 1200 fastback that Matt now has at his house and the stripping of the
car will begin as soon as we get our camera which we will be getting
tonight,lol.
We have much to learn but if all goes as planned with a little help we will
have a Hi-Torque car by Woodburn next year. On another note have you had time
to pull the front motor on GP yet? Keep me posted as to when and how youd like
to get it down to me. And you know what? How sick is it that you guys are my
candy,
PS: I got the twins back and will be getting the next post out asap on the
findings...
Cya soon
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Jim, it was great meeting you in person. You are like a kid in a candy
store. Your enthusiasm for the sport is infectious and brings much
excitement to electric drag racing. Welcome aboard as one of the newest
ampheads on the block. I can't wait to see what kind of racer you will build
yourself!
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Husted"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2005 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: IT'S ALL GOOD / Siamese up-date
> Matt and I were splitting a gut this morning as we posted the post. The
> funnest part of my video is not Bob and or Matt statements but that of
> Wayland saying and I quoate " NO,NO,NO, thats OKAY, let him go" It still
> makes me chuckle. He says it in what sounds like less than one second,
> and if you listen close you can hear the drool splatter shortly
> after,lmao.
>
> John just called and he is now heading over the mountain with his motor
> and we should be able to perform a zourchindectimee before we leave today.
> Can't tell you how much fun it has been to have been part of what Matt and
> I call "the Zourch seen round the world" but it does somehow feel a little
> like getting caught in your underwear while checking your mail. I'd like
> to give credit to whoever coined the phrase Zourched as it is now a common
> word here at Hi-Torque. You guys have changed my world and I thank each
> and every one of you
> Cya
> Jim Husted
>
> Mark Farver wrote:
> Christopher Robison wrote:
>
>>Credit where credit is due, Matt's voice is clear in that shot because he
>>
>>
>
> Actually.. I think everyone is right. Its clearly Bob Rice saying
> "that's not good" in John's video.. but in Chris's its someone else
> (presumably Matt).
>
> Mark Farver
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.19/92 - Release Date: 9/7/2005
>
>
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.19/92 - Release Date: 9/7/2005
---------------------------------
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--- Begin Message ---
You should just build a tubeframe, ev racecar. It's not that hard to build a
car, just lots of little details. Are these cars running just one gear or is
there some gear shifting going on ?
Thanks
ray
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Husted" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2005 8:17 PM
Subject: Re: IT'S ALL GOOD / Siamese up-date
> Thanks Rod, After 24 years of building these motors, you guys have brought
back in me a zeal that I have not felt for years. Even after opening my own
shop it just became the same old thing in short time. Matt has a fire so
big under him to get a car going it's funny. Since meeting Mr. Wayland we
have been keeping our eyes out for a light car to convert. As it happened
we ran into a 1972 Datson 1200 fastback that Matt now has at his house and
the stripping of the car will begin as soon as we get our camera which we
will be getting tonight,lol.
> We have much to learn but if all goes as planned with a little help we
will have a Hi-Torque car by Woodburn next year. On another note have you
had time to pull the front motor on GP yet? Keep me posted as to when and
how youd like to get it down to me. And you know what? How sick is it that
you guys are my candy,
> PS: I got the twins back and will be getting the next post out asap on
the findings...
> Cya soon
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
> Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Jim, it was great meeting you in person. You are like a kid in a candy
> store. Your enthusiasm for the sport is infectious and brings much
> excitement to electric drag racing. Welcome aboard as one of the newest
> ampheads on the block. I can't wait to see what kind of racer you will
build
> yourself!
>
> Roderick Wilde
> "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> www.suckamps.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Husted"
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2005 12:11 PM
> Subject: Re: IT'S ALL GOOD / Siamese up-date
>
>
> > Matt and I were splitting a gut this morning as we posted the post. The
> > funnest part of my video is not Bob and or Matt statements but that of
> > Wayland saying and I quoate " NO,NO,NO, thats OKAY, let him go" It still
> > makes me chuckle. He says it in what sounds like less than one second,
> > and if you listen close you can hear the drool splatter shortly
> > after,lmao.
> >
> > John just called and he is now heading over the mountain with his motor
> > and we should be able to perform a zourchindectimee before we leave
today.
> > Can't tell you how much fun it has been to have been part of what Matt
and
> > I call "the Zourch seen round the world" but it does somehow feel a
little
> > like getting caught in your underwear while checking your mail. I'd like
> > to give credit to whoever coined the phrase Zourched as it is now a
common
> > word here at Hi-Torque. You guys have changed my world and I thank each
> > and every one of you
> > Cya
> > Jim Husted
> >
> > Mark Farver wrote:
> > Christopher Robison wrote:
> >
> >>Credit where credit is due, Matt's voice is clear in that shot because
he
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Actually.. I think everyone is right. Its clearly Bob Rice saying
> > "that's not good" in John's video.. but in Chris's its someone else
> > (presumably Matt).
> >
> > Mark Farver
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.19/92 - Release Date: 9/7/2005
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.19/92 - Release Date: 9/7/2005
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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>
>
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