EV Digest 5969
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Battery boxes
by Storm Connors <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Why electric car companies should be focused on this one ideal EV
market: Hawaii, an' Stuff
by Lock Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Brake lights on regen
by "Rush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Battery boxes
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
by "torich1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Brake lights on regen
by "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) LED brakelights
by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
by "Andrew Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: What is the torque/power rating of a TWIN Warp 9" (or TWIN Warp 8s)
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: LED brakelights
by Ralph <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Wave power
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: How to Verify Timing
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Re: Brake lights on regen
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: Battery boxes
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: LED brakelights
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) List for Porsche 914 conversions.
by "Steve Lacy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: LED brakelights
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: LED brakelights
by "Grigg. John" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Brake lights on regen - solved
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: LED brakelights
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Someone, perhaps Bob Brown, suggested putting steel
straps (packing bands) around the wooden boxes for
strength.
I spent the summer learning to weld and built the
boxes of sixteenth inch sheet metal.
storm
--- Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mike
>
> My battery boxes are made of fiberglass over
> plywood. The primary concerns are carrying the
> weight
> and surviving exposure to the electrolyte. I'm not
> concerned with keeping them warm in the winter
> but the box will be exposed to road salt and dirt. I
> have incorporated venting to remove H2 and
> hopefully supply cooling.
>
> How well will they work? I'll let you know.
>
> Dave Cover
>
> --- Michael Trefry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > What are the function of battery boxes/racks other
> than holding the
> > batteries in place? Why would a box cost over
> $2000? (box and rack set for
> > 914 at electroauto.com)
> >
> >
> >
> > I've seen sites mention making these from steel,
> aluminum, even wood. Why
> > not plastic or fiberglass to reduce weight?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike Trefry
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Bob Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> If the place is environmentally hot as you say, should be easy.
Seen here:
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/geothermal/hawaii.html
"This geothermal power plant provides about 30% of electricity demand
on the Big Island (Puna) of Hawaii."
And I thought nuke and hydro-powered cars were cool - these folks are
part volcano-powered!
:)
Lock
Toronto
Human/Electric Hybrid
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Doug Weathers" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
> Maybe a mercury switch installed at just the right inclination would work.
>
> Mike
>
The right inclination on a level surface is not the right inclination going up
or down a grade...
So your 'inclination' at level will in all likelihood turn on the brake light
when going down a hill and maybe never turn on the brake light when going up a
hill..
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Would it be fair to say where and how to put all the batteries in the
car is the major effort?
> Shari, what is the most difficult and time consuming part of
> converting a car to electric?
I usually tell people it's the layout - where will I put this? Do I
have enough room here for that? If I move this there, then I have to
move that somewhere else. And so on.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This umq web site say they sell thru KTA!
http://www.uqm.com/about/FAQ.html#8
> UQM does not sell through KTA.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of torich1
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 3:19 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>
>
> They say you can buy their product at http://www.kta-ev.com BUT! KTA
makes
> no mention of this product in their catalog....
> Rich Va
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andrew Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 5:08 PM
> Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>
>
> > yeah, just buy 100 of them. LOL.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:33 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> >
> >
> > does anyone know a way to source one at a reasonable price? Seems
> > like a great solution.
> > On Oct 4, 2006, at 12:27 PM, Andrew Roberts wrote:
> >
> > > The batteries are from www.altairnano.com, and you forgot one major
> > > thing
> > > about the UQM motors: they weigh half as much as the Enova (or
> > > solectria or
> > > siemens) systems at the same power level. They're also physically
> > > smaller.
> > > I know that was one of the driving factors in Phoenix's decision to
> > > switch.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Behalf Of Don Cameron
> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 12:22 PM
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Mark, Phoenix has been around for a while and a few years back was
> > > planning on using motor/controllers from Enova. You might want to
> > > ask if
> > > they have delivered any vehicles yet before counting on a vehicle
> > > two years
> > > out. The UQM motors are very interesting as they have big torque
> > > and a wide
> > > power band. I know that in quantities of 10 or so, the price of
> > > the UQM
> > > might drop to about half. Still pretty pricey compared to some of the
> > > motors available today.
> > >
> > > What batteries and how many are they planning on using?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
> > >
> > > see the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> > > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
> > > Sent: October 4, 2006 11:05 AM
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Subject: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> > >
> > > I spoke to an executive at Phoenix Motor Cars who said the target
> > > price for
> > > the SUV with 150-200 mile range would be $45K. The UQM drive
> > > according to my
> > > conversations with them is about $28K with controller, and the
> > > batteries
> > > must be at least $15K, all purchased in one unit quantities. So,
> > > $44k just
> > > in batteries and drive and it will be sold for $1k more as a complete
> > > vehicle. If this can be delivered in a quality package in a year it
> > > will say
> > > much to how fast things are moving. The UQM drives are made to
> > > order in
> > > Colorado and I think the SUV comes from Korea but not positive. I
> > > may just
> > > have to forget my conversion and buy something new in a year or
> > > two, but I
> > > really don't want an SUV! Perhaps the R1 will be available?
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.12/462 - Release Date:
10/3/2006
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.13/463 - Release Date: 10/4/2006
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> The right inclination on a level surface is not the right
inclination going up or down a grade...
>
> So your 'inclination' at level will in all likelihood turn on the
brake light when going down a hill and maybe never turn on the brake
light when going up a hill..
>
>
That's not as bad as you think - going up a hill, you wouldn't need
regen to slow down, going down, you're more likely to be on the brakes
(or regen) anyway!
Some people with automatics seem to drive with both feet, brake light
on even when they are accelerating!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25 amp
Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering) I'm
thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
bulb).
There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have the
cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they have
different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be saving
some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights were
on.
Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is a
7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my system
will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is on at
once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the voltage.
So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at 12 volts(
or even a bit less) .
Thanks
Phil
_________________________________________________________________
Try the new Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM=WLMTAG
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It says that KTA supplies products to EV enthusiasts. KTA supplies
products, but not UQM products.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of torich1
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 11:01 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
This umq web site say they sell thru KTA!
http://www.uqm.com/about/FAQ.html#8
> UQM does not sell through KTA.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of torich1
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 3:19 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>
>
> They say you can buy their product at http://www.kta-ev.com BUT! KTA
makes
> no mention of this product in their catalog....
> Rich Va
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andrew Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 5:08 PM
> Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>
>
> > yeah, just buy 100 of them. LOL.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:33 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> >
> >
> > does anyone know a way to source one at a reasonable price? Seems
> > like a great solution.
> > On Oct 4, 2006, at 12:27 PM, Andrew Roberts wrote:
> >
> > > The batteries are from www.altairnano.com, and you forgot one major
> > > thing
> > > about the UQM motors: they weigh half as much as the Enova (or
> > > solectria or
> > > siemens) systems at the same power level. They're also physically
> > > smaller.
> > > I know that was one of the driving factors in Phoenix's decision to
> > > switch.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Behalf Of Don Cameron
> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 12:22 PM
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Mark, Phoenix has been around for a while and a few years back was
> > > planning on using motor/controllers from Enova. You might want to
> > > ask if
> > > they have delivered any vehicles yet before counting on a vehicle
> > > two years
> > > out. The UQM motors are very interesting as they have big torque
> > > and a wide
> > > power band. I know that in quantities of 10 or so, the price of
> > > the UQM
> > > might drop to about half. Still pretty pricey compared to some of the
> > > motors available today.
> > >
> > > What batteries and how many are they planning on using?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
> > >
> > > see the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> > > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
> > > Sent: October 4, 2006 11:05 AM
> > > To: [email protected]
> > > Subject: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
> > >
> > > I spoke to an executive at Phoenix Motor Cars who said the target
> > > price for
> > > the SUV with 150-200 mile range would be $45K. The UQM drive
> > > according to my
> > > conversations with them is about $28K with controller, and the
> > > batteries
> > > must be at least $15K, all purchased in one unit quantities. So,
> > > $44k just
> > > in batteries and drive and it will be sold for $1k more as a complete
> > > vehicle. If this can be delivered in a quality package in a year it
> > > will say
> > > much to how fast things are moving. The UQM drives are made to
> > > order in
> > > Colorado and I think the SUV comes from Korea but not positive. I
> > > may just
> > > have to forget my conversion and buy something new in a year or
> > > two, but I
> > > really don't want an SUV! Perhaps the R1 will be available?
> > >
> > > Mark
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.12/462 - Release Date:
10/3/2006
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.13/463 - Release Date: 10/4/2006
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Go back and READ it. They say that you can buy EV "products" from KTA, it
doesn't say that you can buy /THEIR/ products.
> This umq web site say they sell thru KTA!
>
> http://www.uqm.com/about/FAQ.html#8
>
>> UQM does not sell through KTA.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Behalf Of torich1
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 3:19 PM
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>>
>>
>> They say you can buy their product at http://www.kta-ev.com BUT! KTA
> makes
>> no mention of this product in their catalog....
>> Rich Va
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Andrew Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: <[email protected]>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 5:08 PM
>> Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>>
>>
>> > yeah, just buy 100 of them. LOL.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
>> > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:33 PM
>> > To: [email protected]
>> > Subject: Re: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>> >
>> >
>> > does anyone know a way to source one at a reasonable price? Seems
>> > like a great solution.
>> > On Oct 4, 2006, at 12:27 PM, Andrew Roberts wrote:
>> >
>> > > The batteries are from www.altairnano.com, and you forgot one major
>> > > thing
>> > > about the UQM motors: they weigh half as much as the Enova (or
>> > > solectria or
>> > > siemens) systems at the same power level. They're also physically
>> > > smaller.
>> > > I know that was one of the driving factors in Phoenix's decision to
>> > > switch.
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > Behalf Of Don Cameron
>> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 12:22 PM
>> > > To: [email protected]
>> > > Subject: RE: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Hi Mark, Phoenix has been around for a while and a few years back
>> was
>> > > planning on using motor/controllers from Enova. You might want to
>> > > ask if
>> > > they have delivered any vehicles yet before counting on a vehicle
>> > > two years
>> > > out. The UQM motors are very interesting as they have big torque
>> > > and a wide
>> > > power band. I know that in quantities of 10 or so, the price of
>> > > the UQM
>> > > might drop to about half. Still pretty pricey compared to some of
>> the
>> > > motors available today.
>> > >
>> > > What batteries and how many are they planning on using?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Don Cameron, Victoria, BC, Canada
>> > >
>> > > see the New Beetle EV project www.cameronsoftware.com/ev
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-
>> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> > > Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
>> > > Sent: October 4, 2006 11:05 AM
>> > > To: [email protected]
>> > > Subject: Phoenix motors/UQM Drive
>> > >
>> > > I spoke to an executive at Phoenix Motor Cars who said the target
>> > > price for
>> > > the SUV with 150-200 mile range would be $45K. The UQM drive
>> > > according to my
>> > > conversations with them is about $28K with controller, and the
>> > > batteries
>> > > must be at least $15K, all purchased in one unit quantities. So,
>> > > $44k just
>> > > in batteries and drive and it will be sold for $1k more as a
>> complete
>> > > vehicle. If this can be delivered in a quality package in a year it
>> > > will say
>> > > much to how fast things are moving. The UQM drives are made to
>> > > order in
>> > > Colorado and I think the SUV comes from Korea but not positive. I
>> > > may just
>> > > have to forget my conversion and buy something new in a year or
>> > > two, but I
>> > > really don't want an SUV! Perhaps the R1 will be available?
>> > >
>> > > Mark
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > No virus found in this incoming message.
>> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> > Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.12/462 - Release Date:
> 10/3/2006
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.13/463 - Release Date:
>> 10/4/2006
>>
>>
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Don
I just called John up being we havent talked in a while. He told me that
although the 8's haven't been dyno tested he believes they fall somewhere in
the 240 HP area. The 772 ft lbs of torque have been calculated and he feels
that's a pretty solid number to quote. Now he also stated that it would be
even higher with a stouter battery pack as even with his current Hawkers he's
battery limited 8^ )
Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>The Warp 8s will do
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+
countries) for 2ยข/min or less.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I run into this all the time with vintage motorbikes.
Goto
http://search.aerostich.com/search?ie=&site=my_collection&output=xml_no_dtd&client=my_collection&lr=&proxystylesheet=my_collection&oe=utf8&filter=0&getfields=productimage.productprice.productsku&restrict=Static&q=taillight
The large diameter unit is awesome.
-Ralph
On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 13:20:58 -0400
"Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25 amp
> Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering) I'm
> thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
>
> My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
> bulb).
>
> There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have the
> cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
> In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they have
> different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be saving
> some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights were
> on.
>
> Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
> suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is a
> 7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
> current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
>
> It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
> brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my system
> will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is on at
> once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the voltage.
> So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at 12 volts(
> or even a bit less) .
>
> Thanks
>
> Phil
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Try the new Live Search today!
> http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM=WLMTAG
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Wave power claiming pretty impressive power levels:
http://www.aboutmyplanet.com/alternative-energy/newest-alternative-energy-portugals-wave-power-plant
And mat I add, in honor of Ted Stevens, "IT'S A SERIES OF TUBES!"
Danny
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Quoting "Mark E. Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Hi,
> I advanced the timing on my Prestolite 4001 motor 8 degrees. Then I
> applied 6V (12V would be more pronounced) and with my uP hall effect RPM
> monitor measured 600rpm's in the forward (CCW when facing the motor front)
> direction and 540 in reverse. I drilled 1/2" CW to advance into the CCW
> direction on the bell end of the brush assembly, tapped 4 1/4-20 holes. I
> was going to go Jim's recommended 10 degrees but the brush holder screws
> bumped the housing at that point.
>
> So that's the easiest way to veify if your motor is advanced, it will spin
> faster in the preferred direction.
<Snipped for brevity>
Hi Mark,
This calls to mind a really cool visual demonstration that I participated in
over at Dennis Berubes shop a year or so ago. Bob Rice was in town visiting
and IIRC Rick Pryor was there too. Dennis had the side panels off a
welder/generator he was working on that had adjustable brush rigging. Hooked
up his load bank and an ammeter, fired up the engine and once it warmed up and
started running smoothly we loaded it and started playing with the
relationship between engine rpm, brush advance and output. Not that this is a
suprise but seeing it hands on really brought this home for us. It seems that
for each load/rpm there is a definate "sweet spot" for the advance. At 0
advance the brush arc was a bit fuzzy looking but pretty much what I have seen
before on motors. As I moved into the spot, the brushs and arc from brush to
comm started looking very smooth and consistant, the output would go up and
the engine would bear down. Past that point they would start arcing and the
arc would be very pronounced and erratic, output would go down and engine rpm
would rise. Then Dennis and I switched places and we watched the ammeter and
engine rpm while he altered the brush timing. Quite instructive. Regards,
David Chapman.
-------------------------------------------------
FastQ Communications
Providing Innovative Internet Solutions Since 1993
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I had regen on my old controller which I switch off, because I gain more
distance in coasting which may be up to three miles at times.
Anyway with coast down in my EV or ICE, but not coming to a stop, I may
touch the accelerator several times and I do not touch the mechanical
brakes until the last 100 feet or so if I want to stop.
If you have a regen circuit to the brake lights, these circuit could be
pulsing on and off the brake lights every time you released and touch the
accelerator causing that person behind you, saying, what is that idiot
doing.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
>
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Doug Weathers" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:10 AM
> Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
>
> > Maybe a mercury switch installed at just the right inclination would
> > work.
> >
> > Mike
> >
>
>
> The right inclination on a level surface is not the right inclination
> going up or down a grade...
>
> So your 'inclination' at level will in all likelihood turn on the brake
> light when going down a hill and maybe never turn on the brake light when
> going up a hill..
>
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steel packing bands are used to keep wooden crates together
when heavily loaded and (mis)treated in handling (dropping,
bumping and so on).
I have such a crate in my back yard, about 1ft high rim
with only 1 band around, it has been promoted to flower bed ;-)
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Storm Connors
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 9:39 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Battery boxes
Someone, perhaps Bob Brown, suggested putting steel
straps (packing bands) around the wooden boxes for
strength.
I spent the summer learning to weld and built the
boxes of sixteenth inch sheet metal.
storm
--- Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mike
>
> My battery boxes are made of fiberglass over
> plywood. The primary concerns are carrying the
> weight
> and surviving exposure to the electrolyte. I'm not
> concerned with keeping them warm in the winter
> but the box will be exposed to road salt and dirt. I
> have incorporated venting to remove H2 and
> hopefully supply cooling.
>
> How well will they work? I'll let you know.
>
> Dave Cover
>
> --- Michael Trefry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > What are the function of battery boxes/racks other
> than holding the
> > batteries in place? Why would a box cost over
> $2000? (box and rack set for
> > 914 at electroauto.com)
> >
> >
> >
> > I've seen sites mention making these from steel,
> aluminum, even wood. Why
> > not plastic or fiberglass to reduce weight?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike Trefry
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I cannot give a general statement because I have not tested all
lights that are out there, but the LED lights I have here
(white, not red) are starting to give some light around 6V
are pretty bright at 12V and I fear they burn short at 14V,
though the power draw shows it is still in spec.
I think they use 3 LEDs in series with a resistor to limit
the current to around 20 mA at 12V, still less than 30 mA
at 14V.
I think 30 mA is max LED current for the high brightness
LEDs, but if you need to know you better ask the supplier of
your LED to give the type of LED in his lights and you can
look up the specs...
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Phil Marino
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 10:21 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: LED brakelights
In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25 amp
Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering) I'm
thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
bulb).
There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have the
cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they have
different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be saving
some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights were
on.
Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is a
7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my system
will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is on at
once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the voltage.
So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at 12 volts(
or even a bit less) .
Thanks
Phil
_________________________________________________________________
Try the new Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM=WLM
TAG
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi!
In the process of leaning about (and then starting) restoration &
conversion of a Porsche 914, I met with several others that were doing the
same or interested in learning about the process.
So, I've created a Google Group specifically for this purpose:
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/914ev
If you're thinking of doing a 914-based(*) conversion, are in the process,
or have one thats up and running, or if you just want to listen in, I
invite you to join in! We'd love to hear from you!
The off-list discussion so far has been on the practical issues of
conversion, drivetrain selection, 914-specific restoration issues, and
914-specific battery mounting/rack issues, but I'm sure we'll branch out
in other areas, just like any other good list always does.
Steve
(*) Or any VW air-cooled, for that matter.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Boy have I had some experiences with the LED issue. It's a great idea
however not all replacements are made the same. I first tried the typical
truckstop / JC Whitney / AutoZone route as they have lots of bulbs for
replacement however the vast majority of the LED drop in replacement lamps
were either poor quality (twisted off at the neck when rotating in the
socket, limited viewing angle <30, not nearly bright enough AND overly
expensive. I have several trailers, box trucks etc and we experimented with
various brand LEDs. We found that the stock 1157 / 1156 bulbs work the best
when using the stock reflector/lense as the lense is what collects the
available direct light and focuses it to the rear of the fixture.
That said we were very happy with the LEDtronics lamps. They have more leds
per lamp and much higher brightness over the generic one in the market. It
doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize the dramatic difference in power
usage. The standard 1157 is 1200 hours and 2.1A at 12v the LEDtronics is
100,000 hours and 150mA. Difference in price is where you must decide is it
worth it. Stock 1157 ~ $0.75 and LED is $ 19.95.
I think the safety is worth it. All of our trailers now use LEDs because we
have added extra lights and needed the lower current draw for the towing
vehicle. The extra brightness was an added bonus. BUT only from the
LEDtronics lamps. SO buyer beware when buying at harbor freight or similar
retail shops.
Pedroman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 1:20 PM
Subject: LED brakelights
In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25 amp
Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering)
I'm thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
bulb).
There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have
the cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they have
different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be saving
some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights were
on.
Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is a
7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my
system will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is
on at once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the
voltage. So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at
12 volts( or even a bit less) .
Thanks
Phil
_________________________________________________________________
Try the new Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM=WLMTAG
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I currently use the 1157 style replacement bulbs in my s10 truck from
Ledtronics:
http://www.ledtronics.com/markets/auto_index.htm
The brake LEDs and the yellow turn signal LEDs are brighter than most
other standard vehicles bulbs on the road. I'm also using the reverse
LED replacement bulbs from them as well, but I do not think they are as
good as standard bulbs...
I have also replaced about 20 small bulbs in the instrument cluster with
replacement LED bulbs from Digikey. $1 - $2 a piece...
http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T063/1945.pdf
John Grigg
Phil Marino said:
------------------
In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25
amp
Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering)
I'm
thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
bulb).
There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have
the
cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they
have
different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be
saving
some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights
were
on.
Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is
a
7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my
system
will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is on at
once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the
voltage.
So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at 12
volts(
or even a bit less) .
Thanks
Phil
_________________________________________________________________
Try the new Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM
=WLMTAG
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Many drivers love to brake, even when the freeway is not busy
I see them zoom by, brake without anything in front of them,
accelerate, brake, rinse and repeat.
Coasting to a stop light gives me time to observe what other
drivers are doing and may brake lights flash several times before
the driver finally decides to engage the anchor.
Apparently they have their foot resting on the brake, or they
hesitate and move it back and forth between brake and accelerator
resulting in an irregular on/off flashing of the lights.
I have learned how to drive economically and can judge
pretty well at what distance I can release the accelerator
to coast down to the light and I can judge whether the
road is busy, so I better keep my speed up a bit and need
to brake when I reach the light if it has not turned green
yet, or if the road is quiet so I can coast down to a stop
without ever braking.
BTW, the original question started with people like Mike who
have increased the regen setting to a non-standard value such
that releasing the accelerator gives maximum braking force,
which normally is only achieved by pushing the brake halfway in.
Due to their abnormal setting, they have created this problem.
When keeping the regen to a normal setting, coasting down will
not be so abrupt that it needs brake lights as any car will
coast down when the accelerator is released, manual cars more
so than automatics.
I do not understand the brake-pedal-fobia that started the
request for brake lights on regen, as they normally do come on
when braking and the accelerator-release-regen is just to
simulate the engine drag that we are used to.
(Remember: create your EV so that it resembles any other car
which allows anybody to drive it without going through a training
as that will deter normal people from using the EV.)
Cranking the accelerator-regen up to maximum, such that it
suddenly becomes a DEceleration pedal (read: brake) is not
conform the operation of other cars and it creates problems
that do not exist if you keep the car in stock shape.
It also does not gain you anything as the max regen during
braking is activated *before* the friction brakes are engaged.
It may rob you of a little exercise (move your foot a few
inches over) but it does not gain.
In general, regen will gain you only a few percent anyway,
unless you have real steep hills on your route or you are
born with a lead foot.
Regards,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Roland Wiench
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 11:09 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
I had regen on my old controller which I switch off, because I gain more
distance in coasting which may be up to three miles at times.
Anyway with coast down in my EV or ICE, but not coming to a stop, I may
touch the accelerator several times and I do not touch the mechanical
brakes until the last 100 feet or so if I want to stop.
If you have a regen circuit to the brake lights, these circuit could be
pulsing on and off the brake lights every time you released and touch the
accelerator causing that person behind you, saying, what is that idiot
doing.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
>
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Doug Weathers" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:10 AM
> Subject: Re: Brake lights on regen
>
> > Maybe a mercury switch installed at just the right inclination would
> > work.
> >
> > Mike
> >
>
>
> The right inclination on a level surface is not the right inclination
> going up or down a grade...
>
> So your 'inclination' at level will in all likelihood turn on the brake
> light when going down a hill and maybe never turn on the brake light when
> going up a hill..
>
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
SAFETY
is the major reason to switch to LED brake lights.
Normal filaments take around 0.1 to heat up and give light
while the LEDs light up instantly.
This means that following vehicles (which SHOULD keep their
distance, right?) have 0.1 second more time to respond and
also start braking.
Since this time is taken off from the whole reaction process,
when they travel at high velocity, it can mean that they stop
several feet earlier when responding to LED lights than with
the same response time and using glow bulbs.
In short - a (small) percentage of light crashes is turned into
near-hits, a percentage of mild crashes is turned into fender
benders and some heavy crashes are turned into lighter crashes
as the vehicle travels at lower speed due to the earlier
reaction time.
Power saving is not a target of car companies, but better styling
and this safety issue is the main reason to go for LEDs.
Regards,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 10:58 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: LED brakelights
Boy have I had some experiences with the LED issue. It's a great idea
however not all replacements are made the same. I first tried the typical
truckstop / JC Whitney / AutoZone route as they have lots of bulbs for
replacement however the vast majority of the LED drop in replacement lamps
were either poor quality (twisted off at the neck when rotating in the
socket, limited viewing angle <30, not nearly bright enough AND overly
expensive. I have several trailers, box trucks etc and we experimented with
various brand LEDs. We found that the stock 1157 / 1156 bulbs work the best
when using the stock reflector/lense as the lense is what collects the
available direct light and focuses it to the rear of the fixture.
That said we were very happy with the LEDtronics lamps. They have more leds
per lamp and much higher brightness over the generic one in the market. It
doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize the dramatic difference in power
usage. The standard 1157 is 1200 hours and 2.1A at 12v the LEDtronics is
100,000 hours and 150mA. Difference in price is where you must decide is it
worth it. Stock 1157 ~ $0.75 and LED is $ 19.95.
I think the safety is worth it. All of our trailers now use LEDs because we
have added extra lights and needed the lower current draw for the towing
vehicle. The extra brightness was an added bonus. BUT only from the
LEDtronics lamps. SO buyer beware when buying at harbor freight or similar
retail shops.
Pedroman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 1:20 PM
Subject: LED brakelights
> In an effort to minimize my 12V draw ( especially since I'm using a 25 amp
> Sevcon, which is barely enough, with a small aux battery for buffering)
> I'm thinking about trying some LED brakelights.
>
> My current brakelights draw 5 amps ( for all three, including the upper
> bulb).
>
> There are several sellers of LED replacement bulbs ( Ebay seems to have
> the cheapest) but I wonder how bright they are.
> In my case, the brake lights are dual filament bulbs ( I guess they have
> different number of LEDs come on for each "filament") so I would be saving
> some 12V power (but very little) anytime the headlights and tailights were
> on.
>
> Does anyone have any experience with LED car bulbs, and any vendor
> suggestons? My particular bulb (typical for modern cars, I believe) is a
> 7443. None of the vendors talks about their current draw, or how the
> current is controlled ( resistors, constant current control, etc..).
>
> It seems to me a poorly ( or, cheaply) designed LED bulb might vary in
> brightness a lot between 13.5 and 12 volts. - and, occasionally, my
> system will probably be at about 12V for a short time when everything is
> on at once, the DC-DC is maxed out, and the aux battery is holding up the
> voltage. So, it could be a problem if the brightness drops dramatically at
> 12 volts( or even a bit less) .
>
> Thanks
>
> Phil
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Try the new Live Search today!
>
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&FORM=WLM
TAG
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
