EV Digest 5684
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Tesla Motors unveiled
by "ProEV" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: "Hybrid" Mass Transit (long)
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Tesla Motors unveiled (my comments)
by "ProEV" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Tesla Motors unveiled (my comments)
by "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: FAQ - batteries
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: Australian 'Dateline' to Film Electric Drag Racing in Portland at
Wayland Invitational II
by "Tim Ireland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Curtis DC to DC fuse
by "fortunat mueller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Electric Metro project on eBay
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: When you skin a Saturn
by "Peter Shabino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Clutchless S10
by Paul Wallace <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Clutchless S10
by Christopher Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: Curtis DC to DC fuse
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Tesla Motors Performance Comparision
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Electric Metro project on eBay
by Christopher Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: "Hybrid" Mass Transit (long)
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) re: SAFT NiCds
by Nick Carter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) RE: Curtis DC to DC fuse
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Contactors not working. Bad Resistor.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Carrier companies
by Steve Condie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Electric Metro project on eBay
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: [seva] Last minute NEDRA EVent this Friday 7/28/06
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: Carrier companies
by "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) EVLocomotive
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) NEDRA Wayland Invitational II at Portland International Raceway 7/28/06
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: Curtis DC to DC fuse
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Volt meter leakage current (is it possible ?)
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) RE: Carrier companies
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Tesla Motors unveiled (my comments)
by "Jorg Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Dave,
Thanks for the reply.
There's a longish conversation on elisetalk.com.
The weight of the car is mentioned in:
http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/news/mechanical-resonance-the-tesla-motors-press-intro-complete-with-governator-188590.php
[2500lbs, hoping to save 100lbs]
I believe, from the range, that we're talking about a 50kwh pack,
and that the weight of the pack is somewhere between 900 and 1000 lbs.
(I've heard both 900lbs and 450kg). I bet your pack is denser than
theirs. Presumably theirs is cheaper, though. ;^/
On the EV1 list, I heard about the same numbers. An attendee of the intro
wrote:
<Back to Tesla. The weight of the Black car is supposedly 2500. 2600
pounds
was reported elsewhere. The goal is get weight down to 2400. Since this
was a pilot production car, it's not clear how that's going to happen. The
weight distribution is 40% front, 60% rear, no power steering.>
<Snip>
<The battery box/pack is a very interesting/unique design. Tesla lists the
pack as 375 Volt, 152 Amp hour, 56.9 KW hour. The pack is a box behind the
seats with its CG a bit ahead of the rear axle. The box contains 10, what
I would call "boards" - Tesla calls them sheets. It appears that each
sheet has 690 2.2 amp hour 18650 Li-ion cells mounted in/on it. I would
estimate a sheet is 18 by 20 by 3 inches and weighs 80 pounds. The sheets
slide in and out of the box for easy maintenance.>
<It been reported that the roadster contains 6831 18650 cells. That number
doesn't quite make sense. 6831 appears to be a prime number. It may be
misreporting that's gotten repeated. One possibility is that each sheet
contains 68 2.250 amp hours cells and there's about 30 cells used for an
auxiliary "battery". This auxiliary battery may be built into the battery
box to run it. There also may/should be the need for an auxiliary battery
for the car's accessories - not clear what and where that is.>
That is a big pack!
Cliff
www.ProEV.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
How about a team of horses approach.
The puller has like 8 stations you drive along side and press a button
and the magnet slides out on an arm. You drive up to it and connect and
let go of all controls, It then pulls you in to the lane. It would feel
like a lane change. When You are ready to leave, press a button and when
clear you are pushed out into the lane along side and then when you have
the controls, you signal "release" The magnet de-couples and retracts
and you drive by.
What worries me about this whole approach is you are still rolling the
vehicle on the roadway. Flat tires and other mechanical issues can be
dissasterous. Perhaps a wide body train with chargeing stations and a
drive on/off ramps that let you drive thru. Train pulls into station
ramp comes down and green light goes on, pull in to bump stop gate
closes and you plug in and walk above the cars over to the diner car....
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Kert,
How come everyone here keeps forgetting Hybrid Technologies LiX-75 ( a
Mullen GT lithium-ion electric ) ?
It might be because there does not seem to be any pictures of one. My
understanding was that the car was going to be unveiled at the NY auto show,
April 14-23. Yet there were no announcements. Even Hybrid Tech's link is
for, "SCHEDULED TO BE UNVEILED".
Did anyone see this car? Did it ever get built? What about other Hybrid
Technologies products?
Cliff
www.ProEV.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> How come everyone here keeps forgetting Hybrid Technologies LiX-75 ( a
> Mullen GT lithium-ion electric ) ?
>
>
http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/tech-gadget/lix-75-the-worlds-fastest-electric-car
> http://www.hybridtechnologies.com/media.php?mediaID=060212
>
> IIRC, they announced the price of $125K and small volume production of
> a hundred units a year or so, pretty much in the same ballpark as
> Tesla.
>
> -kert
>From the second site: "Availability has not yet been confirmed."
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 23:04:31 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:
>
>Can anyone direct me to a link for a
>FAQ on batteries?
>
http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm#Major%20Battery%20Types
Matt Milliron
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Woooo hooo! Finally we might see some electric racing on the TV here...
and all the people who have heard me raving on about it will say
something like "Hey... He wasn't bull-shittin' me after all!".
Tim, South Australia... Who has most of the Plasmaboy videos and many
others on his hard drive.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mike Willmon
Sent: Monday, 24 July 2006 9:20 AM
To: EV Discussion List
Subject: RE: Australian 'Dateline' to Film Electric Drag Racing in
Portland at Wayland Invitational II
I'm assuming this'll be at PIR? Give us the details when you know them.
I wanna try to get my dad to stop by. They usually make it into
Portland for the weekends, up from Fossil.
Thanks and good luck for a good show.
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of John Wayland
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 3:35 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Australian 'Dateline' to Film Electric Drag Racing in Portland
at Wayland Invitational II
Hello to All,
Roy LeMeur and Rod Wilde have been stirring up the excitement level at
NEDRA lately, and recently, along with yours truly, have been in contact
with the nice folks at Dateline, Australia:
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Parker"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 3:43 AM
> Subject: Re: Dateline at NEDRA Nationals
>
>
> Hi Roderick
>
> I'm wondering if you were able to find out about a drag race before
> the end of August....It would be great if David could film some
> electric drag racers with their cars.
>
> Hi Sarah,
>
> ...Contact John Wayland, [EMAIL PROTECTED] I would bet that he
> could get together a few electric racers for an impromptu race.
>
> Roderick Wilde
> "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> www.suckamps.com
I'm happy to report the film crew is on their way to Portland. David and
crew will meet with Tim and I Thursday evening for dinner where we'll
discuss what they've got in mind. It looks like we'll be racing White
Zombie this Friday night and perhaps Saturday, too. There's not enough
time to tear the rear end down, assess things, get in parts, and get it
put back together before Thursday, so we'll just have to settle for low
12's before the cameras.
I'm working with Crazy Rod, Madman, Father Time, Otmar, Steve and Duane
(12 second drag bike) and others to see if we can have quite a few hot
electrics for them to capture for the show.
See Ya....John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi again,
in hunting around and playing with my voltmeter leakage current (see other
thread), i managed to destroy the output fuse of my DC/Dc converter. I tried
to pull it gently but I guess it was really in there and the ceramic housing
crumbled in my hand. Anyone know where I can get a replacement ? I don't
really know the specs and they aren't in the product sheet I got with the
converter.
It is a Curtis 1400. An older style than most that I see pictured on the
web. I bought it back in 1999, i believe. If i knew the requirements, I
suppose I could just get a fuse from McMaster carr or similar.
thanks for the help
~fortunat
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Unless you take a 200 mile test drive don't believe it. Lawrence
Rhodes.......
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Electric Metro project on eBay
> Wonder what idea is worth $50K in connection with this car:
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300010742859
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Plastic cars are fun. Fiero is the same way. I have all my parts sitting in
a barn right now while I do some body repair / repaint (Dam MN road salt).
Not sure about the saturn but on my Fiero the roof section came off without
pulling the window. Had to pull the trim around the window and there was
some urithane rope that was a PITA to remove under each piller piece.
Later,
Wire
From: Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: EV List <[email protected]>
CC: Sam DiMarco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Greg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
David Lucente <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Brendan D. Miller"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jim Stack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jim Wolfe
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: When you skin a Saturn
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 17:14:01 -0700 (PDT)
An update on the paint job for the Saturn.
So I wasn't going to do this I told myself, but I just started unbolting
panels and they just came off so easily I kept going. The roof is the only
panel on the car that doesn't come off easily (requires glass to be
removed). So I figured it would be done very cleanly if I had the panels
hung up to spray, no jambs to worry about. Plans are to finish the sanding
the first few days of next week, get primer shot on the front bumper, hood
and fenders then next weekend, either Saturday or Sunday, the paint and
clear goes on early in the morning before it gets too hot.
As of right now I'm still fixated on that Electric Lime color. I'm still
debating whether to two tone it or to just make it all green. If everything
goes well I might have it put back together in time for our August 4th
WKTEC premier. Crossing my fingers.
Later,
Ricky
02 Insight
92 Saturn SC2 EV 144 Volt
Glendale, AZ USA
---------------------------------
Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Craig,
I did indeed buy my '91 S10 with the EVA clutchless setup. I even have
all the parts still gathering dust on the shelf in my garage. Bob
Batson worked with me over the course of a couple of years checking out
all the alignment and setup. After the second transmission rebuild, I
decided that the unsupported pilot shaft was not a good idea for a Borg
Warner T5 transmission. The transmission folks agreed with this, saying
that the front bearing of a non world class T5 is not heavy enough to
support the shaft without transmitting any run out into the
transmission. The front bearing doesn't fail outright, the internal
bearings between the input shaft and the next shaft in line take a real
beating. I swtitched to an EVCC setup with clutch parts from the junk
yard. It works great, as long as you get a good clutch, like Clutchnet.
I just had the first clutch replaced with a kevlar friction disk. The
shop even took out the original EVCC pilot bushing and replaced it with
a pilot bearing, after a little machining to make it fit. Thanks EVCC
for making the pilot bushing hole a non standard size. This doesn't
mean that the transmission is quiet. Far from it. If I ever get around
to it, I'll have the transmission rebuilt one more time using as many
world class bearings and other parts as will fit. I'll also have the
useless 5th gear removed and all the synchros replaced with heavy duty
types. I don't think that the stock version of these transmissions like
having the input shaft turning at 4k rpm all the time.
I'm also running synthetic ATF in my transmission. Seems to give better
all temperature viscosity, cutting losses in the transmission.
I think that it is difficult to get the clutch to run true with no
vibration all the time. I've noticed that sometimes I get a little
vibration and that if I simply depress the clutch and then let it up
again, the vibration will deminish or go away entirely. I surmise that
the friction disk may settle a little off center, due to the clearance
in the splines. Once I have the motor turning at the desired 4k rpm,
disengaging the clutch allows the disk to center up better. I don't
know this as fact, just my idle throughts on the subject. If I spin the
motor up with the clutch disengaged, there is very little vibration, or
noise. Even in neutral, the transmission sounds like a rock crusher.
Of course the torque reaction straps that tie the transmission to the
front lower A arm bolts are transmitting a lot of gear lash noise to the
truck frame. You need the straps, or some sort of torque reaction arm.
The single back transmission mount, and I replaced mine with a racing
poly type, won't keep the transmission from rocking around at start up,
particularly if you aren't using a clutch. The motor clam shell mount
to the original motor mounts can't react any torque at all. In fact, it
will allow the motor to twist no matter how tight you think you have the
motor captured. Over time, the shift lever will start to drift off to
one side. It will also jerk violently when you get sudden high torque
demands from the motor.
Paul Wallace
'91 Chevy S10 full of SAFT nicads
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Let us know if there are people with more experience - I am
running my US Electricar with one string as the only difference
to other trucks, I do not have BMS or thermal management so the
only difference is the one vs 2 strings. Time will tell...
Ok, when I drop the Prizm pack in September, I promise I will install a
second shunt and monitor the two packs with a pair of E-meters. I really
want to see for myself if this whole parallel string thing is true; I
found on the Elec-trak that although current draw on three strings of
flooded NiCDs do wander a bit, over time they balance out pretty well.
So far the Prizm is holding up *very* well with the regs, considering
that the batteries were basket cases beforehand. I wonder if I'll get
10k miles out of the pack; Alex is putting 50 miles a day on the car.
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
fortunat mueller wrote:
> i managed to destroy the output fuse of my DC/Dc
> converter. I tried to pull it gently but I guess it
> was really in there and the ceramic housing crumbled
> in my hand.
I find that if you pry one end of the fuse out of the holder/clip with a
screwdriver rather than trying to pull on the ceramic body you are much
less likely to damage the fuse.
> It is a Curtis 1400. An older style than most that I see
> pictured on the web. I bought it back in 1999, i believe.
> If i knew the requirements, I suppose I could just get a
> fuse from McMaster carr or similar.
Not sure if your unit is similar, but the 1400's I have on hand all
identify the fuse required on the label on the opposite end of the DC/DC
itself. Some even have a sticker on the plastic cover over the fuse &
connections.
Assuming it is a 300W model, the fuse is a 12A 250V slow blow type,
"TT12A". The particular part used is a Littelfuse 326 series fuse (p/n
326 012). If you can't find one locally, Digikey caries Littelfuse
parts, though I don't know about this particular one.
I'm not sure why Curtis uses this particular part, since the Littelfuse
datasheet doesn't show it as DC rated despite the ceramic body. I think
the key here is to use a 12A slow blow fuse, but if you can find one
rated for 125VDC or better it might be a useful upgrade.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You hit the nail on the head. I have not been in White
Zombie.... yet. (hint hint)
Gadget
Hello to All,
About the Tesla electric sports car, Reverend Gadget
wrote:
>The car is fast. Not Gone Postal fast but fast
>none the less.
Bob Rice responded:
>Comments; What do ya mean "not Gone Postal" fast?
Hell, Teslamobile
>would be White Zombie fast, run rings around GP.
>
Then this, from Mike Willmon:
>Yes but take Plasma Boy's White Zombie that will do
0-60 in that time
and duplicate it.
>
Thanks Bob and Mike. Yeah, I thought it was funny that
the Rev. left
White Zombie out of his comparison, too. Maybe it's
because the Rev.
has
never seen White Zombie in person and thus has never
ridden in it or
seen it eat muscle cars for lunch. Perhaps he's also
not seen the
videos
at the Plasma Boy web site. I do think he's been
around GP however, and
he might have also gone for a ride in it. The
instantaneous lunge from
the butt loads of torque coming from twin 8s and a
single 9 with 40
powerful Exide Orbitals making the juice in Gone
Postal, has gotta feel
like a freight train has slammed into your backside!
Sob....though I've
been in, under, and all around GP, I've never had a
ride :-(
visit my websites at www.reverendgadget.com, gadgetsworld.org,
leftcoastconversions.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Wonder what idea is worth $50K in connection with this car:
Windmill on the roof and an alternator on each wheel.
Seriously: That seems to be a small motor for that car, correct? Still
it is kind of sad and cute. I'd take it under my wing...
But now I have a *TRUCK*! A great BIG ELECTRIC POWERED TRUCK! Bigger
than an SUV, lots o torque!
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 06:53 AM 7/24/2006, Lee Hart wrote:
Rick Woodbury's "Tango" EV is only 3 feet wide and 8 feet long --
that offers another possibility. You could have flatbed trailers or
train cars, with ramps on the sides for Tangos to drive on/off.
Drive your car to the bus/train stop. Truck/train pulls in. You
drive onto the next available parking spot. Truck/train pulls out,
goes to the next stop. If it's your stop, you drive off.
Now you have a way to commute, and take your car with you!
That is EXACTLY the idea some group is pushing. (Don't remember who
right now.) The guy was at a SEVA meeting a few months ago.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Last quote I received (just this month) for SAFT
liquid-cooled NiCds...
STM5-100MRE batteries $451.00 ea.
That was based on their use in an existing approved design,
ie our Solectria Force.
Price break at 1,000 modules.
Nick
Dr Nick Carter,
Owner, npc Imaging, 2228 Magowan Drive, Santa Rosa, CA 95405 USA
[EMAIL PROTECTED] www.npcimaging.com Tel/fax: +1 (707) 573 9361
President, North Bay Electric Auto Association
Solectria EV owner. "Spare the air every day - drive electric!"
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***************************************************************
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It seems unlikely to me that a 12A fuse can be used on
the _output_ of a 300W DC/DC as 12V should result in at least 25A
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Roger Stockton
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 9:47 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Curtis DC to DC fuse
fortunat mueller wrote:
> i managed to destroy the output fuse of my DC/Dc
> converter. I tried to pull it gently but I guess it
> was really in there and the ceramic housing crumbled
> in my hand.
I find that if you pry one end of the fuse out of the holder/clip with a
screwdriver rather than trying to pull on the ceramic body you are much
less likely to damage the fuse.
> It is a Curtis 1400. An older style than most that I see
> pictured on the web. I bought it back in 1999, i believe.
> If i knew the requirements, I suppose I could just get a
> fuse from McMaster carr or similar.
Not sure if your unit is similar, but the 1400's I have on hand all
identify the fuse required on the label on the opposite end of the DC/DC
itself. Some even have a sticker on the plastic cover over the fuse &
connections.
Assuming it is a 300W model, the fuse is a 12A 250V slow blow type,
"TT12A". The particular part used is a Littelfuse 326 series fuse (p/n
326 012). If you can't find one locally, Digikey caries Littelfuse
parts, though I don't know about this particular one.
I'm not sure why Curtis uses this particular part, since the Littelfuse
datasheet doesn't show it as DC rated despite the ceramic body. I think
the key here is to use a 12A slow blow fuse, but if you can find one
rated for 125VDC or better it might be a useful upgrade.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I fixed this problem almost immediately. Seems the two Curtis/Albright
contactors in the Aspire wouldn't close. The 12volt system drew down to
4.5vdc. Hot 12v supply lines. I disconnected one contactor and the other
one worked. I tried to connect the other and the supply drew down again and
that contactor wouldn't close. The 12v spark arresting resistor was warm.
I tried to take it off and it cracked in half. The leftovers just crumbled
in my fingers. Could someone tell me the value of the Curtis/Albright
120vdc Contactor 12v system resistor? After the resistor broke the
contactor worked but I don't want to burn the 12v contacts. The orginal
resistor lasted 5 years. Is there a replacement that might do better and
not crumble after a few years use? Lawrence Rhodes......
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I recommend that you DO NOT use A-1 Auto transport.
"Dr. Polsinelli" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I've bought an electric vehicle
that needs to be transported across
country. Anyone have a recommendation for a good car transport company?
Thanks
~Michael
---------------------------------
Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to
Yahoo! Groups.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 08:13 AM 7/24/2006, you wrote:
Unless you take a 200 mile test drive don't believe it. Lawrence
Rhodes.......
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 5:18 PM
Subject: Electric Metro project on eBay
> Wonder what idea is worth $50K in connection with this car:
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300010742859
That mess will be lucky to move 200 FEET.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roy I will be there with Goldie.
I need to work like a Dog this week to get product shipped.
But I will have Goldie in Tire burning mode for sure.
Maybe not the Best ET But tire burning for sure.
So who else will make a good showing at PIR??
Come on We needs some fast EVs!!
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
AkA Madman
> I'm happy to report the film crew is on their way to Portland. David and
> crew will meet with Tim and I Thursday evening for dinner where we'll
> discuss what they've got in mind. It looks like we'll be racing White
> Zombie this Friday night and perhaps Saturday, too.
> There's not enough time to tear the rear end down, assess things, get in
> parts, and get it put back together before Thursday, so we'll just have
> to settle for low 12's before the cameras.
>
> I'm working with Crazy Rod, Madman, Father Time, Otmar, Steve and Duane
> (12 second drag bike) and others to see if we can have quite a few hot
> electrics for them to capture for the show.
>
> See Ya....John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> I recommend that you DO NOT use A-1 Auto transport.
Ditto for AAAT (All American Auto Transport).
But then, I have a problem with most of the transport industry as most of
them are middlemen who do not necessarily do the hauling themselves, in fact
putting your vehicle's hauling out to the lowest bidder as soon as you
contract with them.
It's quite disparaging.
In my experience with AAAT, I agreed to pay them a premium for hauling my
electric in a sealed hauler in the dead of winter for quick delivery and
they said the vehicle would be insured to $50,000. They assured me that
they can't guarantee who'd haul my vehicle, the likelihood was that they
would use one of their own vehicles and that it wouldn't be offloaded even
once at an intermediate transfer station (which is very common). While I
believe they did avoid transfer stations, it's only lucky. They indeed DID
farm out the hauling to another hauler (hog haulers of Clackamas, Or.,
specializing in hauling motorbikes). Hog haulers were fine, quick and
professional. In the end, my car was delivered about a week late and by a
different hauler, yet I paid a premium to have ontime delivery and not to be
paying thru a broker to a low bidder. I never did get shown any proof that
the item was insured while being hauled, being told only that "all our
haulers are insured". The vehicle arrived just fine nevertheless, and I at
least had that to thank as well as the knowing that the bulk of the money I
paid went to a local hauler.
A lot of these hauler brokers seem to be based in Florida and have only
POBoxes...must be lenient laws there. Search the web for testimonials about
haulers----there's a site for hauler testimonials/feedback, but I forget
what it's called.
-Myles Twete, Portland, Or.
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--- Begin Message ---
A "CarBus" is interesting idea and very easily done today as it requires
nothing special from the car, it can be anything. The problem I see is
it would be inefficient, it would add a lot of extra weight to transport
the cars. And the car would not get recharged automatically. And
someone would have to drive the CarBus adding to the operating cost.
I'll dub my idea the "EVLocomotive", and was thinking heck if we can
detach cars while underway, we can attach them too, so basically get on
the freeway under your own power, and find a group to attach with.
The group leader doing the driving being pushed would define the last
stop for the group, as he would park the EVL at the freeway
onramp/staging area after he exits.
In the case of mechnical breakdownI would think it much safer to have
such a problem while locked into a formation, the car would not spin out
of control, but he held in place as the group comes to a controlled stop.
Jack
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi Folks
This is somewhat short notice, but that's the way things sometimes go with
racing.
This is an officially sanctioned NEDRA Event.
A film crew from Australia's version of PBS (SBS TV, Sydney
www.sbs.com.au/dateline) will be there to document this EVent coming Friday
night 7/28/06 6pm to 12am at Portland International Raceway-
www.portlandraceway.com
Admission -
$8/Adults, $5/Children All Racers $22
Plus... all the local media we can manage to get there.
The list of competitors planning to attend so far are...
John Wayland - White Zombie
Otmar Ebenhoech - California Poppy
Rich Rudman - Goldie
Father Time - Father Time Machines "FrankenDragon" Green Bike
Steve Kiser - Father Time Machines "Dragon Rose" Red Bike
All EVers are welcome to compete or just be there for the cameras.
Some EVs that will be on display are-
Mark Mongillo's Datsun Pickup Truck
Gary Graunke's Honda Insight EV conversion (may actually race)
Plus the usual assortment of bikes and scooters.
Be There!
...
Roy LeMeur
NEDRA NW Regional Race Director
www.nedra.com
My EV and RE Project Pages-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
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--- Begin Message ---
Cor van de Water wrote:
> It seems unlikely to me that a 12A fuse can be used on
> the _output_ of a 300W DC/DC as 12V should result in at least 25A
I appreciate your skepticism, but this *is* the part used and specified
by Curtis for their 300W (22.5A max @ 13.5VDC out) 1400-series DC/DC. I
am not guessing, I have a box of them to refer to, and have stated both
what the factory label says and what I read off the fuses that are
present ;^>
There is only one fuse on the DC/DC, and its been a while since I looked
inside one so I am not going to swear whether it is on the input side or
output side (I can't be bothered to go look at the moment).
If you look at the datasheet for the fuse I stated, you will observe
that it is rated to carry full current for a minimum of 4hrs and a few
100% overload for at least several minutes, which may well be longer
that the DC/DC can actually sustain its max 22.5A output.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
fortunat mueller wrote:
> i thought i did mention it. The voltmeter and DC/DC are both
> connected to the controller side of C1 and the battery side
> of C2, so they both come on with the key
Sorry, I must have missed the reference to the voltmeter; I thought you
were describing the DC/DC connection only.
Arthur wrote:
> > I would recommend never connecting a contactor in the
> > negative side of a circuit.
I think you are correct to install the contactors as they presently are,
so that the pack may be completely isolated from the controller and
motor when the key is off.
I've forgotten which of C1 & C2 is in the battery positive or negative
lead, but if you have the voltmeter connected such that its negative
side is only connected when the key is on (controller side of B-
contactor) and the +ve side is always connected (battery side of B+
contactor), then the voltmeter could act as a weak precharge resistor
for the controller caps if there is any leakage path from controller
negative to battery -ve.
If you measure 0V across the controller side of C1 and C2 with the key
off, then I would agree with Arthur that there is little danger here as
the cap aren't actually precharged. If, however, you do measure a
voltage after the key has been off for a while, then there is sufficient
leakage current that the controller caps are being charged up.
I believe that when the key is on, the precharge relay is always on. If
so, then if the voltmeter is the leakage path, you could move its
positive connection from the battery side of the B+ contactor to the
controller side of the precharge relay.
Assuming the relay connects to B+ on one side and to the precharge
resistor on the other, you would connect the voltmeter +ve side to the
node between the precharge relay and resistor. Now, when the key is
off, both sides of the voltmeter are disconnected from the battery so
there can be no leakage through it. If the precharge relay is beefy
enough, you could move the +ve DC/DC connection similarly to isolate it
when the key is off.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 11:03 AM 7/24/2006, Myles Twete wrote:
> I recommend that you DO NOT use A-1 Auto transport.
Ditto for AAAT (All American Auto Transport).
I had pretty good luck with "Kiwi Carriers" (sp?) out of Port Townsend, WA.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Because no one has seen one?
Because the pictures on the Hybrid Technologies web site are clearly
of a gasoline vehicle, not an electric?
Because the scheduled intro at the NY auto show never happened?
Because their products page for 4-wheel vehicles (
http://www.hybridtechnologies.com/products.php?sec=1 ) doesn't list
the SuperCar?
Because their online store (
http://hybridtechnologies.secure-shops5.com/ ) includes only 2-wheel
vehicles and N-charge batteries?
By contrast, Tesla held a major unveiling where 2 of their cars gave
350 test rides each, with each test ride going from 0-60-0 2 or 3
times. Without refueling.
Unlike the Tango, the Tesla, or the Venturi Fetish, the LiX-75 just
isn't for real.
On 7/24/06, Kaido Kert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
How come everyone here keeps forgetting Hybrid Technologies LiX-75 ( a
Mullen GT lithium-ion electric ) ?
http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/tech-gadget/lix-75-the-worlds-fastest-electric-car
http://www.hybridtechnologies.com/media.php?mediaID=060212
IIRC, they announced the price of $125K and small volume production of
a hundred units a year or so, pretty much in the same ballpark as
Tesla.
-kert
On 7/22/06, Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The Tesla, Venturi Fetish and TZero are not made for the common man. It is
> not intended to be practical.
>
>
> Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
>
> see the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Steve Powers
> Sent: July 21, 2006 6:31 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: Tesla Motors unveiled (my comments)
>
> I read all the posts about the Tesla with mixed emotion. True, it seems
> like a very nice EV, one of the best I have seen. I would go as far as to
> say it is over-designed, 0 - 60 in 4 sec, 250 mile range. Who can honestly
> say that they really need a car like that. And, then I heard about the
> price, which of course I expected to be quite high. In fact, it is. I have
> heard $80k, and even $90k from a different source. Maybe they were trying
> to make a point that a high performance EV can be made. But, we already
> knew that.
>
> At the same time, what they created is a car that to the common man might
> as well be made out of "unobtanium." I'd say 99% of the people on this list
> can't afford that car. I'd say 99.99% of the general population can't
> afford that car, and if they could, they wouldn't buy it. Why not? Those
> people, the ones with the money, are smart business people and they don't
> want a hassle. They want a car backed by a major auto maker. Something
> like a Lexus, Mercedes, BMW ... I truthfully don't see them buying the car.
> There are the select few super rich who are also into the environment or
> unique cars. Those few may buy one. I expect that I will never see one on
> the road in my daily travels. And, I suspect that most of you never will
> either. So, what was gained? Some good publicity, sure. Someone proved a
> point, sure. Did it actually help get the common man any closer to driving
> an EV, no. I have to say no. If anything, it makes people think that EVs
> are super expensive. Still not pratical for the common man, people like
> me.
>
> I've stated before what I think (this is my opinion, so feel free to
> disagree) the common man is looking for, and still no one seems to be
> pursuing that market.
> 1. Late model conversion - doesn't even have to be new
> 2. Sustainable - parts available for at least 10 years
> 3. Reasonable comforts, power brakes, AC
> 4. Automatic - the common man doesn't like to shift - it is true
> 5. Performance similar to a typical 4 cyl car - Corolla / Civic (better
> than a Force)
> 6. Cost - if well reconditioned, about $12 - $18k. Quality of an 8-10
> year old used car - which would be easier to market - $8500 - $10k.
> 7. Battery pack availability in the future and it can't cost a fortune. I
> think as far as the common man goes, Li Ion is out. NiMH is still an
> option. Even decent lead acid is OK.
> 8. As far as battery maintenance goes, the common man doesn't want to
> have to water them.
> 9. The car needs to be smart with a BMS because the common man doesn't
> like hassles.
> 10. Range. A real world range - in real world traffic - with hills and
> stop and go - 80 miles. 80 miles is more than sufficient. If it is a
> parallel hybrid as well, it could have a 25 mile range in EV mode as long as
> it has similar performance in EV and hybrid ICE mode.
> 11. It has to be backed by a major auto manufacturer so that people can
> sleep well at night knowing that someone will be there if it breaks and
> needs repair.
> 12. Options of 2 door or 4 door.
>
> I think the above could be done, and a successful business could be
> created catering to that market.
>
> What do I think will happen long term? Well, I think one of the major
> auto makers will come out with a plug in hybrid dual purpose EV and ICE car.
> I think the car will do at least 25 miles in EV mode and will go 0-60 like
> the current small hybrids. I think it will be freeway capable. I think it
> will be Toyota, and I think it will happen within the next 3 - 5 years. I
> also think the common man will buy that car. I think that like me, he / she
> commutes < 25 miles on work days and can run all electric monday - friday.
> And, I think if he / she needs a little extra range one night or on a
> weekend he or she will go and fuel it up. I think it is pratical and a
> decent approach to clocking some real EV miles. Everyone that I know who
> has an EV also has an ICE car. If you put them in the same chasis, you only
> have to register, insure, store, and maintain one car. I see a real
> advantage to this. Sure, I want all electric cars on the road, I bought 3
> of them you know.
> And, I even started building a 4th. I am an EV guy, don't get me wrong.
> But, to get them on the road, I think we need to take that intermediate
> step. This is my opinion, so feel free to disagree.
>
> In the meantime, I guess I'll just have to keep waiting until someon sells
> their 10 year old conversion with a 80 mile real world range for $8500.
> Trust me, anyone with that car, isn't selling it. And if they were, it
> wouldn't be $8500. I do remember though when you could buy a used Force for
> about $4000 and a Jet Electra for <$1500 and of course my first EV for only
> $600. I paid about $3600 for the ETV-1, not running. But, now that has all
> changed. I guess I'll just have to dream on thinking I can still get that
> dream car for $8500.
>
>
> Still dreaming,
> Steve
>
>
> Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What I saw when putting the pictures of the Lotus Elise 3 and the Tesla
> side by side was that the CHASSIS seems to be identical, but the styling of
> the panels is quite different, so it seems to be "based on" the Elise 3
> (Federal).
> http://www.sandsmuseum.com/cars/elise/pictures/edatabase/viewpicture.php?id=
> 116&image=chassis.jpg&title=chassis&album=laautoshow03
>
> and from the unveiling pictures:
> http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/autoblog/hirezpics/IMG_6894.jpg
> http://www.autoblog.com/2006/07/20/tesla-roadster-unveiling-in-santa-monica/
>
> Some striking details ARE the same, such as the striplights next to the
> wheels on the fenders.
> But the design of the hood, the lines on the side, the scoop, a lot of
> things are different, so it is not really a look-a-like.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX:
> +1-610-423-5743 Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of nikki
> Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 11:07 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Tesla Motors unveiled
>
>
> Apparently the Tesla is actually a Lotus - I have just been listening to the
> BBC radio station in Norfolk and they just mentioned it in the news!
>
> Regards
>
> Nikki
>
>
>
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--- End Message ---
